Thoughts on Change: How to herd humans without losing your mind

Episode 12 - Kata & TWI Summit Reflections

51 min · 28. maj 2026
episode Episode 12 - Kata & TWI Summit Reflections cover

Beskrivelse

What actually makes change stick? Is it: * the tool?  * the process?  * the storyboard?  * the training?  Or is it something much deeper? In this episode of Thoughts on Change, I sit down with Mark Rosenthal and Laurel Martin to unpack one of the biggest challenges in Continuous Improvement: Why organizations can implement Lean tools… and still struggle to create lasting behavior change. And honestly? This conversation gets to the heart of what real change leadership actually looks like.   What We Explore We dig into: * why psychological safety matters in Continuous Improvement  * how leaders unintentionally reinforce the wrong behaviors  * why curiosity is more powerful than blame  * the difference between compliance and genuine engagement  * how Kata and TWI are often misunderstood as “tools” instead of leadership development systems  * what it really means to “integrate, not implement”  * why unresolved disagreement at the leadership level quietly kills transformation efforts  * and how sustainable culture change happens through repeated responses—not presentations    One of My Favorite Moments One of the strongest themes in this conversation is this shift: Instead of asking: “How do we get people to comply?” What if we asked: “What kind of response are we reinforcing?” Because every leadership reaction teaches people something. When leaders respond with: * blame  * defensiveness  * pressure  * control  People learn to: * hide problems  * avoid risk  * stay quiet  * protect themselves  But when leaders respond with: * curiosity  * experimentation  * safety  * learning  People begin to think differently. And that’s where culture shifts.   The Power of the First Reaction We also talk about how important those first few seconds are when something goes wrong. That moment when: * a standard isn’t followed  * an experiment fails  * someone raises a concern  * resistance appears  Your first reaction matters more than you think. Because leaders are constantly teaching people: ·       what is safe ·       what gets punished ·       what gets rewarded ·       and what kinds of thinking are welcome   Compliance vs Commitment One of the biggest takeaways from this episode: Compliance is not the same thing as commitment. If your change effort depends entirely on: * convincing harder  * presenting more data  * pushing people toward agreement  You may get short-term compliance… …but not real ownership. Real teamwork requires: * trust  * safety  * involvement  * and genuine alignment    A Powerful Reframe One line from the conversation that really stuck with me: “Integrate, don’t implement.” Because sustainable change doesn’t happen when we drop a Lean tool into an organization and hope people use it. It happens when: * people understand it  * it fits their context  * it solves a meaningful problem  * and leaders reinforce the behaviors needed to sustain it    What This Means for CI Leaders If you work in: * Continuous Improvement  * Operational Excellence  * Lean leadership  * manufacturing leadership  * culture transformation  * organizational change  This episode is a reminder that your real job isn’t installing tools. It’s shaping: * systems  * responses  * behaviors  * and learning environments    Reflection Questions As you listen, think about: * What behaviors are being reinforced in my organization right now?  * How do leaders respond when problems surface?  * Are we building compliance… or capability?  * What reactions are unintentionally creating fear or defensiveness?  * Are we integrating improvement into culture—or just implementing tools?    The Big Takeaway Sustainable change is not about: ·       installing a storyboard ·       running a workshop ·       forcing agreement It’s about intentionally shaping how people think, respond, learn, and engage over time. That’s the real work.   Connect with the Guests This episode features insights from: * Mark Rosenthal  [https://www.linkedin.com/in/markrosenthal/?skipRedirect=true] * Laurel Martin  [https://www.linkedin.com/in/laurelhmartin/] Both bring deep experience in Lean thinking, leadership development, Kata, and organizational learning.   Enjoying the Podcast? If you’re trying to move culture instead of just install tools, hit subscribe and share this with another CI warrior who’s navigating the messy human side of change. Video [https://youtu.be/55mdKA4vg7Q]

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Alle episoder

13 episoder

episode Episode 13 - Just Because It's a Problem Doesn't Mean You Should Solve It cover

