From Calculating to Sensing: AI, Complexity, and Human Agency with Ryan Martens

The Builder’s Path: AI, Leadership, and the Conversations We Still Have to Have with Darrin Murriner

In today’s episode, I have Darrin Murriner, the co-founder and CEO of Cloverleaf. Darrin shares his journey from spending 15 years in the structured corporate world to launching an automated team coaching platform. Prior to becoming an entrepreneur, Darrin spent 15 years in the corporate world with roles in risk management and auditing at Munich Re, Arthur Andersen, and Fifth Third Bank. He is also the author of two books, Corporate Bravery and Thrive, both focused on helping organizations build adaptable cultures in the face of uncertainty. We talk about what it truly means to step out on your own, the distinct difference between identifying as a "builder" versus an "entrepreneur," and the mindset shift needed to navigate constant rejection during fundraising. Darrin also offers profound insights into how Cloverleaf intentionally uses AI to coach human behavior rather than replace it, and why teaching the next generation to embrace discomfort is vital for long-term success. 💡KEY TAKEAWAYS AND HIGHLIGHTS * The Breaking Point in Corporate Life: A severe compliance challenge served as the catalyst for Darrin to finally step away. He emphasizes the absolute necessity of open communication and financial planning with a partner before making a major career leap. * Surviving the Arthur Andersen Collapse: Early in his career, Darrin lived through the sudden overnight disappearance of Arthur Andersen during the Enron scandal. He was part of a 700-person group that broke off to form a new brand under Robert Half, giving him his first taste of building from scratch. * The "Builder" Identity vs. "Entrepreneur": Darrin views true entrepreneurship as being an explorer, akin to Lewis and Clark, navigating spaces without a clear map. * AI as a Coach, Not an "Easy Button": Darrin discusses Cloverleaf’s intentional integration of AI, noting that the platform focuses on driving long-term behavior change and real-world dialogue. * Overcoming the Soul-Crushing "No": Reflecting on fundraising, Darrin details how shifting his mindset to view rejection as a standard process—where it regularly takes 50 to 100 nos to get a single yes—helped him stop taking business rejection personally. * Building Resilience in Gen Z: As a father of three teenagers, Darrin shares his perspective on the high levels of career stress and anxiety in younger generations. He emphasizes the critical need for parents to intentionally push youth into uncomfortable situations to build resilience before they enter the workforce. Chapters 00:00 | Introduction 02:19 | Corporate Experiences and Realizations: Darrin's Journey 04:43 | Discovering the Builder Within 08:37 | The Decision to Leave Corporate Life 10:53 | Planning for Transition 14:30 | Building Cloverleaf and Its Mission 17:36 | The Role of AI in Team Dynamics 18:17 | The Human Element in AI Integration 25:19 | Introspection Lessons from Building a Business 34:22 | The Importance of Shifting Your Mindset with Career Pivots Guest Darrin Murriner is the Cofounder and CEO of Cloverleaf.me - a technology platform that is bringing automated team coaching to the entire enterprise through real-time, customized coaching in the tools employees use everyday (calendar, email & Slack / Teams). The result is better collaboration, improved employee relationships and a more engaged workforce. Prior to starting Cloverleaf, Darrin had a 15 year corporate career that spanned Munich Re, Arthur Andersen and Fifth Third Bank. Darrin is also the author of Corporate Bravery and Thrive, books focused on building organizational cultures that thrive in the face of change and uncertainty. Website: https://cloverleaf.me/ [https://cloverleaf.me/] LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/murriner/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/murriner/] Purchase Corporate Bravery and Thrive: https://www.amazon.com/stores/Darrin-Murriner/author/B014X2DSPO?ref=ap_rdr&shoppingPortalEnabled=true [https://www.amazon.com/stores/Darrin-Murriner/author/B014X2DSPO?ref=ap_rdr&shoppingPortalEnabled=true] Host Kelly Dwyer is an executive coach, facilitator, and host of Life from Within, a podcast exploring the inner work of leadership, growth, and career transition. She works with thoughtful leaders, founders, and seasoned professionals who are navigating complexity, change, and meaningful inflection points in their work. Through her coaching, facilitation, and podcast conversations, Kelly helps people find clarity, strengthen self-trust, and move forward with greater intention and grounded conviction. https://kellydwyer.co [https://kellydwyer.co] Listen, subscribe and share Apple Podcasts [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/life-from-within/id1840787981] | Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/5J1jDK3lgEnAfBwMsOgHvu?si=65aa3b39cd844443] | YouTube [https://youtube.com/@lifefromwithinpodcast?si=liejuiW6gI7lJ45c] IG – @kd_lifefromwithin [https://www.instagram.com/kd_lifefromwithin/] LinkedIn [https://www.linkedin.com/in/kellydwyer/] – /in/kellydwyer

