Smart Agency Masterclass with Jason Swenk: Podcast for Digital Marketing Agencies

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training [https://www.agencymastery360.com/training] We’ve been talking about AI on this podcast for years — not just as the next shiny tool, but as the biggest shift agencies will face this decade. Yet most agencies still haven’t done more than dabble. Meanwhile, their competitors (or even their clients) are using AI to move faster, make sharper decisions, and drive results that leave everyone else scrambling to catch up. If you’re still on the sidelines, you’re already behind. Today’s guest is clear about the game-changing role of AI in the agency world. He argues it’s not just about making your shop more efficient — it’s about driving better client results, delivering faster, deeper insights, and adding to your bottom line. Agencies that fail to embrace AI risk being outpaced by clients who bring it in-house or by competitors already using it to gain an edge. To stay competitive, you have to take a forward-thinking approach that uses AI to scale operations, increase client value, and keep your best people. Phil Parrish is the co-founder & President of PrograMetrix [https://programetrix.com/], a boutique programmatic advertising agency that also crushes it in paid search and paid social. Celebrating their 10-year anniversary this past April, Phil’s team has stayed nimble, focused, and mighty — helping clients dominate their digital paid media while driving real, measurable results. He’ll discuss his vision on AI, how he’s using it as a multiplier, and why that are not already adapting their processes to include this technology, will be exposed. In this episode, we’ll discuss: * Navigating pipeline churn anxiety. * Delivering quick wins with AI. * Why agencies that don’t adapt will get exposed. * Focus on the wins, not just the tasks. Subscribe Apple [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/smart-agency-masterclass-jason-swenk-podcast-for-digital/id870206013] | Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/0FiKuRTpkJ7OraCJBUIlr9] | iHeart Radio [https://www.iheart.com/podcast/263-smart-agency-master-28334260/] Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency [http://e2msolutions.com/smartagency] and get 10% off for the first three months of service. Betting on Yourself (And Getting Clients to Bet on You Too) Phil didn’t stumble into agency ownership by accident, but he didn’t overcomplicate it either. He built strong client relationships over the years, recognized the moment when he thought, “I can do what this company does — why not do it for myself?” and took the leap. With clients ready to follow, he launched PrograMetrix and started generating revenue quickly, sidestepping much of the risk that keeps many would-be agency owners stuck. The takeaway? If you’ve built trust and consistently delivered, clients will follow when you launch your own shop. Relationships and results are your best startup capital. Navigating Uncertainty Without Panic Every agency owner hits moments  [https://flatworm-caterpillar-3mha.squarespace.com/podcast/adaptable-in-uncertain-times]of chaos—those “Are we going under?” nightmares that keep you up at 3 AM. So far, Phil’s journey hasn’t quite hit the “we can’t make payroll” panic, but pipeline uncertainty and client churn anxiety were very real, especially during COVID-19. Ironically, the pandemic ended up being a huge growth driver. As trade shows and in-person events vanished, clients who were spending six figures on live events had to redeploy budgets digitally. PrograMetrix was perfectly positioned to catch that wave. “You’ve got to have a good business plan, offer strategic value, make smart bets, and stay laser-focused when your back’s against the wall.” It’s a solid reminder: when chaos hits, the cream rises. The agencies that pivot fast come out stronger.   AI: Beyond Social Posts and Rocket Emojis Let’s get real: most agencies are looking at AI like it’s a shortcut to crank out social posts and blog content (and yes, that’s part of it). But Phil’s approach is a level above—he’s integrating AI deeply into PrograMetrix’s operations to enhance speed, insights, and performance, not just save a few hours per week. In his view, agencies that have depended on time as their inventory and work on the basis that the more time they can utilize the more revenue they can drive will struggle unless they modernize operations using AI. For its part, Phil’s agency is building a proprietary product using a licensed data warehouse, pulling data from all their platforms (The Trade Desk, Meta, Google, TikTok, LinkedIn, etc.), and using AI to run advanced queries and develop unique optimization techniques. The end goal would be to deliver faster, clearer, and more impactful insights [https://flatworm-caterpillar-3mha.squarespace.com/podcast/agency-responsiveness] that clients can’t