The Humane Economy Under Fire: 10 Years Later | Episode 91

The End of Horse-Drawn Carriages? New York City’s Historic Choice | Episode 93

Two recent deaths—a carriage horse named Deniz and an 18-year-old tourist named Romanch Mahajan—have reignited one of New York City's longest-running animal welfare debates. As momentum builds to end horse-drawn carriage rides in Manhattan, host Joseph Grove sits down with two of the movement's leading voices to discuss what may be the industry's defining moment. For generations, horse-drawn carriages have been one of New York City's most recognizable attractions, carrying millions of tourists through Central Park beneath the Manhattan skyline. Supporters call them a cherished tradition. Critics see something very different: horses forced to navigate one of the busiest and most chaotic urban environments in the world. Now, two recent tragedies have transformed a long-running debate into a defining moment. In this episode of The Animal Wellness Podcast, host Joseph Grove examines the growing movement to end New York City's horse-drawn carriage industry and the legislation that could finally bring it to a close. Joining the program are Wayne Pacelle, president of the Center for a Humane Economy and Animal Wellness Action, and Edita Birnkrant, executive director of NYCLASS, one of the nation's leading organizations working to end the use of carriage horses in New York City. Together they discuss the deaths of Deniz, a carriage horse who died after consuming poisonous Japanese yew leaves, and Romanch Mahajan, the 18-year-old tourist killed after a carriage horse bolted through Central Park. They examine how those tragedies have reshaped public opinion, accelerated political momentum, and placed Intro. 943—the bill to phase out horse-drawn carriage rides—closer to passage than ever before. The conversation explores: • Why horse-drawn carriages remain one of New York City's most controversial animal-welfare issues. • What carriage horses experience every day on Manhattan's crowded streets. • Why decades of regulation have failed to prevent accidents involving both horses and people. • The misconceptions surrounding the care and treatment of carriage horses. • What would happen to the horses if Intro. 943 becomes law. • Whether New York City could become the catalyst for ending horse-drawn carriage rides in other cities. • How this campaign fits into the broader movement to improve protections for horses, including efforts to end horse slaughter. Edita Birnkrant also reflects on nearly two decades of advocacy and what it would mean personally to see New York finally retire its carriage horses after years of public education, political organizing, and legislative work. Whether you're interested in animal welfare, public policy, urban history, or the future of horses in America, this episode provides an inside look at one of the nation's most consequential animal-protection campaigns—and why many believe New York City now stands at a historic crossroads. Guests Wayne Pacelle President, Center for a Humane Economy and Animal Wellness Action Edita Birnkrant Executive Director, NYCLASS Learn More Animal Wellness Action https://www.animalwellnessaction.org [https://www.animalwellnessaction.org/] Center for a Humane Economy https://www.centerforahumaneeconomy.org [https://www.centerforahumaneeconomy.org/] NYCLASS https://www.nyclass.org [https://www.nyclass.org/] "Horses Deserve Better" https://animalwellnessaction.org/horses-deserve-better/ [https://animalwellnessaction.org/horses-deserve-better/] Subscribe If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe, leave a review, and share it with friends and colleagues. Your support helps us continue bringing you conversations about the people, policies, and campaigns advancing animal protection around the world. The Animal Wellness Podcast is produced by Animal Wellness Action and the Center for a Humane Economy. The show explores the people, policies, and campaigns working to improve the lives of animals in the United States and around the world through legislation, corporate reform, and public engagement. Hosted by veteran journalist and animal advocate Joseph Grove. Follow Us Websites • https://www.animalwellnessaction.org [https://www.animalwellnessaction.org/] • https://www.centerforahumaneeconomy.org [https://www.centerforahumaneeconomy.org/] Facebook • https://www.facebook.com/AnimalWellnessAction [https://www.facebook.com/AnimalWellnessAction] • https://www.facebook.com/centerforahumaneeconomy [https://www.facebook.com/centerforahumaneeconomy] X • https://twitter.com/AWAction_News [https://twitter.com/AWAction_News] • https://twitter.com/TheHumaneCenter [https://twitter.com/TheHumaneCenter] Instagram • https://www.instagram.com/animalwellnessaction [https://www.instagram.com/animalwellnessaction] • https://www.instagram.com/centerforahumaneeconomy [https://www.instagram.com/centerforahumaneeconomy] LinkedIn • https://www.linkedin.com/company/animal-wellness-action [https://www.linkedin.com/company/animal-wellness-action] YouTube • https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCI_6FxM4hD6oS5VSUwsCnNQ [https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCI_6FxM4hD6oS5VSUwsCnNQ]

