The Divided Soul: Heidi White on Duty, Desire, and the Prodigal Son

Doug McKelvey on Every Moment Holy, Prayer, & Finding God in Ordinary Life (Part 1 of 2)

'Reader's Digest Condensed' Show Notes Katie welcomes Every Moment Holy creator Doug McKelvey to discuss the surprising story behind one of the most beloved Christian book series of the past decade. Doug shares how a simple prayer written to help him focus on writing fiction eventually became Every Moment Holy, why Christians from many traditions have embraced written liturgies, and how ordinary moments — whether changing diapers or repairing a water heater — can become opportunities for worship. Together, Doug and Katie explore beauty, language, prayer, creativity, and what it means to believe that God is at work in every moment of everyday life. Unabridged Show Notes Katie sits down with author Doug McKelvey, creator of the bestselling Every Moment Holy series, to explore how written prayers can help Christians recognize God's presence in the ordinary moments of life. Doug shares his journey from a non-liturgical church background to discovering the beauty of historic prayers through The Book of Common Prayer. He explains why thoughtfully written prayers aren't a replacement for spontaneous prayer but a companion to it — often giving believers words when they don't know how to pray. The conversation traces the unexpected birth of Every Moment Holy, which began as a personal prayer during a season of creative frustration. Doug recounts how a simple conversation with Andrew Peterson quickly grew into a vision for a beautifully crafted book of liturgies covering everything from changing diapers to repairing a home. Along the way, Katie and Doug discuss creativity, storytelling, theology, and the importance of seeing every ordinary task within God's larger story of redemption. Doug also reflects on the overwhelming success of the series, why it has resonated across denominations, and how these prayers help reorient believers toward God's kingdom in everyday life. The episode concludes with Doug sharing the scripture that has sustained him throughout the writing process and a preview of Part 2, where he and Katie will discuss one of Doug's favorite classics. In This Episode Discovering liturgical prayer *  Growing up in a non-liturgical church  *  Encountering The Book of Common Prayer *  Why written prayers can strengthen personal prayer  The birth of Every Moment Holy *  A prayer written for fiction writers  *  Andrew Peterson's unexpected encouragement  *  How one prayer became an international bestseller  Finding God in ordinary life *  Why changing diapers and doing laundry matter  *  Seeing everyday work through the lens of eternity  *  Reframing ordinary tasks as acts of worship  Writing, creativity, and calling *  Doug's unfinished science fiction novel  *  Why artistic constraints can increase creativity  *  Trusting God with the work He's given us  Looking ahead *  The new Every Moment Holy Prayer Songs *  Preview of Part 2 of our conversation, where we'll discuss one of Doug's favorite classics Books Mentioned * Every Moment Holy — Doug McKelvey  * The Book of Common Prayer Who This Episode Is For *  Christians seeking a richer prayer life  *  Readers who love thoughtful Christian books  *  Writers, artists, and other creatives  *  Anyone who feels overwhelmed by ordinary responsibilities  *  Fans of The Rabbit Room and Andrew Peterson  Enjoying Oh My Word with Katie? * Would you consider leaving a rating and review on Apple Podcasts? Reviews help more readers discover thoughtful Christian conversations about books, faith, and the stories that shape us. * Follow @ohmywordpod on Facebook and Instagram for episode updates, book recommendations, and literary conversations. A Question to Reflect On What ordinary part of your daily routine might look different if you truly believed God was present in it?