get by simply logging into their ad accounts. The bottom line: If your agency isn’t embedding AI into how you operate and deliver, not just as a tool to “save time,” clients will either bring it in-house or go with an agency that does. The market is moving, and speed and value are non-negotiables if you want to win and retain serious clients. Delivering Quick Wins and Story-Driven Insights Mid-market and enterprise clients dropping six to seven figures on ad spend need to feel your authority and your velocity from day one. They need to breathe easier knowing your agency has it handled, and they need to see progress fast, or they’ll be out. Using AI, Phil’s agency uncovers insights like: * Path to conversion (impressions and touchpoints before a sale) * Channel impact across the funnel * Audience segment insights * Messaging that drives real ROI They’re not just sending reports but turning complex data into actionable stories for their clients. If you’re still measuring your agency’s success by how much time you can bill rather than how much impact you can deliver, it’s time to rethink your model [https://flatworm-caterpillar-3mha.squarespace.com/podcast/ai-dedicated-role] before your clients rethink you. Why Agencies That Don’t Adapt Will Get Exposed Look, AI isn’t going to wipe out agencies. But it will wipe out agencies that are stuck operating like it’s 2015, coasting on outdated processes, and sending the same recycled reports clients can pull themselves. AI is like the giant scoreboard in baseball, showing every advanced stat in real-time. Agencies that are half-assing delivery can’t hide anymore. If you’re running bad ads, AI will show your client you suck, and you’ll get fired. (Like the agency I just fired.) AI won’t kill the agency model, but it will expose agencies not using best-of-breed tools to deliver value faster. AI as a Multiplier, Not a Threat — and Saves Him $200K Phil is using AI as a force multiplier to: * Deliver faster, clearer insights for clients [https://flatworm-caterpillar-3mha.squarespace.com/podcast/ai-agents-transform-agency-operations] * Optimize campaigns for even a 2-3% lift that compounds over time And they’re doing this without having to invest in new talent at the rate they otherwise would have. As Phil says, “if we can skip hiring one or two traders, that’s a $200K swing to the bottom line.” And it’s not because he doesn’t value his team—he’s investing in making his team better. AI helps smart people do better work, get better results, and actually enjoy their jobs. Clients see more value, your agency scales efficiently, and your team sticks around longer, reducing churn and recruitment costs. It’s About Buying Wins, Not Just Doing Tasks If you’ve seen Moneyball, know Billy Beane reinvented baseball by focusing on “getting on base,” not vanity stats. Agencies should think the same way: * What are your “get on base” moves that drive client results? * Are you outcome-driven and problem-solving, or are you a task rabbit waiting to be replaced by AI? When clients have big challenges, do they come to you first, or are you stuck doing low-value production work? If it’s the latter, it’s a sign to reposition your agency now. If you don’t, you’re writing your own exit letter from the industry. Make AI Use Mandatory, Not Optional As an agency leader, it’s time to go all-in on integrating AI across all SOPs, not just as an add-on for the leadership team. Why? Because this tech: * Makes employees more valuable in the marketplace * Makes them happier by removing annoying, low-leverage tasks * Keeps your team aligned with your agency’s growth goals Before they started using AI prompts to understand how to optimize a campaign or improve performance, their campaign managers were conducting huge Excel exports. Now they can focus on strategy. If you’re the only one using AI in your agency, you’re toast. You need to lead, train, and require your team to use these tools to become outcome-focused problem solvers rather than task executors. Stop Being Fearful. Start Doing If you’re feeling fear around AI, that’s normal. But you’ll stay scared if you don’t start using it. Phil’s team didn’t wait for a perfect moment; they’re actively building, testing, and refining AI use across their delivery and ops. The agencies that will win over the next 3-5 years aren’t the ones worrying about AI—they’re the ones using it to solve bigger problems faster for their clients. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint [https://www.agencymastery360.com/blueprint]. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training [https://www.agencymastery360.com/training] Let’s get real for a second. 