Kangaroos Win the World Cup | Episode 92

For decades, the world’s top soccer players laced up boots made from the skins of wild kangaroos. Manufacturers claimed kangaroo leather offered unmatched performance, and millions of kangaroos were commercially killed across Australia each year to supply the global athletic footwear industry. That story has changed dramatically. In this episode of the Animal Wellness Podcast, host Joseph Grove examines one of the most successful corporate animal-protection campaigns of recent years: the effort to eliminate kangaroo leather from elite soccer. Joining the program are Wayne Pacelle, president of the Center for a Humane Economy, and Ryan Luterman-Sevel, director of social media and the campaign’s resident numbers guy. Ryan’s detailed research tracked every player at the 2026 FIFA World Cup, documenting which boots they wore throughout the tournament. The results were striking. Just four years after kangaroo leather was already beginning to decline, only one player initially appeared to be wearing kangaroo-leather boots at the 2026 World Cup—and by the tournament’s later rounds, even that player had switched to synthetic footwear. The conversation explores: * Why kangaroo leather became the industry standard for elite soccer boots. * How synthetic materials now outperform traditional leather in many respects. * The six-year Kangaroos Are Not Shoes campaign and the strategy behind it. * Why major brands including Nike, adidas, Puma, New Balance, ASICS, Mizuno and Diadora moved away from kangaroo leather. * How consumer pressure, corporate engagement and legislative advocacy combined to change an entire marketplace. * What the disappearance of kangaroo leather at the World Cup means for wildlife conservation and animal welfare. * What lessons this campaign offers for future efforts to replace animal-derived products with humane alternatives. The episode also discusses the science of modern performance materials, the myths surrounding kangaroo leather, and how sustained advocacy can produce measurable, global change—even within industries long considered resistant to reform. Whether you’re a soccer fan, an advocate for wildlife, or simply interested in how campaigns influence major corporations, this episode offers an inside look at how persistence, data and strategic advocacy helped transform one of the world’s most recognizable sporting traditions. Guests Wayne Pacelle President, Center for a Humane Economy and Animal Wellness Action Ryan Luterman-Sevel Director of Social Media, Center for a Humane Economy and Animal Wellness Action Learn More * Center for a Humane Economy [http://www.centerforahumaneeconomy.org/] * Animal Wellness Action [http://www.animalwellnessaction.org/] * Kangaroos Are Not Shoes campaign [http://www.kangaroosarentshoes.org/] Subscribe If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe, leave a review, and share it with friends and colleagues. Your support helps us continue bringing you conversations about the people and campaigns advancing animal protection around the world. The Animal Wellness podcast is produced by Animal Wellness Action [http://www.animalwellnessaction.org/] and the Center for a Humane Economy [http://www.centerforahumaneeconomy.org/]. It focuses on improving the lives of animals in the United States and abroad through legislation and by influencing businesses to create a more humane economy. The show is hosted by veteran journalist and animal-advocate Joseph Grove [https://www.linkedin.com/in/josephgrove/].    www.animalwellnessaction.org [http://www.animalwellnessaction.org/] www.centerforahumaneeconomy.org [http://www.centerforahumaneeconomy.org/]   Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/AnimalWellnessAction [https://www.facebook.com/AnimalWellnessAction] Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/centerforahumaneeconomy/ [https://www.facebook.com/centerforahumaneeconomy/] Twitter: https://twitter.com/AWAction_News [https://twitter.com/AWAction_News] Twitter: https://twitter.com/TheHumaneCenter [https://twitter.com/TheHumaneCenter]   Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/animalwellnessaction/ [https://www.instagram.com/animalwellnessaction/] Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/centerforahumaneeconomy/ [https://www.instagram.com/centerforahumaneeconomy/] LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/animal-wellness-action/ [https://www.linkedin.com/company/animal-wellness-action/]    YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCI_6FxM4hD6oS5VSUwsCnNQ [https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCI_6FxM4hD6oS5VSUwsCnNQ]

The Ridglan Rescue: 1,500 Beagles, a Broken System, and the Fight to End Animal Testing | Episode 92