The Divided Soul: Heidi White on Duty, Desire, and the Prodigal Son

'Reader's Digest Condensed' Show Notes Katie welcomes author, teacher, and Close Reads co-host Heidi White to discuss her book The Divided Soul: Duty and Desire in Literature and in Life. Together they explore why the tension between what we "ought" to do and what we "want" to do lies at the heart of both great literature and everyday Christian life. Heidi shares how Anne of Green Gables shaped her moral imagination, why the parable of the prodigal son became the framework for her book, and how stories help us understand the fractured human condition after the Fall. They discuss older-brother and younger-brother tendencies, the healing of desire, the role of joy in the Christian life, and why characters like Odysseus continue to resonate across centuries. Unabridged Show Notes Katie sits down with author, classical educator, therapist, and Close Reads co-host Heidi White to discuss The Divided Soul: Duty and Desire in Literature and in Life. Heidi shares the childhood reading experience that changed her life when she discovered Anne of Green Gables during a difficult season of grief and loneliness. Together, she and Katie explore how stories shape our moral imagination and why literature often forms character more deeply than rules alone. They discuss the central premise of The Divided Soul: that since the Fall, human beings have lived with a fracture between duty and desire. Drawing from the parable of the prodigal son, Heidi explains how both the younger brother's disordered desires and the older brother's joyless duty reveal different aspects of the same divided heart. The conversation ranges from psychology and spiritual formation to Homer and The Odyssey, examining how great stories illuminate the struggles of real life. Heidi also shares practical signs that we may be slipping into older-brother self-righteousness, why joy matters in the Christian life, and what it means to pursue the healing of a unified soul. Along the way, they discuss Anne Shirley, Odysseus and Penelope, Lonesome Dove, Christopher Nolan, classical education, and the enduring power of stories to help us understand ourselves and the world. In This Episode Reading, imagination, and formation *  How Anne of Green Gables changed Heidi's life  *  Literature as moral formation rather than mere entertainment  *  Why stories often shape us more deeply than rules  The divided soul *  The conflict between duty and desire after the Fall  *  The prodigal son as a framework for understanding human nature  *  Why both younger-brother and older-brother tendencies need healing  Duty, desire, and everyday life *  Recognizing self-righteousness and resentment  *  The danger of joyless duty  *  Recovering rightly ordered desire  The Odyssey and the harmonious soul *  Why Odysseus serves as a powerful literary example  *  Temptation, perseverance, and the longing for home  *  Thoughts on modern adaptations of classic stories  Books, stories, and the Christian imagination *  Why great literature remains relevant  *  Reading as a way of understanding ourselves  *  How stories reveal spiritual realities  Books and Authors Mentioned * The Divided Soul - Heidi White  * Anne of Green Gables - L.M. Montgomery  * Little House on the Prairie - Laura Ingalls Wilder  * The Odyssey - Homer  * Lonesome Dove - Larry McMurtry  * The Feast - Margaret Kennedy  Who This Episode Is For *  Readers who love classic literature  *  Fans of Close Reads and literary podcasts  *  Christians interested in spiritual formation  *  Teachers, homeschoolers, and classical educators  *  Anyone wrestling with duty, desire, burnout, temptation, or joy  Enjoying Oh My Word with Katie? * Would you consider leaving a rating and review on Apple Podcasts? Reviews help more readers discover thoughtful Christian conversations about books, faith, and the stories that shape us. * Follow @ohmywordpod on Facebook and Instagram for episode updates and bookish content. A Question to Reflect On When have you felt the tension between what you "wanted" to do and what you knew you "ought" to do — and what helped bring those two desires back into alignment?