From Calculating to Sensing: AI, Complexity, and Human Agency with Ryan Martens

In a world increasingly dominated by AI, how do we ensure that technology amplifies our humanity rather than eroding it? In this episode of Life From Within, I talk with Ryan Martens, a serial entrepreneur in software services, SaaS, and AI, as well as Pledge 1%. He was the founder of Rally Software, which became the first public B-Corp in 2013. Ryan has spent his career at the leading edge of technology, and today he is exploring how to amplify humans using AI. We talk about why AI requires us to be more human, not less, and how to navigate the shift from a "complicated" world of answers to a "complex" world of patterns. 💡KEY TAKEAWAYS * The AI Bell Curve: Ryan explains why AI defaults to the "middle of the normal distribution curve." * From Calculating to Sensing: In a complicated system (like a car engine), there is a right answer. In a complex system (like AI, climate, or leadership), there are only patterns. Ryan discusses the shift from being a "human calculator" to a "senser" who experiments and listens. * Human-Centered Tech: A look at Ryan’s current work with MNFST AI. Instead of building tools that replace the person, he is focused on tools that require "human-in-the-loop" engagement, fostering collaboration between human intuition and machine processing. * The Importance of Grounding: Why engaging with AI requires you to be first grounded in your own body and thoughts. Ryan shares how practices like morning pages are essential for maintaining human agency in a digital age. * Citizen Engineers & Ethical Tech: Reflecting on his journey with Rally Software and Pledge 1%, Ryan discusses the responsibility of creators to build technology that serves the flourishing of the whole system. Chapters 00:00 | Introduction 01:49 | The Science Behind Regenerative Practices 06:21 | Understanding Complexity vs. Complication 10:07 | Hospicing Modernity by Vanessa Machado de Oliveira 12:07 | Shifting Perspectives on Certainty 14:58 | Personal Growth and Intuition 18:43 | Expanding Your Sensibilities and Awareness 19:53 | Amplifying Humanity with AI 21:54 | Grounding Before AI Engagement 23:38 | Amplifying Human Intelligence with AI 26:02 | Community and Collaboration in AI 28:02 | The Role of Belonging in AI Interactions 30:24 | Safety and Vulnerability in Group Dynamics 31:46 | Women in AI: Insights and Experiences 37:00 | Innovative Approaches to Raising Capital 41:19 | Emergence and Agency in AI Interactions 44:56 | Building a Human-Centric AI Guest Info & Resources Mentioned Ryan Martens is an entrepreneur in software services, SaaS, and AI, as well as Pledge1%. He was the founder of Rally Software, which was the first public B-Corp in 2013, and used 1/1/1 funds to drive impact by working to create Citizen Engineers with partners at Code for America and Engineers without Borders. He is currently growing an AI business and raising regenerative, organic beef on private and public lands, using virtual fences. Website: https://mnfst.ai/ [https://mnfst.ai/] Substack: https://manifest.substack.com/ [https://manifest.substack.com/] LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryanmartens [https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryanmartens] Pledge 1%: https://www.pledge1percent.org/ [https://www.pledge1percent.org/] Incorruptible by Eric Ries: https://www.incorruptible.co/ [https://www.incorruptible.co/] Hospicing Modernity by Vanessa Machado de Oliveira: https://www.northatlanticbooks.com/shop/hospicing-modernity/ [https://www.northatlanticbooks.com/shop/hospicing-modernity/] Host Kelly Dwyer is an executive coach, facilitator, and host of Life from Within, a podcast exploring the inner work of leadership, growth, and career transition. She works with thoughtful leaders, founders, and seasoned professionals who are navigating complexity, change, and meaningful inflection points in their work. Through her coaching, facilitation, and podcast conversations, Kelly helps people find clarity, strengthen self-trust, and move forward with greater intention and grounded conviction. https://kellydwyer.co [https://kellydwyer.co] IG – @kd_lifefromwithin [https://www.instagram.com/kd_lifefromwithin/] LinkedIn [https://www.linkedin.com/in/kellydwyer/] – /in/kellydwyer