What began as one of the largest dog rescue efforts in American history may become a turning point in the movement to end animal testing. In this special episode of the Animal Wellness Podcast, host Joseph Grove takes listeners inside the remarkable rescue of approximately 1,500 beagles from Ridglan Farms in Wisconsin, a commercial breeding facility that supplied dogs for laboratory experimentation. Drawn from a record-setting national webinar, this episode features the voices of the people who helped make the rescue possible — including advocates, rescuers, policymakers, and public figures who are now working to ensure fewer animals ever enter laboratories in the first place. You'll hear from: • Wayne Pacelle, president of the Center for a Humane Economy and Animal Wellness Action • Shannon Keith, founder of the Beagle Freedom Project Congressman Nick Langworthy of New York • Debbie Gibson, pop legend and actress • Geezer Butler of Black Sabbath • Stacy Kivowitz, chair of Animal Wellness Action • Muriel Van Hoosen, chair of the Center for a Humane Economy Together, they explore the rescue itself, the challenges of rehabilitating animals who have never experienced normal life, and the growing scientific and political movement to replace outdated animal testing with modern technologies. This episode examines: • The inside story of the Ridglan beagle rescue • What life was like for dogs bred for laboratory experimentation • The enormous logistics of moving and rehoming 1,500 animals • Why animal testing remains embedded in federal policy • New technologies that could replace animal experimentation • The bipartisan effort to modernize testing requirements • What advocates are doing now to prevent future generations of animals from entering laboratories The rescue of these beagles captured national attention. But as our guests make clear, the larger mission is just beginning. Listen now to hear how compassion, science, and public policy are converging to challenge a system that has remained largely unchanged for decades. Take action! Visit this link today [https://act.centerforahumaneeconomy.org/a/che-fda-modernization-act-3] to tell your elected officials in Washington that you want an end to the use of taxpayer dollars spent on tests on dogs and cats. Subscribe, rate, and share the Animal Wellness Podcast to help amplify the movement for a more humane future. The Animal Wellness podcast is produced by Animal Wellness Action [http://www.animalwellnessaction.org/] and the Center for a Humane Economy [http://www.centerforahumaneeconomy.org/]. It focuses on improving the lives of animals in the United States and abroad through legislation and by influencing businesses to create a more humane economy. The show is hosted by veteran journalist and animal-advocate Joseph Grove [https://www.linkedin.com/in/josephgrove/].  ABOUT www.animalwellnessaction.org [http://www.animalwellnessaction.org/] www.centerforahumaneeconomy.org [http://www.centerforahumaneeconomy.org/] Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/AnimalWellnessAction [https://www.facebook.com/AnimalWellnessAction] Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/centerforahumaneeconomy/ [https://www.facebook.com/centerforahumaneeconomy/] Twitter: https://twitter.com/AWAction_News [https://twitter.com/AWAction_News] Twitter: https://twitter.com/TheHumaneCenter [https://twitter.com/TheHumaneCenter] Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/animalwellnessaction/ [https://www.instagram.com/animalwellnessaction/] Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/centerforahumaneeconomy/ [https://www.instagram.com/centerforahumaneeconomy/] LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/animal-wellness-action/ [https://www.linkedin.com/company/animal-wellness-action/]  YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCI_6FxM4hD6oS5VSUwsCnNQ [https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCI_6FxM4hD6oS5VSUwsCnNQ]

