What's Wrong with Hollywood Ep. 4: Todd A. Jackson
In the fourth episode of What's Wrong with Hollywood, I speak to multi-hyphenate filmmaker Todd A. Jackson, who co-founded QuickFlick TV [https://quickflicktv.com] and is producing / editing / starring in a new web series Unrequited, which can be found on the Penjot Media Group YouTube [https://www.youtube.com/@PenjotMedia] page.
In our full conversation, we cover:
🎭 Hollywood's creative brain drain - Why the industry is no longer run by creatives but by tech bros and money people, leading to a content wheel that prioritizes speed and generic output over artistic vision
🤖 Fighting AI with authenticity - How creators must lean into their "weirdness" and unique voice because that's the one thing AI can never replicate—your lived experience and personal rhythms
📺 The QuickFlick revolution - Building a streaming platform where audiences decide what gets renewed through a "produce or not produce" button, giving power back to viewers instead of algorithm-driven executives
✂️ Post-production as storytelling superpower - How documentary editing skills create "different beasts" who can splice together cohesive narratives from chaos and rewrite stories three times over
🚀 The Tyler Perry blueprint - Why independent filmmakers need to become their own studios and stop chasing perfection, because audiences want to see the trajectory, mistakes, and growth journey of authentic creators
Full Transcript Below:
Todd A. Jackson
Trying to bridge that gap from taking a show you created and pitching it and getting it picked up, it's not realistic anymore.
It's become a content wheel. It's what can we get out as quick as possible, as generic as possible, and just make money, because consistently you have people hating the stuff that's being put out, but showing up to watch it.
Hollywood has created perfection. There is no room for mistakes. There is no room for lines being fumbled. Everything is so polished, and that's the thing that I feel like people are going to want to see more of as AI takes over, they want to see the nuances. They want to see the mistakes. They want to see some of the low budget, they want to see oh, hey, they have a budget now. The writing's gotten better. They want to see that trajectory.
There is no place for us in this old Hollywood. And I think we can definitely take what's working, combine it with what we're doing, and that's going to be the future of where this industry goes.
Jon Stahl
Hi everyone. Welcome back to What's Wrong with Hollywood. Today we have joining us on the show, Todd A. Jackson who is a multihyphenate filmmaker who embodies the new generation of independent creators.
After graduating from SDSU with a Bachelor's in film and screenwriting, he founded his own video production company and built a YouTube following with Todd Foolery Productions. As co-founder and chief content officer of QuickFlick TV, Todd is working to democratize film distribution. His latest project, Unrequited showcases his range as a writer, director, producer, and star with expertise spanning post-production, podcasting, and music.
I would call Todd the perfect embodiment of the Greenlight Yourself movement. Thank you so much for joining us today, Todd, it's a real pleasure to have you here.
Todd A. Jackson
Thanks Jon. This is great. This is awesome.
Jon Stahl
Yeah. So I mean, I'll often start the episode with just a general question, like, what's wrong with Hollywood? But I would add to that, like what's, where are we now in Hollywood's trajectory and where do you see things going and how can it be improved?
Todd A. Jackson
Yeah. The one thing I keep coming back down to with what's wrong with Hollywood right now is that it's not run by the people that keep it running. Hollywood used to be run by the creatives. It used to be run by the people who wanted to produce art. I just feel like over the last 20 years, it was during the tech boom, I feel like people realized you could patent it, you could package it, and you could push out content, and I think that's what's happened with Hollywood right now is it's become a content wheel. It's what can we get out as quick as possible, as generic as possible, and just make money, because consistently you have people hating the stuff that's being put out, but showing up to watch it. So Hollywood has no reason to stop because we continue to perpetuate the cycle.
And honestly, what I really do feel like where the industry is going, and I truly do believe this, I believe Hollywood is going to separate into two different versions. You have the content, which is very similar to social media right now. You have content and you have art. And I really feel like eventually what's going to happen with Hollywood, they're going to get rid of all of the creatives. They're going to go to AI and they're just going to produce content, just mass produce content. And not to say there's not going to be people who aren't AI working in that cycle. You're going to have people who are going to be working in that cycle, but you're also going to have a new Hollywood that's going to be born from the creatives who take it back from this industry, who build a new version, and that's where we're at right now.
