Post Growth Pensions with Steve Rocco

Regenerative Economics with John B. Fullerton

We spoke with John Fullerton, author of Regenerative Economics and former top banker, about why the economic system isn't broken and working exactly as designed. And that's the problem. His core argument: we built the economy like a machine. But life doesn't work like a machine. And no amount of carbon taxes or ESG reporting will fix a design flaw that deep. What would it look like to build an economy like a living system instead? That's what this conversation is about. Background John spent nearly 20 years at J.P. Morgan before leaving in 2001. The September 11 attacks, which he witnessed firsthand, prompted a deep personal search for meaning. He began reading widely outside finance, including Limits to Growth, and eventually developed the framework of regenerative economics. The Core Problem: Economy as Machine The root of today's economic crisis lies in how neoclassical economics was founded: 19th-century mathematicians deliberately modeled it on Newtonian physics, treating the economy as a machine rather than a living organism. Two critical errors followed, ignoring the second law of thermodynamics (entropy) and assuming time is reversible. The Nordhaus Nobel Prize, which deemed a 3.5°C temperature rise acceptable, is a product of this flawed thinking. Regenerative vs. Other Economic Frameworks * Environmental economics (Nordhaus) uses externalities, useful as a concept, but inadequate because not all harms can be priced or fixed with money. * Ecological economics (Herman Daly) was a major leap, re-embedding the economy within the biosphere, but still frames things as a trade-off between growth and sustainability. * Regenerative economics goes further, treating the economy as a living system governed by emergence, adaptive cycles, and self-organization, not top-down management toward preset goals. Co-Inherited Wealth and the Commons Drawing on Peter Barnes' work, John argues that natural resources, the internet, mathematical knowledge, and accumulated technological progress are all co-inherited wealth, shared assets that the private sector currently uses for free. He estimates that privately owned wealth represents only about 13% of total real wealth. A proper institution of the commons, similar to Norway's oil fund or Alaska's oil trust, could govern these shared assets, generate universal revenues, and make the economy self-fueling. Practical Pathways Rather than one grand plan, John points to many existing examples: * The Mondragón cooperative in Spain, managing 80 businesses as a single ecosystem for 80 years * Bioregional movements and decentralized food systems * The opportunity presented by the "silver tsunami", as aging baby boomers exit their privately owned businesses, there's a chance to buy and reorganize half the global economy into place-based regenerative ecosystems On AI and Energy John believes the current AI boom is likely a financial bubble. That said, the massive energy demand it creates is already spurring engineering innovation in efficiency, the challenge is directing that ingenuity toward systemic health rather than billionaire-making. The Path Forward John sees this as fundamentally a re-education and paradigm shift project. Drawing on Ilya Prigogine's mathematics, he argues that when systems are far from equilibrium, small "islands of coherence" can shift the whole. His online community (withlife.net) is one such island. The transformation may happen suddenly and unexpectedly, like the fall of the Berlin Wall or through painful collapse first. Either way, he believes the regenerative economy is already emerging, even if we can't fully see it yet. ---------------------------------------- Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy [https://acast.com/privacy] for more information.

Seduce, Don't Preach with Olly Lawder from Revolt

This week we sit down with Olly Lawder, a strategist and storyteller with extensive experience in sustainability communications. We trace the arc of sustainability communication from its origins in corporate philanthropy and early CSR, through the rise of ambitious net zero targets and "rock star CEOs," to the more cautious and compliance-driven moment we find ourselves in today. Along the way, we ask an uncomfortable question: did the movement win over the corporate world while losing voters and consumers? Olly has spent 20 years helping major global brands figure out how to make sustainable choices genuinely desirable, not as a moral duty, but as something people actually want. The closer sustainability gets to the real reason someone buys something, the more powerful it becomes. Nobody buys a perfume for the recycled packaging. But if the sustainably sourced vanilla makes it smell more complex, more unique, more seductive?  We dig into why terms like "net zero" and "degrowth" leave people cold, what the fossil fuel industry understands about communications that the sustainability movement still doesn't, and why the pendulum will eventually have to swing back, because none of the fundamental problems have gone away. ---------------------------------------- Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy [https://acast.com/privacy] for more information.

Post Growth Pensions with Steve Rocco

In our latest episode of What is to be Done, we sat down with Steve Rocco, co-founder of the Arketa Institute, to talk about one of the most fundamental challenges of our time: the gap between modern science and the economic theories that still govern our financial systems. What makes Steve's perspective particularly striking is where it comes from. He has spent his career inside the financial system, from trading desks at Bank of America and Goldman Sachs to impact investing, green bonds and private placements. It is precisely that experience, he argues, that made the contradictions impossible to ignore. His argument is straightforward but radical. The neoclassical economics that dominates our institutions, business schools and financial markets was built before much of what we now know about the biosphere and planetary boundaries. Ecological economics offers a different framework, one where the economy exists within nature, not alongside it. A central theme in the conversation is the concept of multi-capital, the idea that wealth cannot be reduced to financial capital alone. Social capital, natural capital and community are not soft add-ons but fundamental components of a functioning and sustainable economy. The episode also digs into what a post-growth pension system might look like in practice. Steve makes the case that pension funds are not just a financial instrument but a political one, and potentially a powerful lever for change. Pensioners sit on boards of trustees. They are also voters. That combination, he argues, is deeply underestimated. The episode does not offer easy answers, but it reframes the question in a way that feels both urgent and, oddly, hopeful. ---------------------------------------- Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy [https://acast.com/privacy] for more information.

Business transformation in Japan and migration with Joel & Sasja

While the rest of the world debates whether to take sustainability seriously, Japan is quietly getting on with it. In this episode, your co-host Sasja takes centre stage. Based part-time in Tokyo, where he manages Japan's first domestically-run mid-cap impact fund, Sasja brings four years of on-the-ground experience to one of the world's most underreported sustainability stories. We explore the physical reality of climate change hitting Japan right now, why Japanese companies are building ESG equity stories that outpace Europe, and what a warming world means for the one thing no politician wants to talk about: mass migration. The future won't wait. Neither should you. ---------------------------------------- Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy [https://acast.com/privacy] for more information.

Regenerative Business Models & Growth Potential with Joel & Carolina

In this episode, Joel and Carolina explore the green transition from a growth perspective. From China's record-breaking solar installations to India's emergence as a global scaling platform for climate technologies, the shift toward a cleaner economy is accelerating, just not where most people are looking. We also dig into why Western economies remain stuck in fossil fuel dependency despite the obvious strategic and economic case for renewables, and what it will take to break free from legacy thinking. At the heart of the conversation is the idea of regenerative business, moving beyond ESG checklists and "doing less harm" toward business models that actively restore ecological, social, and economic systems. We look at real companies already doing this: from flooring to offshore wind to space-based Earth observation. We also discuss the potential of more accurate and precise metrics for impact and fewer but sharper KPI's for business transformation. ---------------------------------------- Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy [https://acast.com/privacy] for more information.