"Developing Austin" with Perry Lorenz

"Developing Austin" with Perry Lorenz

"Developing Austin" with Perry Lorenz "We all got liberal arts degrees, and a whole lot of my friends are, you know, are casualties in one way or another. Either, either drug casualties or lifestyle casualties, and never quite made it through school, although that's the reason that they came to Austin. And again, it was so inexpensive… People weren't having to work three jobs to figure out how to pay for their school. Student debt, what the hell is student debt? I mean, nobody I knew graduated with student debt. So it was just a completely different scene… and it was just a liberal bastion." (Perry Lorenz) Perry Lorenz has been at the center of Austin's transformation for nearly six decades, from printing underground comics in San Francisco, to developing some of downtown Austin's most iconic real estate. In this conversation with co-hosts, Eddie Wilson and Dr. Jason Mellard, Perry traces his unlikely journey from University of Texas student and counterculture participant, to one of the city's most consequential developers, reflecting on what Austin gained and lost along the way. Content Warning: adult themes Content created during the global pandemic, in the room, and on Zoom. Chapters: 01:30 - Coming to Austin in 1966; feeling "born" in Austin 02:00 - UT culture: liberal arts, no fraternities, no business school 02:43 - Visiting San Francisco, discovering the underground comix scene 03:05 - Joining the Ripoff Press as production manager 05:00 - Returning to Austin; entering the car business 05:30 - Downtown Austin in the late '70s: ignored, owner-financed, no banks 08:40 - The true story of the Rainey Street rezoning 10:00 - The shift from planned high-rises to a bar district; owners ultimately profiting 11:18 - Soap Creek Saloon's opening night bartender, tequila Wednesdays 13:00 - George Majeski making the worst of enemies get along 14:00 - Appearing in Texas Chainsaw Massacre; cooking on opening night at Pecan Street Cafe 15:50 - The Independent ("Jenga Tower") 16:15 - The Nocona at 9th & Lamar with Robert Barnstone 17:00 - Ann Richards' support; proving the downtown condo market 18:03 - East Austin condo development; the railroad land; Larry Warshaw 21:25 - UT in the '60s & '70s: open admissions, cheap tuition, student culture 23:10 - Cambodia protests; marching on the Capitol; Austin's liberal identity 24:00 - Working with Dave Moriarty in San Francisco; the warehouse culture with Jerry Garcia and Angela Davis 25:00 - Working alongside Gilbert Shelton, printing the Fabulous Furry Freak Brothers 26:00 - Printing for Robert Crumb, Spain Rodriguez, Dave Sheridan 28:08 - The Convention Center relocation story: Suzanne Cannon's idea; Larry Speck's scoring matrix; convincing the city council. 31:15 - West 33rd Street: hippie houses, Joe Long, motorcycles indoors 32:50 - Reflections on Austin's change: "it was better 18 months before you got here"; history as ongoing Follow us on Instagram and on Facebook, at @Threadgills AND Check out our store here and collect our gear: https://Threadgills.com/merch Guest: Perry Lorenz - Principal of Constructive Ventures, participant in early underground comix movement, community commissioner, and decades-long figure in Austin downtown development. Production Team: Host, Eddie Wilson - Armadillo World Headquarters founder @Threadgills Host, Dr. Jason Mellard - Cultural historian @jasondeanmellard Editor, Renee O'Connor Music Mixing, Matt Carlson @axemanguitar Producer, Renee O'Connor @realreneeoconnor Producer, Sandra Wilson @sandrawilson709 Executive Producer, TSSI Music by Jake Andrews Music @jakeandrewsmusic Production assistant, Miles Muir @miles_muir Production consultant, Katey Psencik