We're in this gray area where nobody knows what's going to happen. Everyone's throwing things at the wall trying to make it stick. But the one thing that I think unifies us is we all, all the creatives, especially the artists, hate what's happening right now.
There's not a single person I've met that is an artist and a creative that says Hollywood is great. It's the best it's ever been. The only people I know that are saying that are the studio heads, the execs, and the people behind the streaming money. Like that's the only thing. And so I really do feel like we are now creatives are now seeing how much power we have.
And we're going to start just creating our own Hollywood. And I think that's what we got to start doing right now, is creating this community within ourselves, stop competing with each other and team up and take down the real problem, which is the studios at the moment. And I really feel like that's the route we're going. And maybe I'm optimistic, but that's where I feel like we're going.
Jon Stahl
In a world where like AI is so prevalent. I guess this the near future that we're describing, which some would describe as dystopian, how do you stand out as a human being? Like what do you do to set yourself apart?
Todd A. Jackson
Yeah. I think, and this is what I feel like we all have as creatives. All the best creatives, the people that rise to the top the fastest do. And I think what AI is forcing most of us to do, at least for me, is I have to figure out who I am, like hardcore because that's the one thing that AI cannot replicate.
It cannot replicate my lived experience. It cannot replicate the rhythms in my voice the way that I speak. And what that's really forcing me to do is just be as weird, as unique, and as Todd as I can. Because that's really what's going to set me apart, because I've written a lot of things and I've gone back and written some of my work, and it's just like, where's the voice? Where is the Toddness of this? Where is the weirdness, the uniqueness of how I speak, the way that I see the world, and I think I'm using this moment right now with AI to really figure out who I am as an artist and create work that truly represents who I am.
And I think that's what we have to do in this landscape right now because it's getting scary. Like I've been trying to stay in AI so I know how to read through it and spot it, but it's getting harder and harder and it's only been six months. It's very wild to see how quickly it's just evolving.
Jon Stahl
Yeah, so speaking of the Toddness of it all. I'm jumping around a little bit in our question list, but like, tell me a little bit about Unrequited. Tell me about what you love about it. Tell me about the experience. Tell me about what's hard about it. Anything that you want to share. This is like a therapy session.
Todd A. Jackson
Yeah, well, so Unrequited is the new show that I just released on YouTube. I've been trying to work in the studio system for nearly a decade now. And not to say I haven't been successful, made great connections and worked with some amazing people, but trying to bridge that gap from taking a show you created and pitching it and getting it picked up, it's not realistic anymore.
And so when I got cast on this project, I actually was brought on as an actor initially. Which is odd because it was a non-paid role at the time. I refused to do any more non-paid roles, but apparently I submitted somehow and so I got latched onto it, and from the moment I met the director, I knew that this was a project I wanted to be a part of. Because when you meet people and you talk about projects, a lot of people don't have, they don't see the bigger picture. They see just the pilot and then that's it. They don't know where they're going from there. This director, the creator, he had a full on business plan for a year, and I was like, what?
And so immediately after that meeting was over, I asked, hey, how would you feel if I was attached as a producer before we even filmed anything? Like I believed in it that much. As I started working with it a little bit more, it is a black queer dramedy and so it was something I've never seen before and when I was cast into the role, he really gave me a lot of creative freedom with the character.
And I was able to make it my own. I was able to make it not a stereotype. I was able to make it me, I was able to just show up and be me, and he really embraced that. And so after that I really fell in love with it. And when we got the rough cut of the first episode, I realized that I was going to need to step in and take a shot at it. So I pitched that I would come on as a video editor because I do have that experience. I cut it together in about a week and we sat back and watched it and realized it was bigger than anything else.
And so we started working on it. We started putting it together, and then eventually we just decided we wanted to. We sent it to places, we talked to people. We did the whole route of creating a pitch deck. He works at a huge talent agency. That got us nothing. People there watched it, everyone loved it, but then it was, well that's great. So do you have anything else? And it was just like, oh, okay. Or it was, where's the rest of the season? And it was just like, okay.
So we decided to just publicly release it. We put it on YouTube. We had a full on marketing strategy. We went out, put up posters, handed out business cards with QR codes, talked it up. Reached out to festivals, reached out to interviews, podcasts, all that stuff. And we ended up getting 50K views in 30 days.
And that truly was wild. And so when we realized that and we got the feedback from the viewers, from the audience talking about wanting to see more, wanting to do it, we realized we built what we needed right there. If we needed to have proof that this is something that more people wanted to see, we decided to fully embrace that. And we decided to start pushing out the rest of the season.