40% of CMOs are cutting agency budgets this year. (Not hype. That’s from Gartner’s 2025 CMO spend survey.) If you’re still out there selling tasks instead of outcomes, blending in like every other “me too” agency, you’re not just at risk—you’re probably already on the cut list. But here’s the good news: Some agencies aren’t just surviving right now. They’re growing like crazy. Why? Because they’re leading. They’re essential. They’re uncuttable. Vendors Get Cut. Partners Stay. Here’s what most agencies are still doing: * Taking orders. * Waiting for direction. * Hoping results keep the client around. But when CMOs tighten budgets, they don’t cut true strategic partners—they cut vendors and noise. In-house teams and AI are replacing basic production. If your agency doesn’t feel essential, you will get replaced. Period. You know what else CMOs are cutting? Agencies that over-promise, under-deliver, and ghost clients after the deal closes. I’ve hired a few agencies over the past couple of years, and I can say most agencies have the slick branding and a confident talk, but once the deal is closed execution just falls apart. I’ve seen this more times than I can count. Communication fades away and no one takes ownership This is what CMOs are frustrated with. They’re not just making cuts to save money. They’re doing it after getting tired of disappointments. Joey Coleman says it best: “Most clients don’t leave because of price; they leave because they don’t feel seen, heard, or supported in the first 100 days.” Remember that while agency teams get excited and start high-fiving each other once the deal closes, the client is sitting there thinking, “Did I just waste my budget?” That gap between your excitement and their anxiety is where trust is either built or destroyed. And it’s true. Our mastermind member Marty took that to heart, redesigned his client experience, and grew to a multi-million-dollar agency because he didn’t wait for tasks—he led, flew out to meet clients, set clear expectations, and became indispensable. Make Yourself Uncuttable You want to stay off the cut list? Lead. Own the relationship. Here’s how: 1. Find Quick Wins Fast Don’t wait six months to show value. Launch something in the first 30 days. Fix something they didn’t even ask for. Send a Loom video explaining how you improved their funnel. Let them say, “These people move fast.” 2. Overcommunicate When Things Aren’t Working Most agencies go quiet when results dip. Leaders say, “Here’s what’s happening, here’s what we’re changing, here’s what to expect.” Transparency builds trust. 3. Be a Resource, Not a Responder Stop waiting for tasks. Show up with new hooks, funnel fixes, better angles. Be the call they make when anything breaks in their business, not just when they need a landing page. 4. Take Ownership, Not Orders Stop asking, “What do you want us to do next?” Start saying, “Here’s what we’re doing, and here’s why.” That’s how you shift from vendor to partner. 5. Productize and Simplify If it takes you 30 minutes to explain what you do, you’re in trouble. Make your offer outcome-driven, simple, and memorable. Like the PR agency that said, “We turn publicity into pipeline.” That sticks. Real Results from Agencies Leading This Way Just look at Brittany, who stopped winging it, joined the mastermind, and committed to leading: * Revenue up 35% in a quarter * Profit up 41% * Churn dropped 32% * SEO and social revenue doubled And she didn’t get there with a fancy hack. She got there by leading and building trust. This Isn’t Just About Staying Off a Cut List It’s about building an agency that deserves to grow—one that earns trust, delivers outcomes, and leads. Want a place to start? Pick one of these actions today: * Tighten your onboarding. * Call a client you haven’t talked to in a while. * Launch the damn thing you’ve been sitting on. Because the agencies that win aren’t waiting for permission or praying for renewals. They’re leading, earning trust, and making themselves uncuttable.   If you’re ready to attract better clients and become uncuttable, check out the Attract Masterclass [https://pages.agencymastery360.com/attract/]. It will help you position your agency to pull in the right leads instead of just more leads.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training [https://www.agencymastery360.com/training] Is churn currently a problem with your agency clients? Are you aware of the reasons they decide to leave? It may be time to think hard about your onboarding process, client communication, and generally the ways you’re ensuring client satisfaction. The difference often comes down to positioning: are you operating as a trusted advisor or simply completing tasks? Today's special guest knows that agencies that prioritize client satisfaction, embrace accountability, and focus on becoming trusted advisors rather than mere task completers are the ones that create truly loyal clients. As our Agency Scale Specialist, Darby Copenhaver [https://flatworm-caterpillar-3mha.squarespace.com/podcast/do-you-have-the-right-support], has closely observed the growth trajectories of numerous mastermind members and constantly communicates with them in