Flipping the Script: Identity, Career Transition, and Becoming with Kelly Dwyer and Elicia Carmichael

When we face a major career pivot or step into a high-stakes leadership role, we often change more than just our job title. We may lose the ability to "trade" on the value of our previous role, leaving us in a vulnerable gap between who we were and who we are becoming. In this special episode of Life from Within, the tables are turned as Elicia Carmichael interviews Kelly. Moving away from the role of the expert, Kelly shares her own "quarter-life crisis" transition from the high-momentum startup world to the uncertain life of an actor in LA. We discuss the "identity loss" that often blindsides high achievers and how to build the internal scaffolding necessary to support a new version of yourself. 💡KEY TAKEAWAYS * The Weight of the Room: Why an executive is never in a "small room," and how your positional power changes the way your words land. * Trading on Value: Understanding the specific type of loss that occurs when you move into a field where your previous successes no longer serve as currency. * The Decision vs. The Integration: Why the choice to change can happen in a moment, but the integration of a new identity takes months, or even years, of "micro-shifts". * Who over What: Shifting the question from "What do I want to do?" to "Who do I want to be?" to find clarity in the middle of complexity. Chapters 00:00 | Introduction 02:42 | My Experience with Identity Loss 10:56 | How to Introduce Yourself in a Meaningful Way 12:43 | Navigating an Identity Change in Your Career 18:14 | The Importance of Taking the Chance 21:18 | The Decision-Making Process 22:04 | Micro Shifts: Building Confidence in Communication 24:27 | Who Do You Want to Be? A Guiding Question 26:36 | Multiple Dreams: Embracing Change in Identity Interviewer Elicia Carmichael focuses her professional energy and boundless curiosity on the intersection of finance and impact. She is the CFO and leader of financial solutions at Labor Mobility Partnerships (LaMP), where she deploys blended capital designs to overcome global migration challenges — turning the global labor/demographics mismatch into prosperity for all. In 2024, she founded the Mobility Finance Network, which unites experts from finance, industry, and migration policy to design and fund financial instruments that make cross-border opportunities accessible for migrants, students, and refugees. Her current initiatives span the Americas, Africa, Asia, and Europe and are driven by her desire to see safe, legal cross-border growth opportunities available to blue-collar workers. Prior to joining LaMP, Elicia was VP of Strategy for Root Capital, where she led the innovation and business development functions in service of their $100M agricultural development investment portfolio. Elicia holds an MBA from Cornell University and a BA in International Studies from Colby College. In her free time, she hikes, scuba dives, and patrols for invasive aquatic plants in the pristine lakes of Maine. Connect with Elicia on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/eliciacarmichael/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/eliciacarmichael/] “Guest” Kelly Dwyer is an executive coach and facilitator. Through her podcast Life from Within, she opens up real conversations about personal growth, career crossroads, and the inner work of leadership. She created the show to explore the moments of courage and clarity that spark inner shifts and lead to meaningful outer progress. In her coaching and facilitation practice, Kelly partners with thoughtful leaders, including founders, C-suite executives, and rising leaders who shoulder significant responsibility and want to lead with grounded clarity and self-trust. She helps them return to what matters most, cut through the noise, and navigate inflection points with aligned conviction. Kelly is a graduate of the University of Colorado and holds an MBA from Cornell University. Connect with Kelly Coaching and facilitation: https://kellydwyer.co [https://kellydwyer.co] IG – @kd_lifefromwithin [https://www.instagram.com/kd_lifefromwithin] LinkedIn – /in/kellydwyer [https://www.linkedin.com/in/kellydwyer/] Sign up for updates [https://www.lifefromwithin.com/] Listen and subscribe Apple Podcasts [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/life-from-within/id1840787981] | Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/5J1jDK3lgEnAfBwMsOgHvu?si=65aa3b39cd844443] | YouTube [https://youtube.com/@lifefromwithinpodcast?si=liejuiW6gI7lJ45c]