And so, mind you, we're doing this with zero money. So we haven't crowdfunded, we haven't been financed in any way. It truly is whatever we have, whatever we can do, however we can put it together. Whoever can help us, I am producer slash script supervisor slash actor slash video editor. Whatever roles I can comfortably do, same thing with my producing partner, finding people. And things that can come on and not just do, we had, for example, we had someone come on who said was a PA and he ended up being sound and our AD and he was like, the first thing he said is, I've never AD'd before. And I was like, well, today's your first day you're going to do it and there's no pressure.
So I would say the biggest challenge has really just been, honestly, I think it's emotionally being able to consistently show up and put this together when there is no money we're getting back from it. There is no money we're putting into it. It truly is a labor of love. We have no idea what's going to happen, but believing in it so much and showing up every weekend or every day, honestly, because I'm creating clips, marketing it, reaching out to people, cold emailing people, continuously showing up for that.
And I think what was best for me was to find one project I was very passionate about and putting my everything into that. And so that's what I'm doing right now where I still have everything else. I have a freelance production company, so I'm doing that to make ends meet. I have the streaming platform I'm building as that's going. And with this, it really is, I really want people to know who I am. That's the best way to get myself out there and to get the money that I'm looking for. And if I can showcase who I am to this market of people who like the content I'm making and maximize that market, it's going to be a lot easier to take it mainstream. And so that's really what I'm trying to do now is like really make this goal a lot smaller so that way I can expand it as I go.
Jon Stahl
That's great. You come from the world of post-production. You have some post-production experience. You mentioned that, and I'd love to hear about how that experience has helped you in producing this. Like, feel free to get as technical as you want in the vision of the project and the storytelling mechanisms. Like how has being in post-production helped you see this vision come to life?
Todd A. Jackson
Yeah, I actually, I'm glad you asked that, just because I feel like it's a, so I come from marketing and I come from the documentary world when it comes to video editing. I actually didn't edit anything narrative until about, like four years ago, because I was so scared of doing it because it's a completely different beast.
So I come from, literally before influencers and mass creating content got cool, I was doing that. So we would, the first production company I worked for was called Hail Productions in San Diego. And what we did is we found influencers and we gave them 30 days of content in one day. So we would do photos, outfit changes, videos, all of that stuff. And then from there it cycled into doing documentary work. So taking two, three hours of footage and then trying to create a 10 minute story that's cohesive.
And what I noticed when I mastered that and I got really good at that, transitioning from the post-production, from that into narrative work made me a completely different beast because I'm able to see things a lot differently when you create.
When you have six hours of footage and you're told to review all of it and make a cohesive story, it changes your brain chemistry, like the way that I see things and the way that I pull things where I can, like for example, if I was editing this podcast, I would take half of a sentence that I said in the beginning, half of a sentence I said at the end, splice it together, drop a couple ands and buts randomly, and make it a cohesive sentence and make it its own story. And there's truly something that I like about that, where it's creating a story out of something that wasn't there.
And on top of that, this first production company I worked for, he was chaotic and insane in the best way. Like we would do stuff one day, and he was like, oh, it's due tomorrow, by the way, so I need you to take this hour of footage and turn it into a one minute sizzle reel tomorrow. And so it really, it was insane in the beginning, but after doing that for a year, I can look at something and say this needs to go here, this goes here, this does this, this does that.
And so when it came down to editing this project, the reason why I think we're so successful is because I come in with that mentality. I don't work at a 50% rate. When I look at something, I work at a hundred percent, like the first episode is about 15 minutes. It took me about a week to put together a rough cut and another three days to picture lock it. So it's like my rough cuts in my head are not rough cuts. My rough cut is a version that I would be comfortable putting out. And then once I get that done, picture lock is just fine tuning it and it's because of that experience where I was forced to edit things together as quick as possible.
When I come into something like this, it's completely different, but also it allows me to shift the story. So I do have the post-production background, but I do come from a directing standpoint. I come from a writing background. And so when I went into editing this, not only was I looking at it from a video editor standpoint, but I was redirecting it. I was like, does this beat make more sense here or should we shift it over here? Should we bring it over here? How about I take this sentence and have it be a voiceover for this? And it's like those thoughts, because of the documentary work and having such a non-linear, linear editing style and mentality, it created something new when I went into creating this narrative work.