Episode 13 - Just Because It's a Problem Doesn't Mean You Should Solve It

Change efforts don't usually fail because they're bad ideas. They fail because they're buried under noise. As Continuous Improvement leaders, we see problems everywhere. We spot waste, inefficiencies, bottlenecks, and opportunities that others miss. But one of the hardest lessons to learn is that not every problem needs to be solved right now. In this episode, we continue the C.H.A.N.G.E. Shaper™ series by unpacking the third characteristic: Advocate for What Matters Because advocacy isn't about pushing harder, selling your ideas better, or convincing people you're right. It's about helping people see what truly matters and connecting improvement efforts to the outcomes the organization needs most. The Hidden Trap for CI Leaders Most CI professionals are naturally drawn to solving problems. The challenge is that organizations rarely suffer from a lack of problems to solve. They suffer from a lack of focus. When every opportunity becomes a priority, teams become overwhelmed, leaders become distracted, and improvement efforts lose momentum. Advocacy is the ability to cut through the noise and answer one critical question: What problem do we need to solve right now? Not what problem we can solve. Not what problem we want to solve. What problem will have the greatest impact on the goals the organization is trying to achieve? What You'll Learn In this episode, you'll learn: • why advocacy is about alignment and clarity rather than persuasion • how to connect frontline problems to strategic business goals • practical questions to uncover the barriers preventing progress • why not every improvement opportunity deserves immediate attention • how to translate CI-speak into ValueSpeak™ so leaders understand the impact • what to do when leadership still says "no" Connecting Strategy to Reality Organizations often communicate strategy through high-level objectives: "Increase EBITDA." "Improve labor productivity." "Reduce costs." But those goals rarely mean much to the people doing the work every day. This is where CI leaders create value. Your role is to connect the organization's strategic goals to the real frustrations, obstacles, and problems people experience on the front line. When leaders can see how frontline issues impact business results—and frontline teams can see how their daily challenges connect to organizational goals—clarity begins to emerge. That's advocacy. Questions That Help You Find What Matters When you're trying to connect strategy to improvement work, ask questions like: • What conditions need to exist for us to achieve this goal? • What would have to be true for this to happen? • What currently prevents us from reaching this target? That final question often reveals the real barriers standing in the way of progress. From there, your job becomes identifying which problems matter most and validating them with data. Because data has a way of cutting through assumptions and helping people focus on reality. Learning to Say "Not Right Now" One of the most difficult parts of advocacy is deciding what not to work on. Some problems are real. Some opportunities are valuable. But not all of them are the highest priority. Advocating for what matters sometimes means helping people understand that a problem will not be solved today—not because it isn't important, but because something else is more important right now. Remember: You're not saying "No." You're saying "Not right now." And that focus is often what allows organizations to make meaningful progress. Translating CI-Speak into ValueSpeak™ One of the biggest challenges CI leaders face is communicating upward. We often present problems through the language of process improvement while senior leaders are listening through the language of business outcomes. Leaders want to understand: • How much money will this save? • How will this improve productivity? • What business result will this affect? • How does this support our strategic objectives? The stronger your ability to translate problems into ValueSpeak™, the easier it becomes to build support and create alignment. Reflection Questions Think about a change effort you're leading right now and ask yourself: • What truly matters in this change effort? • Have I clearly explained why it matters—in their language? • What does the organization need us to solve right now? • What can we say "not right now" to so we can focus? • Where am I avoiding advocacy because it feels uncomfortable? The Shift Advocacy gives change structure. It helps organizations focus their attention, energy, and resources on the problems that will create the greatest impact. Without advocacy, change becomes scattered. With advocacy, change becomes purposeful. And that's where real results begin. What's Next? Next up in the C.H.A.N.G.E. Shaper™ series: Navigate the Business Environment Because even the best ideas struggle when you don't understand how decisions actually get made. Want More Support? Most of the women I work with aren't struggling because they lack knowledge, skill, or good ideas. They're struggling because they can't get those ideas heard, understood, and acted upon. They're stuck between leadership priorities and frontline realities, trying to create change without the influence they need. That's exactly what we work through inside Credible. Heard. Used. It's a 5-month development program designed specifically for Continuous Improvement leaders who want to build credibility, increase influence, and get their ideas used. You'll find more information in the link below. Video [https://youtu.be/9hZEyGf4ne4] Links ValueSpeak™ Quick Translation Guide [https://www.kellymallery.com/_files/ugd/37d85e_5f59f9a552a34d5d974882a99bd494c2.pdf] Credible. Heard. Used. [https://www.kellymallery.com/credibleheardused] Thoughts on Change Page [https://www.kellymallery.com/thoughtsonchange]