"Outstanding Stories in the Criminal Legal System" with Dick Deguerin

"Outstanding Stories in the Criminal Legal System" with Dick DeGuerin "Well, I accept a lot of cases. Basically, my criteria is something that needs to be challenging. So you get some tough cases that way, and if you get the reputation for trying tough cases, people come to you. Growing up, I was younger than all my classmates…and I was smaller. But what I learned was the law and the rules of evidence…great equalizer…In the hands of someone that knows the law, you're as big as anybody in the courtroom." (Dick DeGuerin) This episode of Austin Roots features Dick DeGuerin, a legendary Houston-based criminal defense attorney with deep Austin roots. Raised in the city and educated at UT Law, Dick shares wide-ranging stories spanning his college days, legal career, famous cases, and lifelong love of Texas music. The conversation begins with memories of 1960s Austin, fraternity life, underground rock and roll radio (KTXN), the Ranger humor magazine, and colorful campus characters like Frank Irwin and "Daddyo" (Bill Whitliff). Dick recalls early encounters with Kinky Friedman and the Terrytown scene. The discussion shifts to his legal career: his time at the Harris County DA's office, then 12 years under legendary attorney Percy Foreman, who mentored him through high-stakes criminal cases. Dick explains his philosophy of taking on seemingly unwinnable cases, as exemplified by the Robert Durst trial in Galveston, and his representation of Billy Joe Shaver. A standout segment covers his direct involvement in the 1993 Waco siege, where he entered the Branch Davidian compound multiple times as David Koresh's attorney, offering a rare ground-level perspective on the standoff and ATF's use of force. Throughout, Dick weaves in his passion for Texas music, playing ukulele and guitar since childhood, friendships with Guy Clark, Terry Allen, Billy Joe Shaver, and Jimmy Dale Gilmore, and his New Year's gatherings in Marfa. Content Warning: adult themes Content created during the global pandemic, in the room, and on Zoom. Chapters: 01:04 - University of Texas in the '60s: Fraternity life, booking bands, Dave McNeely 01:47 - Underground rock and roll radio: KTXN 02:10 - Lavada Durst Jr. and the fraternity party scene 06:43 - A high school epiphany, Tarrytown, and a close call with a plainclothes cop 10:01 - Percy Foreman: mentorship and the DA's office 10:21 - Learning from Percy: trying capital cases in his early 30s 15:51 - Taking "unwinnable" cases; how the Robert Durst trial in Galveston proved the strategy 18:16 - Representing Billy Joe Shaver and quoting his lyrics in closing argument 20:38 - Guy Clark, black diamond strings, and a life in Texas music 24:28 - The Armadillo World Headquarters: Dick's memories of Eddie and the scene 26:25 - Waco & the Branch Davidians: the call that started it all 26:30 - Inside the compound: a firsthand account Follow us on Instagram and on Facebook, at @Threadgills AND Check out our store here and collect our gear: https://Threadgills.com/merch Guest List: Dick DeGuerin, one of the most storied criminal defense attorneys in Texas history. Production Team: Host, Eddie Wilson - Armadillo World Headquarters founder @Threadgills Host, Dr. Jason Mellard - Cultural historian @jasondeanmellard Editor, Renee O'Connor Music Mixing, Matt Carlson @axemanguitar Producer, Renee O'Connor @realreneeoconnor Producer, Sandra Wilson @sandrawilson709 Executive Producer, TSSI Music by Jake Andrews Music @jakeandrewsmusic Production assistant, Miles Muir @miles_muir Production consultant, Katey Psencik