Reclaiming Visibility, Power, and Presence for Women Over 50 with Barbara Brooks and Julie Ciardi

Reclaiming Visibility, Power, and Presence for Women Over 50 with Barbara Brooks and Julie Ciardi Is midlife a diminishing season or an ignition point? In this powerful double-feature conversation, Kelly talks with Barbara Brooks and Julie Ciardi about age, reinvention, visibility, ambition, and the deeper call many women feel in the second half of life. Barbara shares how ageism at 51 led her to build a movement around experience as power, while Julie reflects on leaving IBM to pursue work that felt more aligned with who she was meant to be. Together, they challenge the narrative that women become less relevant with age. They explore why experience is a business asset, why visibility should match your goals rather than social media trends, how ambition evolves in midlife, and why caring for the body becomes part of the work. At the heart of the episode is a clear message: you are not finished, your voice matters, and it may be time to stop waiting. Key Takeaways: * Why age is an asset, not a disadvantage * “Middlescence,” the gold age, and reframing the second half of life * How visibility changes when you start leading from substance * Why owning your value is essential before others can value it * The evolution of ambition from proving yourself to serving something bigger * The physical realities of midlife and the need to care for the body alongside the mission * Fear, conformity, and the courage to use your voice anyway * Why legacy work often begins when you stop waiting Chapters 00:00 | Introduction to Empowering Women in Middlescence 03:25 | Barbara Brooks: The Birth of a Mission 05:09 | Julie Ciardi: A Transformational Moment 07:35 | Redefining Midlife: Middlescence 11:20 | Visibility Differently: How to do it Right 19:15 | The Evolution of Ambition 23:54 | The Responsibility of Legacy Work 24:24 | Facing the Challenges of New Beginnings 26:00 | The Importance of Self-Care 27:17 | Listening to Our Bodies 30:03 | Emerging Convictions and Niche Drama 31:04 | The Power of Female Voices 33:32 | Age as an Asset 35:12 | Valuing Our Experience 36:34 | Embracing Uniqueness and Overcoming Fear 37:50 | Taking Action and Living Fully Guests Barbara Brooks is a nationally recognized entrepreneur, keynote speaker, and founder of SecondActWomen. Through her Experience Is Power platform, she helps organizations unlock the business value of experienced talent across a five-generation workforce. A bold advocate for age inclusion and workforce performance, Barbara has been featured by Forbes, Fast Company, CBS Colorado, PBS Next Avenue, and NBC 9News. She believes beauty knows no age, value has no expiration date, and experience is power. https://www.linkedin.com/in/barbaralbrooks/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/barbaralbrooks/] barbarabrooks.com [http://barbarabrooks.com/] and secondactwomen.com [http://secondactwomen.com/] https://barbarabrooks.substack.com/ [https://barbarabrooks.substack.com/] https://www.youtube.com/@BarbaraBrooks [https://www.youtube.com/@BarbaraBrooks] Julie Ciardi is the author of 50 Not Finished, a former IBM exec turned 7-figure founder & a mom of three. She is navigating midlife & the adult-children phase of motherhood. There is a big gap in the current menopause conversation - all health, all aesthetics, no “what’s next?” Julie believes that midlife is the start of the Gold Age - not Old Age. She is an advocate for women near or over 50 ready to do their legacy work. Julie rewrote the entire Human Design system by a woman for women to help them get clarity in their midlife calling. She is a Substack Best Seller & runs a global mentorship company for midlife women. https://www.julieciardi.com/ [https://www.julieciardi.com/] https://substack.com/@julieciardi [https://substack.com/@julieciardi] https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/substack-by-design/id1882801640 [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/substack-by-design/id1882801640] https://www.instagram.com/julieciardi/ [https://www.instagram.com/julieciardi/] Host Kelly Dwyer is an executive coach, facilitator, and host of Life from Within, a podcast exploring the inner work of leadership, growth, and career transition. She works with thoughtful leaders, founders, and seasoned professionals who are navigating complexity, change, and meaningful inflection points in their work. Through her coaching, facilitation, and podcast conversations, Kelly helps people find clarity, strengthen self-trust, and move forward with greater intention and grounded conviction. https://kellydwyer.co [https://kellydwyer.co] Listen and subscribe Apple Podcasts [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/life-from-within/id1840787981] | Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/5J1jDK3lgEnAfBwMsOgHvu?si=65aa3b39cd844443] | YouTube [https://youtube.com/@lifefromwithinpodcast?si=liejuiW6gI7lJ45c] IG – @kd_lifefromwithin LinkedIn [https://www.linkedin.com/in/kellydwyer/] – /in/kellydwyer