I går16 min
episode Episode 12 - Kata & TWI Summit Reflections cover

Episode 12 - Kata & TWI Summit Reflections

What actually makes change stick? Is it: * the tool?  * the process?  * the storyboard?  * the training?  Or is it something much deeper? In this episode of Thoughts on Change, I sit down with Mark Rosenthal and Laurel Martin to unpack one of the biggest challenges in Continuous Improvement: Why organizations can implement Lean tools… and still struggle to create lasting behavior change. And honestly? This conversation gets to the heart of what real change leadership actually looks like.   What We Explore We dig into: * why psychological safety matters in Continuous Improvement  * how leaders unintentionally reinforce the wrong behaviors  * why curiosity is more powerful than blame  * the difference between compliance and genuine engagement  * how Kata and TWI are often misunderstood as “tools” instead of leadership development systems  * what it really means to “integrate, not implement”  * why unresolved disagreement at the leadership level quietly kills transformation efforts  * and how sustainable culture change happens through repeated responses—not presentations    One of My Favorite Moments One of the strongest themes in this conversation is this shift: Instead of asking: “How do we get people to comply?” What if we asked: “What kind of response are we reinforcing?” Because every leadership reaction teaches people something. When leaders respond with: * blame  * defensiveness  * pressure  * control  People learn to: * hide problems  * avoid risk  * stay quiet  * protect themselves  But when leaders respond with: * curiosity  * experimentation  * safety  * learning  People begin to think differently. And that’s where culture shifts.   The Power of the First Reaction We also talk about how important those first few seconds are when something goes wrong. That moment when: * a standard isn’t followed  * an experiment fails  * someone raises a concern  * resistance appears  Your first reaction matters more than you think. Because leaders are constantly teaching people: ·       what is safe ·       what gets punished ·       what gets rewarded ·       and what kinds of thinking are welcome   Compliance vs Commitment One of the biggest takeaways from this episode: Compliance is not the same thing as commitment. If your change effort depends entirely on: * convincing harder  * presenting more data  * pushing people toward agreement  You may get short-term compliance… …but not real ownership. Real teamwork requires: * trust  * safety  * involvement  * and genuine alignment    A Powerful Reframe One line from the conversation that really stuck with me: “Integrate, don’t implement.” Because sustainable change doesn’t happen when we drop a Lean tool into an organization and hope people use it. It happens when: * people understand it  * it fits their context  * it solves a meaningful problem  * and leaders reinforce the behaviors needed to sustain it    What This Means for CI Leaders If you work in: * Continuous Improvement  * Operational Excellence  * Lean leadership  * manufacturing leadership  * culture transformation  * organizational change  This episode is a reminder that your real job isn’t installing tools. It’s shaping: * systems  * responses  * behaviors  * and learning environments    Reflection Questions As you listen, think about: * What behaviors are being reinforced in my organization right now?  * How do leaders respond when problems surface?  * Are we building compliance… or capability?  * What reactions are unintentionally creating fear or defensiveness?  * Are we integrating improvement into culture—or just implementing tools?    The Big Takeaway Sustainable change is not about: ·       installing a storyboard ·       running a workshop ·       forcing agreement It’s about intentionally shaping how people think, respond, learn, and engage over time. That’s the real work.   Connect with the Guests This episode features insights from: * Mark Rosenthal  [https://www.linkedin.com/in/markrosenthal/?skipRedirect=true] * Laurel Martin  [https://www.linkedin.com/in/laurelhmartin/] Both bring deep experience in Lean thinking, leadership development, Kata, and organizational learning.   Enjoying the Podcast? If you’re trying to move culture instead of just install tools, hit subscribe and share this with another CI warrior who’s navigating the messy human side of change. Video [https://youtu.be/55mdKA4vg7Q]