"Music Journaling" with Kevin Curtin

"Music Journaling" with Kevin Curtin "The Austin Chronicle, it's just like, is so fiercely loyal to the local scene and willingly ignores opportunities to interview national artists in favor of a local artist. I think that means something in terms of where we put the quality of the people in our community in comparison to people in the national picture. You know, we wanna treat them on the same level, and I think it's important, you know?" (Kevin Curtin, 2021) This episode of Austin Roots features Kevin Curtin, music journalist at the Austin Chronicle, in conversation with hosts Eddie Wilson and Dr. Jason Mellard. They trace Austin's music ecosystem from the Armadillo World Headquarters era to the present, exploring how venues, journalism, visual art, and community identity have shaped the city's culture. Topics range from Kevin's origins as a hitchhiker/camper-dweller who broke into music writing, to the legacy of the Chronicle's music column, the East Austin blues tradition, the modern psychedelic revival, and the challenges of preserving a vibrant scene amid rapid growth. Content Warning: adult themes Content created during the global pandemic, in the room, and on Zoom. Chapters: 02:00 - Hitchhiking to Austin in 2006, living in a camper, working at Planet K head shop 03:00 - How he wore down veteran journalist Margaret Moser to get his first writing opportunity 04:00 - Transition from musician identity to writer identity; attending 300+ shows/year 06:00 - Eddie's recollection of recognizing Kevin's "enthusiastic potential" 08:00 - The Austin Chronicle's 40+ year lineage; only 7 people have written music news column 10:00 - Chronicle's unique position as a "dedicated press corps" for the local scene 12:00 - Austin clubs having strong personal identities, traced back to the Armadillo 17:00 - Armadillo's diversity of programming out of financial necessity 18:00 - Word-of-mouth impact spread by touring national acts (Van Morrison, ZZ Top stories) 22:00 - Community trust in venue operators as cultural stewards 25:00 - Red River District History 27:00 - Eddie's restaurant "Raw Deal" and the area's early club history 30:00 - Bill Campbell as a legendary, press-shy Austin figure 33:00 - Austin's blues through-line from the East Side to Antone's to Gary Clark Jr. 35:00 - Austin's "boomtown" growth over the past 12 years 36:00 - Multiple distinct scenes coexisting: garage, honky-tonk, hip-hop, blues, psychedelic 38:00 - The modern psychedelic revival (Black Angels, Austin Psych Fest/Levitation) 39:00 - Tommy Hall's prescient belief that his music would endure 41:00 - Physical print vs. digital — the Chronicle's commitment to the printed artifact 43:00 - How Kevin uses video/social media to surface local and legacy artists 44:00 - Chronicle as a pipeline for young writers; optimism about the future of music journalism 46:00 - The value of telling stories of lesser-known contributors to the scene 49:00 - Gilbert Shelton and Jim Franklin's roles in establishing Austin's concert poster culture 57:00 - Clifford Antone and the blues scene 1:00 - Modern venue operators (Dennis Larkins: White Horse, Sagebrush) as successors Follow us on Instagram and on Facebook, at @Threadgills AND Check out our store here and collect our gear: https://Threadgills.com/merch Guest: Kevin Curtin - artist, writer, and music journalist at the Austin Chronicle Production Team: Host, Eddie Wilson - Armadillo World Headquarters founder @Threadgills Host, Dr. Jason Mellard - Cultural historian @jasondeanmellard Editor, Renee O'Connor Music Mixing, Matt Carlson @axemanguitar Producer, Renee O'Connor @realreneeoconnor Producer, Sandra Wilson @sandrawilson709 Executive Producer, TSSI Music by Jake Andrews Music @jakeandrewsmusic Production assistant, Miles Muir @miles_muir Production consultant, Katey Psencik