Matthew Clark on Tolkien, Grief, Beauty, and The Well Trilogy

The ‘Reader’s Digest Condensed’ show notes Katie welcomes Mississippi singer-songwriter and author Matthew Clark to discuss The Well Trilogy — a sweeping project of albums and companion essay collections inspired by the woman at the well, faithfulness in exile, and the hope of Christ’s return. Together they explore Tolkien, creativity, grief, collaboration, The Rabbit Room, and why paying loving attention to God and the world around us may be one of the most important spiritual disciplines we’ve lost. Unabridged show notes Katie sits down with Mississippi-based singer-songwriter and author Matthew Clark to discuss The Well Trilogy — three albums paired with collections of reflective essays exploring healing, faithfulness, beauty, and the restoration of all things. Matthew shares how growing up surrounded by music, visual art, and storytelling shaped his imagination, and why Tolkien became one of the earliest literary worlds that truly captured his heart. They discuss the origins of Only the Lover Sings, the first volume in the trilogy, which emerged during a long season of grief and healing after divorce. Matthew explains how the story of the woman at the well became a spiritual “habitat” he returned to again and again — and how the trilogy gradually expanded into meditations on exile, endurance, and the return of Christ. Katie and Matthew also explore the importance of collaboration in the creative process, the influence of communities like The Rabbit Room and the C.S. Lewis Foundation, and why personal essays and creative nonfiction can become powerful companions for people walking through suffering. Throughout the conversation, they reflect on leisure, contemplation, beauty, and the idea that we most fully discover ourselves when we are seen and loved by God and others. In this episode Growing up surrounded by creativity *  Matthew’s artistic family background  *  Learning guitar through one hilariously surprising riff *  Why early success matters when learning an instrument  Tolkien, imagination, and literary influence *  Growing up immersed in Middle Earth  *  Tolkien’s idea of “escape” and why it matters  *  The influence of Josef Pieper’s Only the Lover Sings The origins of The Well Trilogy *  How the woman at the well became central to Matthew’s spiritual journey  *  Writing through grief, loneliness, and healing  *  Why each album became paired with a collection of essays  Creativity and collaboration *  Learning to invite others into the creative process  *  Working with essayists, editors, and visual artists  *  The role of communities like The Rabbit Room and The Cultivating Project  Faithfulness in exile *  The themes behind A Tale of Two Trees *  Psalm 137 and learning to “keep singing”  *  Hope, despair, and the promise of restoration  Beauty, contemplation, and paying attention *  Recovering the true meaning of leisure  *  “Beholding” as a spiritual practice  *  Why art and stories matter for Christian culture-making  Books and authors mentioned * The Lord of the Rings and The Hobbit — J.R.R. Tolkien * Only the Lover Sings — Josef Pieper * Culture Making: Recovering Our Creative Calling — Andy Crouch * Galahad and the Grail — Malcolm Guite * King Arthur and His Knights of the Round Table — Roger Lancelyn Green Who this episode is for *  Readers who love contemplative Christian nonfiction  *  Fans of Tolkien, The Rabbit Room, and faith-infused art  *  Christians walking through grief, loss, or spiritual exhaustion  *  Songwriters, artists, and creatives navigating calling and collaboration  *  Anyone longing for beauty, hope, and deeper attention to God  Enjoying Oh My Word with Katie? * Would you consider leaving a rating and/or review on Apple Podcasts to help more people discover the show? * Share this episode with a friend who loves books, music, or thoughtful Christian conversations. * Follow @ohmywordpod on Facebook and Instagram for more bookish content and episode updates! A question to reflect on: What is a Bible story that you have "lived in" for a season (or maybe you're in it now), and how did God meet you there?

Jamie Ogle on Female Gladiators, the Early Church, and 'Daughter of the Rebellion'

The 'Reader’s Digest Condensed' show notes Katie welcomes historical fiction author Jamie Ogle to discuss Daughter of the Rebellion, her new novel set in the final days of the Western Roman Empire. Together they explore the fascinating history behind the Visigoths and gladiators, the stories that shaped Jamie’s faith and imagination, and how themes of redemption, sacrifice, and the sanctity of life emerged unexpectedly while writing the book. Unabridged show notes Katie sits down with award-winning author Jamie Ogle to talk about her newest novel, Daughter of the Rebellion — an epic story of Visigoth captives, female gladiators, faith, and redemption in fourth-century Rome. Jamie shares how growing up with missionary biographies, family storytelling, and classics like Little House on the Prairie sparked both her love of history and her desire to tell meaningful stories. They discuss her unexpected journey from wanting to become a missionary to discovering that God had called her to write stories instead — stories that explore the faith, sacrifice, and perseverance of the early church. Jamie also dives into the real history behind Daughter of the Rebellion, including the Visigoths’ conflict with Rome, the surprising realities of gladiator culture, and the fascinating historical figure woven into the novel. Throughout the conversation, they explore how God renewed Jamie’s joy in writing, why themes of human dignity emerged naturally in the story, and how historical fiction can illuminate timeless truths about faith and courage. In this episode A childhood shaped by stories *  Learning to love history through real people’s experiences  From missionary dreams to writing novels *  Why Jamie originally wanted to become a missionary  *  Discovering that storytelling was at the heart of her calling  Writing in the Roman Empire *  How researching St. Valentine inspired Jamie’s first novel  *  Why the early church and late Roman Empire fascinate her  The world of Daughter of the Rebellion *  The real history behind the Visigoths and Alaric  *  Female gladiators and the surprising realities of gladiator combat  *  Creating Adel, Felix, and the historical figure Telemachus (don't Google him till you've read the book!) Faith, joy, and the writing process *  How God renewed Jamie’s joy in writing after burnout  *  Discovering a story’s deeper meaning after the writing process unfolds  Books mentioned * Ben-Hur — Lew Wallace  * The Hobbit — J.R.R. Tolkien  * Little House on the Prairie — Laura Ingalls Wilder  * Belle of Chatham — Laura Frantz  * The Hiding Place — Corrie ten Boom  * The Hobbit — J.R.R. Tolkien Who this episode is for *  Readers who love Christian historical fiction  *  Fans of ancient Rome, gladiators, and church history  *  Writers navigating calling, creativity, and burnout  *  Christians interested in stories of courage, sacrifice, and redemption  Enjoying Oh My Word with Katie? * Would you consider leaving a rating and/or review on Apple Podcasts to help more people discover the show? * Share this episode with a friend who loves books, history, or thoughtful Christian conversations. * Follow @ohmywordpod on Facebook and Instagram for more bookish content and episode updates! A question to reflect on: What stories — whether from history, literature, or your own life — have most shaped your faith?