So it's just like they do say, a project is written or redone three times it's written, then it's in post and then in post-production. And I think what makes a good video editor is being able to rewrite something if it's not working. Because you never know if it's going to show up the same way. And so I truly do think because I've had that experience, and having that post-production background, it has significantly helped me when it comes down to pumping out this content, which needs to be quality, which needs to have style, but also because we live in a world where studios can push out content and drop an entire season of something in one day, that's what people are used to. So being able to do that and show up quickly, but also be able to pump out clips and make editing and editing quickly that way too, that really helps us stand out with what we're doing at the moment.
Jon Stahl
Yeah. And I would love to hear about if there were any challenges involved in having, like being all of the things right? Any problems in distance? Like if you're on camera and you see yourself and you're also the director and you're also the editor, like who gets to make which decision at what point.
Todd A. Jackson
Yeah. There's a lot of checks and balances we have in this process. And especially with this project, the one thing that I did make a conscious choice, because I almost fell into this trap, is I didn't want to direct it. And there was part of me that was wanting to direct and wanting to say things on set. And I had to consciously pull myself back and say, you are here as the actor in this moment right now. You are here as the actor. If it doesn't relate to acting, don't say it. Or if it's very important, you need to figure out if it's something that needs to be said.
So that was the biggest thing for me, especially going into something where I was multihyphenate, because I am the producer. I am partially a writer. I am the actor. And I am definitely the head video editor. And especially when it comes down to editing yourself, you can be very biased. So it was very much my intention where I sat down with just my producing partner and we made it very clear what our roles and responsibilities were.
Because there was a period of time where we started writing the rest of the season and I read episode two and my immediate thing was change this, do this, do that, do. And it was just like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. First off, I'm not the writer. This isn't my story, and I need to set boundaries around that. And so that's when we had a discussion and I was like, I don't want to be involved with the writing. I don't even want to read the script until we have to go onto set and I have to perform it. I didn't want to have my mind going into that. Because like you said, it's easy to fall into those pitfalls and those traps of wanting to focus on only worrying about yourself in those situations or wanting it to only be your voice.
And I think that was a big thing that I wanted to make sure that it was felt fully collaborative, but also having that space and that boundary that allowed me to only show up as one person. Like even when I'm editing and I see myself performing, to me that is not the same person, that is the actual character and what's working best with this character. And I will choose it. And I'll tell you one of the hardest things, and maybe you know this because you have had to edit some of your stuff. One of the hardest things is to know that you made a weird face but it's the best take and you have to put it in there anyway. And you hated the way you said it, but it works and it's the best thing that you have to do. But it takes that separation to be able to say what is best for the story and what's best for the audience at this point.
Jon Stahl
I edit this podcast. That's exactly what I do.
Todd A. Jackson
Oh, it's like, why did one of my eyes blink? One of my eyes blinked, but the other one didn't.
Jon Stahl
Both eyes blink please. You're also co-founder and chief content officer of QuickFlick TV. Talk to me about where you see content development headed, development and distribution headed in five years, and where does Quick Flick fit into that?
Todd A. Jackson
Yeah, yeah. So what QuickFlick TV is, is it's a new streaming platform that will be launching this fall that targets a very niche market in filmmaking and gives them a home. So it's targeted towards independent web series creators. And honestly where that concept kind of came from was Issa Rae and Insecure, and the Awkward Black Girl. And so truly what that was, the reason, part of why it was so successful was because she was able to build an audience. She put it together, she had a space for it. And that's what HBO saw. They saw that built in audience, they saw that money right there. The amount of people that watched the show that were fans that could be transferred into to HBO.
And so essentially there's a market. If you look at independent web series online, there are tons, there are hundreds all over the place that are just popping up across the US. Canada has some really great ones. South Africa has some really great ones. There's some in the UK, Australia has a ton, and it's like these series live online but don't have an actual home. They're dispersed on Vimeo or YouTube, or you can find some of them on Amazon Prime, but there's not an actual home for them.