"Early Club Scenes" with John Toad Andrews

"Early Club Scenes" with John Toad Andrews Forming The Wigs with Boz Scaggs, The Chelsea with George Kinney, and joining Tracy Nelson & Mother Earth, to his unlikely second career restoring and selling antique ceiling fans, John "Toad" Andrews' story weaves through some of the most important threads in American rock, blues, and country history. In this episode of Austin Roots, hosts Eddie Wilson and Dr. Jason Mellard sat down with guitarist John "Toad" Andrews for a sprawling conversation about Austin's early music scene. John recounts his arrival at UT Austin in 1964, the formation of the influential blues-rock band The Wigs alongside Boz Skaggs, and the rhythm-and-blues circuit that shaped him, from fraternity parties to Houston's legendary Black clubs. He traces his path through London, back to Houston playing with bandleader Grady Gaines, a stint in LA rehearsing with the Mike Nesmith-backed Armadillos, and finally joining Tracy Nelson and Mother Earth in San Francisco. The band's journey took them to Nashville, where they recorded with country legends. Along the way, John crossed paths with Jimi Hendrix, Janis Joplin, Bob Dylan, Waylon Jennings, Willie Nelson, Jerry Jeff Walker, Jimmy Buffett, and the Doobie Brothers. He closes with the unlikely story of how he traded his guitar for a second career restoring antique ceiling fans, ultimately bringing the business back to Austin. Content Warning: adult themes Content created during the global pandemic, in the room, and on Zoom. Chapters: 01:02 — Arriving at UT Austin in 1964 - Enrolling at UT after two years at University of Virginia 01:18 - Meeting Bob Arthur at Villa Capri; forming The Wigs 02:05 - Finding Boz Scaggs via UT bulletin board 02:29 - Angus Wynne, social connections & early gigs 06:36 - The fraternity party circuit in '64; party barns like Soap Creek 07:24 - Eastwood Country Club in San Antonio; Gatemouth Brown & Curly Mays 08:39 - The Wigs' repertoire: Freddie King, Bobby Bland, Jimmy Reed 09:13 - The Wigs wind down; plan to go to London 10:56 - London, the draft, and escaping to Majorca 12:37 - Back in Austin '65; meeting George Kinney & Roky Erickson 13:17 - Forming The Chelsea with George Kinney & Daryl Rutherford 22:17 - Houston R&B With Grady Gaines 22:49 - Mike Nesmith recruits a Texas band (The Armadillos) to LA 23:36 - The Armadillo name — early precursor to AWHQ 24:07 - Connecting with Roy Gaines; auditioning for Little Richard 25:57 - Joining Tracy Nelson & Mother Earth in San Francisco 26:59 - Recording Living with the Animals; Dick Clark's American Bandstand (playing live) 27:34 - The Armadillo World Headquarters opening night (setting the record straight) 29:06 - Mother Earth heads to Nashville; recording with country legends 37:01 - Bring Me Home on Warner Brothers; Tim Drummond joins 38:16 - Newport Pop Festival 1969 — 200,000 people 39:05 - Bob Arthur fills in for Billy Cox with Jimi Hendrix 39:53 - Crossing paths with Jerry Jeff Walker & Jimmy Buffett 40:06 - The Pan American train ride; the origin of Railroad Lady 42:57 - Playing the Armadillo World Headquarters 50:38 - Second career: discovering antique ceiling fans in Nashville 52:02 - First big ceiling fan sale; road trip to Evansville, Indiana 54:53 - Opening a fan store in Austin 54:56 - Hunter Fan Co. Follow us on Instagram and on Facebook, at @Threadgills AND Check out our store here and collect our gear: https://Threadgills.com/merch Guest: John "Toad" Andrews, guitarist and Austin music veteran Production Team: Host, Eddie Wilson - Armadillo World Headquarters founder @Threadgills Host, Dr. Jason Mellard - Cultural historian @jasondeanmellard Editor, Renee O'Connor Music Mixing, Matt Carlson @axemanguitar Producer, Renee O'Connor @realreneeoconnor Producer, Sandra Wilson @sandrawilson709 Executive Producer, TSSI Music by Jake Andrews Music @jakeandrewsmusic Production assistant, Miles Muir @miles_muir Production consultant, Katey Psencik