their journeys. In this conversation, he and Jason get into the importance of strong communication and transparent onboarding processes to combat buyer's remorse and build trust. They also address the strategic use of AI to enhance efficiency and results, stressing that while AI can automate tasks, human connection and understanding clients' evolving needs remain paramount for long-term partnerships. In this episode, we’ll discuss: * How to prevent your clients’ buyer's remorse. * Your onboarding might be the problem. * Stop ignoring current clients. * Your secret retention weapon: ongoing discovery. Subscribe Apple [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/smart-agency-masterclass-jason-swenk-podcast-for-digital/id870206013] | Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/0FiKuRTpkJ7OraCJBUIlr9] | iHeart Radio [https://www.iheart.com/podcast/263-smart-agency-master-28334260/] Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you’re leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That’s why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio [https://www.wix.com/studio] to get started. Why Your Clients Might Not Love You (Even if You’re Getting Results) Ever feel like you’re crushing it for clients, but then they ghost you or churn unexpectedly? There are several reasons why this could be happening and ways to stop it before it kills your momentum. Here’s the truth: buyers remorse sets in immediately after a client signs. It’s your job to kill that remorse with rock-solid communication and a frictionless onboarding experience. Most agencies think they’re good communicators because they answer emails. But clients want more than tasks checked off. They want to feel seen, understood, and confident they made the right decision. If you’re not proactively communicating wins (and misses), or if you let your PMs control the narrative without your oversight, you’re setting yourself up for churn, no matter how “good” your delivery is. Your Onboarding Might Be Pushing Clients Away As Jason knows from recent experiences as a client, most agencies’ onboarding is just an exhausting homework dump on clients who already told you their goals in the sales calls you recorded. Why are you making them repeat themselves, fill out giant forms, or wait for your scattered follow-ups? Your clients didn’t hire you to do more work. They hired you to get results while saving them time. * Break your onboarding [https://flatworm-caterpillar-3mha.squarespace.com/podcast/onboarding-for-success] into clear, easy phases, * Reset expectations, * Use the data you already have (like call transcripts and AI sorting) to fill in the blanks yourself. If you set clear timelines, communication rhythms, and how success will be measured in that first meeting, you’ll position yourself as a trusted advisor, not another vendor barking for “assets” they’ve already shared. This is what makes clients relieved to work with you instead of stressed. Communication: Simple, But Rarely Done Right It’s so important for any business to show that you’re trustworthy, and you’ll show that by doing what you say you’ll do, when you say you’ll do it. Too many agencies fail to communicate delays, let tasks slip, and think a monthly dashboard is enough. It’s not. Dashboards alone mean nothing to most clients. Some need a quick Loom, some need Slack check-ins, others need a simple “Here’s what we did, what’s next, and why it matters.” Customizing your communication style shows your clients you’re paying attention to them, not just copy-pasting your agency SOPs onto their business. This is how you become a trusted advisor, the person they call with challenges (not just tasks). That’s how you become irreplaceable. So, which measures are you implementing at your agency to ensure - not just assume - that you know your clients are happy, not only with the results presented but also the overall experience? Want Clients to Stick Around? Be Human When was the last time you called a client you didn’t personally sell or deliver on, just to check in and say, “Hey, I’m the CEO, here’s my number if you need anything”? Most agencies never do this, but it’s one of the simplest ways to build relationships that survive budget cuts and economic slowdowns. If clients only see you as a transaction, you’re the first thing to get cut. If they see you as a partner, they’ll fight to keep you. Want to take it further? Fly out and have dinner with your top clients once a year. Exchange stories, show them you care, and watch how your retention and upsells climb. Stop Leaving Money on the Table by Ignoring Current Clients Agencies love to yell, “We need more leads!” But often, your easiest growth is sitting right in front of you [https://flatworm-caterpillar-3mha.squarespace.com/podcast/client-retention-strategies]. If your clients trust you, they’ll come to you with new problems—many of which you can solve or connect them with