The Humane Economy Under Fire: 10 Years Later | Episode 91

Ten years ago, Wayne Pacelle, head of Animal Wellness Action and the Center for a Humane Economy, made a disruptive case in “The Humane Economy: How Innovators and Enlightened Consumers Are Transforming the Lives of Animals.” He argued that the biggest gains for animals would come not just from laws, but from the marketplace—through corporate pressure, consumer demand, and economic incentives.   Today, that vision is being tested in a far more adversarial landscape.   In this episode, host Joseph Grove speaks with Pacelle about the state of the “humane economy” amid intensifying political and corporate pushback. While companies have made high-profile commitments on cage-free systems and alternatives to animal testing, powerful industry interests are now working to unwind those gains.   At the center of the fight: federal efforts to override state laws like California’s Prop 12 and Massachusetts’ Question 3—voter-approved measures designed to curb extreme confinement of farm animals. These battles raise a critical question: can market-driven progress endure when political forces intervene to reverse it?   They discuss:   * The growing backlash against animal welfare laws in Congress * Corporate follow-through—and where companies are retreating * The role of multinational corporations and consolidation in shaping outcomes * Whether consumers are driving change—or being priced out of it * Breakthroughs in plant-based innovation and non-animal testing * Why voluntary corporate action has limits—and where regulation is indispensable   Pacelle also addresses a central tension: if the humane economy is working, why are we seeing such aggressive efforts to dismantle its gains?   This is a candid, high-stakes conversation about power, policy, and the future of animal protection in an era of competing economic interests.   The Animal Wellness podcast is produced by Animal Wellness Action [http://www.animalwellnessaction.org/] and the Center for a Humane Economy [http://www.centerforahumaneeconomy.org/]. It focuses on improving the lives of animals in the United States and abroad through legislation and by influencing businesses to create a more humane economy. The show is hosted by veteran journalist and animal-advocate Joseph Grove [https://www.linkedin.com/in/josephgrove/].   www.animalwellnessaction.org [http://www.animalwellnessaction.org/] www.centerforahumaneeconomy.org [http://www.centerforahumaneeconomy.org/]   Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/AnimalWellnessAction [https://www.facebook.com/AnimalWellnessAction] Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/centerforahumaneeconomy/ [https://www.facebook.com/centerforahumaneeconomy/] Twitter: https://twitter.com/AWAction_News [https://twitter.com/AWAction_News] Twitter: https://twitter.com/TheHumaneCenter [https://twitter.com/TheHumaneCenter]   Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/animalwellnessaction/ [https://www.instagram.com/animalwellnessaction/] Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/centerforahumaneeconomy/ [https://www.instagram.com/centerforahumaneeconomy/] LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/animal-wellness-action/ [https://www.linkedin.com/company/animal-wellness-action/]    YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCI_6FxM4hD6oS5VSUwsCnNQ [https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCI_6FxM4hD6oS5VSUwsCnNQ]

Rethinking Human Exceptionalism | Episode 90

What if the idea that humans stand above all other animals isn’t a scientific truth—but a cultural myth?   In this episode of the Animal Wellness Podcast, host Joseph Grove is joined by primatologist and NYU professor Christine Webb, author of “The Arrogant Ape: The Myth of Human Exceptionalism and Why It Matters,” for a wide-ranging conversation about how deeply ingrained beliefs about human superiority shape our relationship with animals—and the consequences of getting that relationship wrong.   Drawing on her research into the cognitive, emotional, and social lives of nonhuman animals, Webb challenges the notion that humans are categorically different from other species. Instead, she makes the case for “continuity”—the idea that differences between humans and other animals are differences of degree, not kind.   Together, they explore:   * How anthropocentric thinking shapes science, language, and culture * Why the belief in human superiority persists—even in the face of evidence * What we gain—ethically and existentially—by rethinking our place in the natural world   If we are to build a more humane and sustainable future, it may begin with a simple but profound shift: seeing ourselves not above the animal world, but within it.   LEARN MORE The Arrogant Ape: The Myth of Human Exceptionalism and Why It Matters is available for purchase here [https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/the-arrogant-ape-christine-webb/1146839124?ean=9780593543139] and wherever books are sold. To learn more about Christine Webb, visit her website here [https://www.cewebb.com/].   The Animal Wellness podcast is produced by Animal Wellness Action [http://www.animalwellnessaction.org/] and the Center for a Humane Economy [http://www.centerforahumaneeconomy.org/]. It focuses on improving the lives of animals in the United States and abroad through legislation and by influencing businesses to create a more humane economy. The show is hosted by veteran journalist and animal-advocate Joseph Grove [https://www.linkedin.com/in/josephgrove/].    www.animalwellnessaction.org [http://www.animalwellnessaction.org/] www.centerforahumaneeconomy.org [http://www.centerforahumaneeconomy.org/]   Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/AnimalWellnessAction [https://www.facebook.com/AnimalWellnessAction] Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/centerforahumaneeconomy/ [https://www.facebook.com/centerforahumaneeconomy/] Twitter: https://twitter.com/AWAction_News [https://twitter.com/AWAction_News] Twitter: https://twitter.com/TheHumaneCenter [https://twitter.com/TheHumaneCenter]   Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/animalwellnessaction/ [https://www.instagram.com/animalwellnessaction/] Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/centerforahumaneeconomy/ [https://www.instagram.com/centerforahumaneeconomy/] LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/animal-wellness-action/ [https://www.linkedin.com/company/animal-wellness-action/]    YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCI_6FxM4hD6oS5VSUwsCnNQ [https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCI_6FxM4hD6oS5VSUwsCnNQ]