28. maj 202651 min
episode Episode 11 - Are you overhelping your team? Helping with intention in CI. cover

Episode 11 - Are you overhelping your team? Helping with intention in CI.

If you work in CI, helping probably feels like second nature. In fact, it’s probably one of the reasons you got into this work in the first place. But here’s the uncomfortable question we’re digging into today: Is your helping actually helping? There’s a fine line between helping people grow and accidentally creating dependence. And if you cross that line, your help can quietly become harmful—for them and for you. The Hidden Trap for CI Leaders Many of us in CI become the scheduler, organizer, reminder system, problem solver, answer machine. At first, that support may be necessary. But over time? You can unintentionally train teams to rely on you instead of building their own capability. That’s when frustration grows, burnout starts creeping in, resistance increases, and you become the bottleneck in the very change you’re trying to create. What You’ll Learn In this episode, we continue the C.H.A.N.G.E. Shaper™ series by unpacking the second characteristic: Help with Intention You’ll learn: * the difference between helpful help and hurtful help * how overhelping creates dependency in teams * how to recognize when you’ve crossed the “helpful line” * practical ways to step back without abandoning people * how boundaries can actually increase your credibility and respect The Vicious Cycle of Overhelping Overhelping creates a pattern that looks like this: You step in to help: → people depend on you → you become overwhelmed → frustration builds → resistance increases → burnout follows. Helping with Intention Looks Different Helping with intention does not mean abandoning people, withholding support, or saying “figure it out yourself”. It means being intentional about what support they actually need, what capability they need to build next, and how you can help them grow without becoming dependent on you. Powerful Questions to Ask Instead of Giving Answers One of the biggest shifts? Moving from answering to asking. Some favorite coaching questions from the episode: * “What problem are you trying to solve?” * “What do you already know about that?” * “How could you find that out?” * “Who else might know more about this?” * “How could you test your understanding?” Sometimes giving the answer quickly is just another form of doing the work for them. And as uncomfortable as it can feel, stepping back may actually be the most supportive thing you can do. Reflection Questions Think about a current project or team you’re supporting. Ask yourself: * Where am I stepping in too quickly? * Who am I unintentionally training to depend on me? * Am I helping because it’s best for them… or because it feels safer for me? * What question could I ask instead of giving the answer? The Shift Helping with intention shifts you: from hero to leader. That’s where sustainable change starts to happen. What’s Next Next up in the C.H.A.N.G.E. Shaper™ series: Advocating for What Is Really Important In noisy organizations, helping people improve isn’t enough—you also need to know how to connect change to what truly matters. Want More Support? Most of the women I work with aren’t struggling because they lack knowledge or skill. They’re struggling because their approach isn’t landing the way they think it is. They’re overhelping and overexplaining. And exhausting themselves trying to create change. That’s exactly what we work through inside Credible. Heard. Used. You’ll find more information here [https://www.kellymallery.com/credibleheardused] Video [https://youtu.be/LNG3rv53kbU]

14. maj 202612 min
episode Episode 10 - Stop Treating People Like Projects: The Real Secret to Influence in CI cover

Episode 10 - Stop Treating People Like Projects: The Real Secret to Influence in CI