someone who can. This positions you as a problem solver, not an order taker. Instances like this are a great opportunity to be strategic, guide them, and reinforce how much you value the relationship. Results are awesome, but that value is what will take from being transactional to being a value relationship they’ll fight to keep in times of economic uncertainty. Why Ongoing Discovery Is Your Secret Retention Weapon If you’re selling to clients you can’t grow with, you’re setting yourself up for frustration. Too many agencies say “yes” to clients who aren’t ready, don’t want help, or can’t commit to scaling. It’s like hiring a personal trainer while refusing to stop eating cake every night. They might pay you, but they won’t get results—and they’ll blame you when they don’t. And what about after you’ve found the right clients? Darby believes too many agencies forget that discovery isn’t just for the sales process. Every client interaction should be a sort of ongoing discovery. Agencies that retain and grow accounts are constantly in ongoing discovery mode. As you bring success to clients their needs will evolve, their businesses shift, and what worked four months ago might be irrelevant today. If you’re not in tune with those shifts, your agency becomes stale, and you’ll get replaced. A challenge for agency owners: How are you staying aware of what’s changing in your clients’ businesses? Are you proactively checking in, asking about priorities, and aligning your services to what’s happening right now? Or are you stuck on autopilot, delivering what they hired you for while missing what they actually need today? Stay curious, stay in discovery, and you’ll stay essential. Communication Clarity: 411 vs. 911 To prevent the typical disconnect when clients are unsure of who to reach out to and for what, Darby and Jason recommend this simple but powerful tactic brought by Agency Mastery member, Travis. He tells clients exactly who to reach out to for “411” (info & updates) vs. “911” (emergencies). This eliminates confusion, speeds up communication, and prevents small issues from turning into big frustrations. And when you mess up—and you will—own it fast. Clients don’t want spin or silence. They want the truth — fast. One agency Jason used messed up an ad so badly it was embarrassing, and instead of calling to own it, they hid behind Slack messages. Don’t be that agency. Mistakes happen. What matters is how quickly and humanly you fix them. Be Human. Clients Crave It. At the heart of retention and growth is human connection. If your agency relationships feel like sterile transactions, you’re replaceable. Clients want to feel seen and understood. If everything you share sounds like sugarcoated wins while their results lag, they’ll start doubting you. Long-term, high-value clients come from humanizing your interactions—having real conversations, admitting mistakes, sharing wins, and being upfront about challenges. Clients don’t want perfect robots; they want partners they trust. Don’t Fear AI - Use It to Win Do clients want their agencies to use AI? Overwhelmingly, yes. They just don’t what you to use it just to write articles and create crappy images, brands want their agencies using AI to get better results. According to a survey conducted by Audience Audit, 77% of brands are more likely to hire an agency seen as an AI expert, yet only 32% think their current agency is. This is a massive opportunity. But here’s the key: don’t use AI as a crutch to replace human strategy. Use it to collect, analyze, and interpret data faster so you can bring clients valuable insights and make micro-adjustments that drive real results. Clients want done-for-you solutions that leverage AI under the hood while preserving a human relationship on the front end. Just remember that clients don’t care about your systems, your dashboards, or your internal processes if they don’t lead to results. They want outcomes with as little friction as possible. AI can help you cut busywork, speed up insights, and refine strategy—but it’s your human understanding and relationship that keeps clients paying [https://flatworm-caterpillar-3mha.squarespace.com/podcast/build-an-irreplaceable-agency], referring, and expanding their contracts. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint [https://www.agencymastery360.com/blueprint]. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training [https://www.agencymastery360.com/training] Do you invest in training high-potential employees to grow into leadership roles—or do you prefer to hire seasoned pros from the start? There’s no one-size-fits-all approach to building a great team, but today’s featured guest has a clear philosophy: when it comes to agency growth, he prefers to develop A-players from within. For him, building the bench is just as important as building the business. Hamlet Azarian is the founder and CEO of Azarian Growth Agency [https://azariangrowthagency.com/], an agency that works with mid-market venture-backed startups helping them build their go-to-market strategies. He discusses his agency’s "build them up" strategy, focusing on continual learning and curiosity through an academy, webinars, and internships, rather than solely hiring seasoned professionals. He’ll address the common agency challenge of talent retention, noting that positive experiences can still lead to future referrals and positive word-of-mouth, even if employees eventually move on. It’s an interesting episode where we dive into the importance of human capital and fostering a supportive, value-driven environment for agency success. In this episode, we’ll discuss: * Growing talent from scratch. * Promote those who are ready to shine. * The secret to employee retention.  Subscribe Apple [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/smart-agency-masterclass-jason-swenk-podcast-for-digital/id870206013] | Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/0FiKuRTpkJ7OraCJBUIlr9] | iHeart Radio [https://www.iheart.com/podcast/263-smart-agency-master-28334260/] Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency [http://e2msolutions.com/smartagency] and get 10% off for the first three months of service. From Go-to Fixer to Full Agency Before he was running his own growth agency, Hamlet was the go-to fixer for venture-backed startups in the trenches of pre-product chaos. VCs brought him in as a high-paid consultant to help fragile startups figure out product validation and go-to-market traction — a risky sandbox where there’s barely a product and hardly any money. As the companies he touched turned into multi-million-dollar powerhouses, word got around, more VCs lined up, and the Azarian Growth Agency was born. So as he recalls, it wasn’t exactly an accidental start, but considering he was helping startups that could barely write a check, he could not see it turning into a full agency in the beginning. A Culture of Relentless Learning One thing Hamlet doesn’t compromise on is curiosity. If you run an agency, you know yesterday’s marketing tactic is today’s LinkedIn meme. So instead of hiring only ‘seasoned experts,’ He invests in creating lifelong learners. How? He built Azarian Growth Academy, which trains up-and-coming marketers on the exact growth strategies his agency deploys for high-stakes startups. Add to that a monthly Growth Lab webinar, Udemy courses (4,000+ students and counting), and a robust internship pipeline — and you get a team that knows not just what to do, but why it works. Education is really central for Hamlet so his people don’t just follow checklists — they evolve with the market because they understand the principles behind the tactics. Growing Talent from Scratch (and Letting Them Fly) Does it work? Hamlet shares a story that answers that better than any hiring manifesto. One intern joined as a college senior, left, and rejoined when Hamlet officially hung out his agency shingle. When he saw her application, Hamlet immediately hired her, as she knew her aptitude, passion, and even her weaknesses. Within 6 months, she was running paid ads. By year one, she was pitching clients solo. By year two, she was leading teams and today she’s a senior department head. The lesson here is drive and curiosity should be backed with training, opportunity, and real trust. The payoff is massive loyalty and in-house expertise [https://flatworm-caterpillar-3mha.squarespace.com/podcast/empower-your-team-growth-path] that’s molded to your agency’s playbook — not someone else’s. Promotion by Performance, Not the Calendar Forget annual reviews and rigid promotion ladders. Hamlet’s approach is simple: Learn fast, deliver results, get rewarded. To him, some people shine faster than others and, as the agency owners, you don’t to limit that potential. Of course, you want to prepare them for the new role [https://flatworm-caterpillar-3mha.squarespace.com/podcast/onboarding-for-success], so he tests emerging talent on internal agency projects before putting them on client accounts. If they mess up, the agency learns — not the client’s bank account. It’s a safe sandbox for risk-taking and skill-building, with performance as the only true gatekeeper to moving up. Flexibility: The Secret Sauce to Keeping Good People How can you keep that talent from jumping ship the second they hit senior level? You don’t always. And Hamlet says that’s perfectly fine. Even with AI evolving daily, Hamlet’s clear that an agency’s real moat is people — smart, motivated, curious people who feel trusted and supported to do their best work. Tools change. Channels come and go. But the humans who run them? That’s your agency’s real asset. In his view, the agency’s success is predicated on the owner’s ability to bring in talented people on to the team and provide a great environment that encourages them to stay [https://flatworm-caterpillar-3mha.squarespace.com/podcast/never-lose-agency-employee]. And the definition of “great” in this case may vary from individual to individual, but Hamlet finds that more than  perks or a foosball table or free LaCroix, it’s about freedom. People need room to live their lives — whether that’s hopping on a plane to Italy with the kids, or working flexible hours so family time doesn’t clash with client deadlines. When people feel understood and trusted, they stay longer. And if they do leave? They become allies, not competitors. Many send referrals back. Some boomerang and return. And nearly all say, “That’s where I learned how to do great work.” That reputation becomes your best recruiting tool — a self-feeding loop of great people wanting in. Experience vs. Fresh Eyes: A Never-Ending Balancing Act There’s a million ways to grow an agency and there are no easy answers when it comes to hiring. Even if you hire the “experienced pro,” they can become rigid and slow to adapt — a death knell for early-stage growth marketing where experimentation rules. Hamlet’s advice is don’t bet the farm on resumes alone. Bet on mindset. Surround yourself with good people who share the same values. Look for curiosity, a love of learning, and the ability to fail, recover, and share lessons. Skills can be taught. Hunger can’t. Define what you believe. Hire for it relentlessly. Train for skill, reward growth, and build an environment people don’t want to leave — and if they do, they still sing your praises. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint [https://www.agencymastery360.com/blueprint]. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training [https://www.agencymastery360.com/training] How are you positioning your services as essential rather than optional, and accurately measuring growth and profitability to sustain long-term success? How are you measuring your agency’s growth and profitability? Today’s featured guests unpack how they scaled their PR shop past the million-dollar mark in under four years — and their journey offers valuable insights that any agency owner can apply immediately. Learn why they prefer growing the agency as partners, as opposed to sticking to being solopreneurs, how they’ve been tracking their growth, and how to over-communicate with clients openly so that choosing you is the easiest decision. Caitlin Copple and Holly Conti are the co-partners of Full Swing PR [https://fullswingpr.com/], an agency that offers senior-level PR services to help amplify clients’ story or cause and takes pride in creating authentic, lasting relationships with clients. They discuss their unique partnership dynamics, their approach to quarterly planning and KPIs, and their philosophy on "practicing what you preach" in the agency world. They also emphasize the importance of understanding client needs, demonstrating value, and the shift from focusing merely on publicity to generating tangible client pipelines. In this episode, we’ll discuss: * Breaking the visionary and integrator partner mold. * Making sure to walk the walk in your own business. * How to make your business a ‘must-have’  Subscribe Apple [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/smart-agency-masterclass-jason-swenk-podcast-for-digital/id870206013] | Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/0FiKuRTpkJ7OraCJBUIlr9] | iHeart Radio [https://www.iheart.com/podcast/263-smart-agency-master-28334260/] Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you’re leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That’s why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio [https://www.wix.com/studio] to get started. Breaking the Visionary-Integrator Mold Caitlin started Full Swing solo, but always kept Holly in mind as the ideal partner for her business after they met working at an agency. It took some time, though, since Holly was first pregnant when Caitlin started the agency and then busy being a mom to a newborn. However, her involvement progressed, first as a moonlighter, then the agency’s first employee, and eventually becoming the co-pilot Caitlin had always envisioned. Founder duos often get asked about who identifies as the “visionary” or the “integrator.” In their case, Caitlin and Holly both think big and get in the weeds. They take turns in both roles, which makes it complicated, but it works with a dose of brutally clear communication and mutual respect. Why work like this? It all comes from their beginnings as working moms in the business. As they explain, they initially treated it like a job share tagging each other in and out in the early days so they could both keep the wheels turning — and the babies fed. Partner Up or Burn Out Some agency owners do prefer to fly solo, but for the ones stuck doing it all alone [https://flatworm-caterpillar-3mha.squarespace.com/podcast/two-burden-out-founders-joined-forces] — losing sleep over payroll, client churn, or the next