And so what QuickFlick TV is making a home for these web series creators where they can put these web series on there and they can actually stream it. Viewers can come there expecting it and wanting to see it. And what the best part is because when it comes down to it, when you look at Netflix, you look at HBO, I use this as an example. When I was talking about HBO and Issa Rae, an awkward black girl is: When it comes down to it, the viewers kind of dictate what they want to see. That's what we put out. That's what we should be putting out. And that's why it's become a meme where Netflix will cancel something that is performing well with the audience because the audience loves it. But if it doesn't have those numbers, then in their head there is no reason, there is no investment anymore.
A lot of these shows that are hits now became hits after three seasons in, and it's like if you're not given that chance to do that, then these shows aren't given the proper chance. And so you cancel them when there's an audience that's ready and willing to see more. And so that's one of the big things that QuickFlick TV is built on, it founded on is that these web series that live on the platform, it's the audience that gets to choose what they see more of. So if there's a web series that has six episodes but it's the top viewed web series on the platform. And similar to like YouTube's like and dislike QuickFlick TV will have a produce or not produce. And so if you select produce and it hits a viewership threshold and it has a bunch of fan base behind it and more people want to see it, then we will find the funding to produce more of that show.
And I think realistically, that's where the industry is going to go. I think we have streaming services right now, and then we have social media platforms. And both of them, when they first started, everyone thought they were stupid. And now look at where we are right now. We've literally swung back to cable. People socialize more on social media than they do in real life. And so what the key was to fuse those together. So fuse the streaming platform, fuse the social media platform and allow people to build a community on there, but also find where they can get content.
So really putting that together and give the power of what the people see to the viewers. Because they're the ones that are going to be dictating in any way. And I truly feel like going forward we're going to see a lot more of this independent filmmakers becoming their own production companies as I think it should be. Because when it comes down to IP and your original content and things like that, I think that's where we're heading. You saw, you see it with Ryan Coogler and Sinners. That was one of the things. Issa Rae doesn't necessarily have the rights to insecure. She had to sell that IP. And it's things like that. The IP is power and you have so many independent filmmakers that, I'm not going to say any names, but we have some independent filmmakers who do not make good content. They do not, I'm sorry. In a traditional sense, there's no storytelling. Visually it's not good, it's low budget, but they are making a living yearly. They are making enough money to survive just by making feature films per year because they have a fan base. And I think that's what the missed opportunity is, where sometimes independent filmmakers get too attached to perfection, and I think that's we have to get over that because that's what the Hollywood is doing.
Hollywood has created perfection. Hollywood is curated superhero movies curated to the summer blockbuster curated holiday movies, but it's all perfect. There is no room for mistakes. There is no room for lines being fumbled. Everything is so polished, and that's the thing that I feel like people are going to want to see more of as AI takes over, they want to see the nuances. They want to see the mistakes. They want to see some of the low budget, they want to see the increase from low budget to, oh, hey, they have a budget now. The writing's gotten better. Oh, the acting has gotten better. They want to see that trajectory.
They want to be part of that community. They want to see that growth. And because Hollywood has gatekept that so much, you can't see anything other than what they want to allow you to see. And we live in a world right now where authenticity is a buzz word is being your true, authentic self, being honest, communicating with your community, being open with them, having open dialogue, having live interactions and streams with them, and you can't do that and be polished and perfect at the same time. And I really do think as indie filmmakers, what we have to do is get away from everything being perfect because that's not what our audiences want see, they want to see, they want to be entertained, they want to have a connection to the work, and they want to be part of the development process.
And I think that's what I learned from being a YouTuber is that I could create as much content as I wanted, but if there was no one there to watch it and I wasn't interacting with them, that's when my channel started taking off. When I started asking questions, interacting with them, and things like that. That's how you build your true fans, and I think that's where the industry is heading. I think we as independent filmmakers, we have to start thinking as these studios. We have to be our own little studios, and those are the most successful filmmakers you see right now.
For example, like Tyler Perry. I will say, like, I don't watch his content. I know there's an audience for it, but one of the things I have to respect is Tyler Perry proved to the world that if he puts something somewhere, people will flock to it. A couple years ago when Tyler Perry had a contract with Netflix and started putting out a lot of original content. You would think the Netflix subscriptions were down at that time. They actually skyrocketed because he started creating content for Netflix, which is crazy that he has that much power. He just proved to the world that if he started his own streaming platform. He could take people from Netflix, from Hulu, from Amazon, and they would go to his platform. He just proved that, and I think that's the mentality we all need to go into the industry as, because you're not going to get discovered at a bank anymore. That I think that's how Charlize Theron was discovered. She was discovered because she was mad at a bank and someone said, you are a star.