Culture Change, Credibility, and the Long Game of Leadership with CEO Chris Bower

Change isn't just about new software or updated protocols; it’s about people. Today I am speaking with Chris Bower, President and CEO of Endurance Federal Credit Union. He is a veteran of the credit union industry with 30+ years of experience. Chris shares how he has modernized the organization over his 18-year tenure as CEO through technology and culture change. We talk about the importance of trust building and why it is so important to allow space for employees to share concerns. Whether you are leading a small team or a major institution, Chris’s insights on leadership are an essential roadmap in organizational transformation. Key Takeaways for Leaders: * Communication is Currency: You cannot over-communicate during times of transition. * Invite Collaboration: If you want buy-in, you must empower middle management. * Building the Foundation: Why you can't rush culture change - trust must be earned through transparency and consistency. * Be Intentional: Change should never be impulsive. A methodical approach reduces anxiety across the board. * Focus on Trust: Trust isn't a byproduct of success; it’s the prerequisite for it. Chapters 00:00 | Introduction to Leadership and Communication 04:28 | Implementing Technology and Cultural Shifts 08:42 | Embracing AI in Financial Services 10:30 | Fostering Openness and Transparency in Culture 16:17 | Navigating Communication Challenges 20:25 | Learning from Missteps 25:00 | Future Growth and Community Engagement Guest Chris is the CEO of Endurance Federal Credit Union. He is a strategic and growth-focused financial services executive with more than 25 years of progressive leadership experience in community and federal credit unions ranging from $11 million to $195 million in assets. He has a proven record of accelerating loan and deposit growth, expanding membership, enhancing profitability, and leading high-performing teams through transformation and change. Chris is recognized for building strong organizational cultures, improving operational efficiency, driving digital modernization, and delivering exceptional member experiences. He is a collaborative leader and persuasive communicator who thrives in dynamic, evolving environments. LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/chris-bower-93b181157/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/chris-bower-93b181157/] Endurance Federal Credit Union: https://www.endurancefcu.org/ [https://www.endurancefcu.org/] Host Kelly Dwyer is an executive coach and facilitator. Through her podcast Life from Within, she opens up real conversations about personal growth, career crossroads, and the inner work of leadership. She created the show to explore the moments of courage and clarity that spark inner shifts and lead to meaningful outer progress. In her coaching and facilitation practice, Kelly partners with thoughtful, influential leaders, including founders, C-suite executives, and rising leaders who shoulder significant responsibility and want to lead with grounded clarity and self-trust. She helps them return to what matters most, cut through the noise, and navigate inflection points with aligned conviction. Kelly is a graduate of the University of Colorado and holds an MBA from Cornell University. Coaching and facilitation: https://kellydwyer.co [https://kellydwyer.co] Listen and subscribe Apple Podcasts [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/life-from-within/id1840787981] | Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/5J1jDK3lgEnAfBwMsOgHvu?si=65aa3b39cd844443] | YouTube [https://youtube.com/@lifefromwithinpodcast?si=liejuiW6gI7lJ45c] Follow Kelly Instagram [https://www.instagram.com/kd_lifefromwithin] – @kd_lifefromwithin LinkedIn [https://www.linkedin.com/in/kellydwyer/] – /in/kellydwyer Sign up for updates [https://www.lifefromwithin.com/]