contract that might vaporize overnight — Caitlin and Holly are living proof that a solid partner is worth their weight in gold. Having someone to say “we got this” when a contract gets pulled from underneath you is priceless. Sure, partnerships are basically work marriages (with all the ups and downs). But good ones make the tough days survivable — and the big wins that much sweeter. Walk Your Talk or Get Called Out Do you make sure your agency is practicing what you preach? Or are you one of the agencies that just “can’t find the time” to work on their own website or marketing? Too many agencies hide behind ‘we’re too busy with client work’ while their own site looks like it was built in 1997 by a drunk intern. In their specific case as a PR agency, Caitlin and Holly practice the tenacity they teach their clients to have. “PR is about tenacity. It’s not enough to do good work. People need to see you doing it.” Just like they tell clients to show up consistently, be visible, and ask for what they want. They make sure to do the same. Furthermore, putting yourself in your clients’ shoes as small business owners will help you intimately understand the challenges they face and understand the investment they’re making on your agency and how much they’re betting on the results you can bring. For Caitlin, this means taking people “from publicity to pipeline,” because she understands as a small business owner how important it is to have four time the sales you need to meet your annual budget. In other words, treat your own agency like your most important client — or watch it slowly bleed opportunities. Quarterly Planning, KPIs, and the Secret Sauce So much can change in just one year (as we all have seen with the last couple of years). In the six years they’ve been in business, Caitlin and Holly have been through a pandemic, an AI revolution, and the economy doing somersaults. At this point, planning once a year and forgetting about it seems like a rookie move. They still set annual goals, of course. But quarterly check-ins are essential to running the day-to-day behind their million-dollar PR engine. Their leadership team meets every week to ensure that quarterly plan is still reality-proof. Revenue is Cool, But Calls Are King Although they do have a topline revenue goal and a profit margin goals for the agency, their north star isn’t revenue — it’s discovery calls. After realizing there was much more to building a profitable business than hitting the $1 million mark, Caitlin and Holly have been focusing more on pipeline and conversion rates. They know that if they keep discovery calls flowing, the revenue follows. Right now, if they book 10 calls with good fits, five become paying clients. That’s a predictable pipeline. Pro tip: Track leading indicators religiously — site visits, key page hits, opt-ins, booked calls, and conversion rates at each step. If something’s off (like calls dropping off, or deals stalling), they fix that exact leak before it kills the next quarter. So, if you’re still flying blind, eyeballing topline revenue in your QuickBooks and calling it planning —you’re normal… but you’re leaving money on the table. How to Make PR (or Any Service) a Must-Have In this economy, how to get clients to see your work more as a must-have than a “nice-to-have [https://flatworm-caterpillar-3mha.squarespace.com/podcast/agencys-competitive-advantage]”? In down markets, budgets get slashed — but essentials don’t. So how do you become an essential? You don’t chase anyone who’s just looking for a PR vanity headline. You focus on clients who want a pipeline, not just press. If you’re having a hard time to get clients to see you as an essential, you may be talking to the wrong people. Think about your ideal clients. What do they believe? What are their challenges? If you define your ideal client and start targeting them, you’ll attract people who truly see the value you can bring to their business. Over-Communicate. Then Double It Caitlin and Holly share their process openly with prospects [https://flatworm-caterpillar-3mha.squarespace.com/podcast/conquering-communication-blind-spots]. Step by step. No secrets. Some agencies worry they’re giving away the farm. Newsflash: they’re not. Clients want to trust you know what you’re doing — but they don’t want to do it themselves. Everyone loves steak but no one wants to butcher a cow. Their transparency means no confusion, no scope drama, and no “you didn’t say that” fights later. It’s all upfront. And they even turned this transparency into a smart private podcast: “How to Hire a PR Agency” — a brilliant piece of sales enablement they send to prospects to handle all the FAQs before a call. That way, discovery calls stay focused where they should be: the client’s business. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint [https://www.agencymastery360.com/blueprint]. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.