That doesn't happen anymore. Even if you do get discovered, you get drained out of your followers and then tossed back out. And that just doesn't, you don't get discovered anymore. You have to discover yourself essentially.
Jon Stahl
That's terrific. I don't think there could be a better lesson to come out of this. I'd love to just wrap up by kind of asking where people can find the web series, learn more about quick flick, and hear about the kind of stuff that you're making.
Todd A. Jackson
Yeah, definitely. Right now, like I said, the platform will be launching this fall. So to see what we're doing and how we're making it, quickflicktv.com [http://quickflicktv.com] is the one place to go just to get some basic information on it. Right now, we're really going into finding investments, trying to find funding. It's all a really good idea, everyone loves it. The indie community loves it. The producers love it, the people we're pitching it to right now, it's just all about, again, like I said, people, it's funny, people don't invest in anything until you do all the work nowadays. So it's like we have to launch it, we got to put it out there and show them the actual audience and the analytics.
So QuickFlick TV is the best place to go there for that. We have a YouTube and Instagram right now. Unrequited the web series I was mentioning that's on YouTube. So we just premiered episode two, currently editing episode three right now. We're slated to have that launch next month, and like I said, we're also blitzing out the rest of the season next month with hopes of releasing those fairly quickly. So getting a huge quick turnaround time on those. And so that'll be on YouTube if you search for Pen Jot, which is P-E-N-J-O-T, Pen Jot Media Group. We're on YouTube. You can find it there. We also have another documentary called Into Sectional Lens. So we're really just trying to put out content. We're going to create a talk show to put on there. Really like embracing, honestly, like going into it, looking at it like, this is our channel. If this was a channel on cable, what would we produce? What would we put out? And it's like that, going into it with that mentality has really changed a lot of things and put a different spin on a lot of things.
And so you can find us there on YouTube, and then you can find me on Instagram at todd.alex. And stay up to date on all the stuff I'm doing there. Releasing things about QuickFlick TV, about Unrequited the series, and then going into like post services and stuff like that. Because I do genuinely feel, and this may be a little bit of a tangent I'm going off on, but right now, I think because you have so many independent artists, and nothing wrong with being self-taught and learning that yourself because I did go to film school, but I will confidently say I learned more outside of film school than I did in film school, because they definitely did teach me the old Hollywood way of doing things.
But I also, a big thing for me is like working with the community and like I said earlier, is I really think the only way we're going to succeed and take Hollywood back from the studio heads, from the tech bros, from the money people is by uniting and building our own different Hollywood. And so something that's going to been really big for me is I've just been studying how to create an effective web series, because it's very different from creating a TV show. It's very different from creating content. And so it's a certain writing style. It's a certain way that you have to tell the story, because a lot of the independent web series that are out right now, they lack a beginning, middle, and end. They lack conflict in each scene. They lack what is the purpose of telling the story? What is the like? They lack a lot of those fundamental things that I think there is a happy fusion between what Hollywood is doing right and what indie creators are doing right. And I think we shouldn't turn our backs on the studio just because they've blocked us out. There are some good fundamentals that they have there, and our key is that we got to take that, combine it with what we are doing and that's working, and then build from that.
And I think that's what I really am focused on doing now, is communicating networking. I've talked to so many independent web creators in the last six months. They're all over the place and it's just like we're all scattered. And I think if we can unite and come together and just really focus on building something new with Hollywood level, quality storytelling, Hollywood level, like quality acting and things like that, we would dominate it. And so that's really what I'm focusing on is like connecting and networking with people. And even if it's a conversation, I mean, that's how me and you connected is I saw what you were doing and I was like. He knows what he knows where we're going. We got to team up and see how we can all...
Jon Stahl
I hope so. I hope so.
Todd A. Jackson
Yeah. Yeah. And so, yeah, I think that's the biggest thing for me is just like all of us collectively coming together and just let's create our new Hollywood. There is no place for us in this old Hollywood. And I think we can definitely take what's working, combine it with what we're doing, and that's going to be the future of where this industry goes.
Jon Stahl
Terrific. Well, thank you so much, Todd, for taking the time and sitting down with me. And thank you everyone out there for listening to another episode. We will catch you on the next one. Thanks so much. Bye-bye.
Todd A. Jackson
Thank you. Thank you.
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