If you’re struggling to get engagement with your change efforts, there’s a good chance the problem isn’t their resistance… …it’s your lack of connection. I know—this one can sting a little. In Continuous Improvement, we’re trained to focus on tools, systems, and results. But the truth is, none of those things work without people. And when we stop seeing people as people—and start seeing them as the means to get our change implemented—we unintentionally invite the very resistance we’re trying to avoid. In this episode, we kick off the C.H.A.N.G.E. Shaper™ series with the foundation of everything:  Connecting with curiosity and compassion. And no—this is not “soft stuff.” This is skilled work. This is influence. This is what makes change actually stick. What You’ll Learn * Why pushing harder often creates more resistance  * What it really means to “connect” (without oversharing or crossing boundaries)  * The 3 simple steps to connect with people in real time:   1: Read the room, 2: Meet people where they are, 3: Ask permission before diving into change  * How curiosity helps you avoid assumptions and actually understand what’s going on  * Why compassion doesn’t mean agreeing—it means understanding  * How resistance is often rooted in fear and uncertainty (not defiance)  The Shift When you lead change without connection, people feel: * managed  * pushed  * overlooked  When you lead with curiosity and compassion, people feel: * seen  * respected  * willing to engage  And that shift? That’s where credibility starts to build. Try This Think about a change you’re working on right now. Now think about one person you need on board. Ask yourself: * Did I actually connect with them as a person?  * Did I read the room before jumping in?  * Did I ask for permission—or just push forward?  * Did I come in curious… or already convinced I knew the answer?  * Did I make them feel understood—or dismissed?  No judgment here. Just awareness. Because awareness is where better choices start. Key Reminder Connection is not soft work.  It’s skilled work. And it’s where real influence—and real change—begins. What’s Next In the next episode, we’ll build on this foundation and talk about the second characteristic of a C.H.A.N.G.E. Shaper™: Helping with intention — and why the way you help might actually be slowing people down. Want More Support? If this episode had you thinking, “Wow… I’ve definitely been there,” you’re not alone. I’m opening up a small group experience for women in Continuous Improvement: Credible. Heard. Used. This is for you if: * Your ideas aren’t landing the way you intend  * You’re feeling resistance and not sure why  * You want to influence without pushing harder  Check out the link below.   00:00 Engagement Isn’t the Problem 00:57 Meet the CHANGE Shaper 01:54 Why Connection Matters 04:08 Three Steps to Connect 06:57 Example Conversation With Kim 08:56 Curiosity Builds Clarity 12:12 Compassion Isn’t Caving 14:45 Reflect and Apply Today 16:31 Wrap Up and What’s Next 16:57 Program Invite and Closing   Links: https://www.kellymallery.com/changeshaper [https://www.kellymallery.com/changeshaper] https://www.kellymallery.com/credibleheardused [https://www.kellymallery.com/credibleheardused] Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v

1. maj 202618 min
episode Episode 9 - Herding Humans, a new way to lead change cover

Episode 9 - Herding Humans, a new way to lead change

In this episode of “Thoughts on Change,” Kelly proposes a shift from pushing change to “shaping what’s possible” through credibility and influence. She defines a “change shaper” as someone who shows up effectively when resistance appears, regardless of title, and outlines six characteristics: connect with curiosity and compassion to create safety; help with intention to build others’ capability without rescuing; advocate for what truly matters by linking change to purpose, values, and priorities; navigate the business environment by understanding pressures, informal networks, and organizational politics while translating between leaders and frontline teams; get the right people involved rather than convincing everyone; and energize positive momentum by celebrating small wins and highlighting progress. She emphasizes practice over perfection and previews deeper future episodes. 00:00 Why Change Pushes Back 00:33 Meet Thoughts on Change 01:02 Becoming a Change Shaper 02:20 Connect with Curiosity 03:21 Help with Intention 04:03 Advocate What Matters 04:43 Navigate Business Politics 05:38 Get the Right People 06:19 Energize Momentum 06:56 Practice Over Perfection 07:20 Wrap Up and Next Steps   Links: https://youtu.be/yjrXy_0Z2Xc https://www.kellymallery.com/changeshaper

16. apr. 20268 min