Writing Through Hard Stories and Finding God in the Process: Sherye Green

The 'Reader’s Digest Condensed' show notes Katie welcomes Mississippi author Sherye Green to discuss a lifetime of storytelling — from teaching history and writing nonfiction on topics like World War II and veteran suicide, to completing her fiction trilogy, The Timothy House Chronicles. Together, they explore how faith shapes storytelling, what it looks like to write through hardship, and the surprising ways God shows up in both real-life stories and the creative process. Unabridged show notes Katie sits down with Sherye Green — author, former teacher, and lifelong lover of stories — for a wide-ranging conversation about writing, faith, and perseverance. Sherye shares how her love of literature began in childhood through hearing Bible stories, classics, and mythology read aloud, and how that early foundation shaped both her faith and her calling as a writer. They discuss her unique career path — from corporate communications to teaching history and criminal justice — and how writing has been a constant thread throughout every season of her life. Sherye also dives into her fiction trilogy, The Timothy House Chronicles, a story rooted in grief, healing, and learning to trust God in the aftermath of deep loss. Alongside that, she reflects on her nonfiction work, including telling the powerful true story of a World War II refugee marked by both suffering and providence. Throughout the conversation, they explore what it means to write as a Christian with both conviction and humility — and how God often meets us right in the middle of the work. In this episode A life shaped by stories *  Growing up on Bible stories, classics, and mythology  *  Early influences like Little Women From teaching to writing *  Writing curriculum, publications, and original courses  *  How storytelling carried through every career stage  The Timothy House Chronicles *  Writing about grief, trauma, and healing  *  Faith in the midst of life’s hardest seasons  Nonfiction and real-life stories *  Telling a World War II refugee’s story  *  Recognizing God’s hand in history  Faith and the writing process *  Learning to balance humility and conviction  *  “Creative downloads” and moments of unexpected inspiration  Writers and works that inspire * Theo of Golden *  The Mitford series by Jan Karon  * The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe Books mentioned * Little Women — Louisa May Alcott  * Theo of Golden — Allen Levi  *  The Mitford Series — Jan Karon  * The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe — C. S. Lewis  Who this episode is for *  Readers who love meaningful, faith-driven stories  *  Writers navigating calling, creativity, and perseverance  *  Christians interested in how God works through storytelling  *  Anyone walking through hardship and looking for hope  Enjoying Oh My Word with Katie? * Would you consider leaving a rating and/or review on Apple Podcasts to help more people discover the show? * Share this episode with a friend who loves books and thoughtful conversations. * Follow @ohmywordpod on Facebook and Instagram for more bookish content! A question to reflect on: Where have you seen God at work in your own story—even in the difficult chapters?