"Pioneering The Family Traditions" with John Lomax III

"Pioneering the Family Traditions" with John Lomax III "So grandfather would lie in bed at night and hear the, uh, cowboys nearby. They would stop off and just spend the night nearby, practically in their yard, and he'd hear 'em singing songs, which they would do to keep the cattle calmed down. So sooner or later he started sneaking out of the house and hanging out with the cowboys and writing down the words to the songs that he heard. And somehow, without any musical training, without any books, … he figured out a way to remember the melodies of the songs that he heard, that he was writing down all these words for… and his first book came out in 1910." John Lomax III This episode of Austin Roots features an in-depth conversation with John Lomax III, continuing the legendary Lomax folklore dynasty. Eddie Wilson and Dr. Jason Mellard explore John's family heritage—from his grandfather John Avery Lomax's pioneering cowboy song collections and the famous 1933 recording trip that discovered Lead Belly, to his uncle Alan Lomax's influence on the British Invasion and the BBC. John shares stories about his father managing Lightning Hopkins, his own career managing Townes Van Zandt and Steve Earle, and the vibrant Austin and Houston music scenes of the 1960s-70s. The conversation covers the 13th Floor Elevators, Liberty Hall, the transition from folk to psychedelic rock, and John's perspectives on Nashville's country music evolution. Content Warning: adult themes Content created during the global pandemic, in the room, and on Zoom. Chapters: 02:00 - The Lomax Dynasty Begins (1880s-1910) 03:00 - John Avery Lomax's childhood near the Chisholm Trail 04:00 - Recording cowboy songs and "Cowboy Songs and Other Frontier Ballads" (1910) 05:00 - Harvard fellowship and academic validation 09:00 - The 1933 Recording Trip, and depression era struggles 10:00 - Recording technology: acetate discs in Model A Ford 11:00 - 17,000 recordings deposited with Library of Congress 12:00 - Song rights advocacy: Lead Belly, James Carter, and "O Brother, Where Art Thou?" 16:00 - Bess Lomax Hawes and the National Endowment for the Arts 18:00 - John Lomax Jr. as folk singer and Lightning Hopkins' manager 21:00 - Alan Lomax's decade in England (1950s) and influence on British Invasion 24:00 - Alan's work on song rights and royalties 26:00 - John Henry Faulk and McCarthyism 30:00 - University of Texas years and music journalism 31:00 - Writing for Space City News and underground press 33:00 - First hearing Townes Van Zandt at the 11th Door 34:00 - 13th Floor Elevators and the birth of psychedelia 36:00 - Austin Venues: Vulcan Gas Company, Jade Room 39:00 - Lightning Hopkins in Houston's Third Ward 40:00 - Houston music scene at Liberty Hall with Mike Condrey 44:00 - Bill Simonson and managing Austin venues 47:00 - The Ritz and Jim Franklin 48:00 - Moving to Nashville (1973) 50:00 - Working with Jack Cowboy Clement 53:00 - Austin vs Nashville Rivalry 54:00 - Texas songwriters in Nashville: Guy Clark, Steve Earle, Rodney Crowell 58:00 - How Eddie became a manager for Shiva's Headband 1:00 - Managing Townes Van Zandt, and moving Townes from Colorado to Nashville 1:02 - The fan club letters and emotional impact 1:05 - Townes' humor and personality beyond the tragedy 1:07 - "Live at the Old Quarter" album (recorded 1973, released 1977) 1:13 - Managing Steve Earle 1:14 - Guy Clark and Minor Wilson 1:15 - Travis Rivers connection 1:19 - Concerns about modern country music 1:20 - Writing career and future projects Follow us on Instagram and on Facebook, at @Threadgills AND Check out our store here and collect our gear: https://Threadgills.com/merch [https://armadilloworld.com/shop/] Guest: John Lomax III - Music writer, manager, and producer Production Team: Host, Eddie Wilson - Armadillo World Headquarters founder @Threadgills Host, Dr. Jason Mellard - Cultural historian @jasondeanmellard Editor, Renee O'Connor Music Mixing, Matt Carlson @axemanguitar Producer, Renee O'Connor @realreneeoconnor Producer, Sandra Wilson @sandrawilson709 Executive Producer, TSSI Music by Jake Andrews Music @jakeandrewsmusic Production assistant, Miles Muir @miles_muir Production consultant, Katey Psencik