The Immortal Life of Agencies

the7stars' Owner: Being a media indie in 2026 – Jenny Biggam

Today’s guest is Jenny Biggam, Owner of the7stars – and one of the most respected voices in independent media. With 20 years at the helm of the UK’s largest independent media agency, she offers a clear and compelling view of what it really means to stay independent in a market obsessed with scale. She explains how only a purely fee-based model creates true neutrality, why transparency isn’t a slogan but a structural choice, and how partnership sits at the heart of everything the agency does. From working collaboratively with platforms and consultancies, to building creative capability inside a media agency, Jenny shares how the7stars has evolved while staying true to its beliefs. The conversation also explores AI, career acceleration, client in-housing and the risks of agencies describing themselves as ‘platforms’. It’s an optimistic, grounded look at where media agencies are heading and why talent, culture and commercial clarity still matter most. HIGHLIGHTS: [03:33] What partnership really means [08:03] The reality of proprietary media [10:32] Platforms as partners [14:00] Pitching against the giants [19:22] Feedback over flip flopping [25:16] A melting pot of skills [27:20] AI in creative development [29:51] The inverted pyramid shift [33:45] Agencies as platforms explained [36:45] Clients in-housing [39:15] Talent drives renewal MORE ABOUT JENNY: LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/jenny-biggam [https://www.linkedin.com/in/jenny-biggam-6038441/] Website: the7stars.co.uk [https://www.the7stars.co.uk/] HOST SOCIALS: LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonn [https://linkedin.com/in/robinbonn] Twitter: twitter.com/robonn [https://twitter.com/robonn] MORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY: Website: codefinery.com [https://codefinery.com] Book: Market of One [https://marketofone.agency] Mentioned in this episode: Get Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire Is your agency  really as differentiated as you think? And have you fully embraced the commercial disruption that AI is bringing? To find out, take five minutes to complete Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire. It's quick, free, and thought provoking, and you get a tailored report with practical guidance for sharpening your competitive edge. Visit codefinery.com/dq [https://the-immortal-life-of-ag.captivate.fm/dq]

Simbioniq's Co-Founder: Thriving in the AI industrial revolution – Justin Billingsley

Today’s guest is Justin Billingsley, Co-Founder of Symbioniq and former CMO of Publicis Groupe. With his prior client-side career with the likes of Unilever, Coca-Cola and Nokia, Justin brings a rare – and often forthright – perspective on our industry. He reflects on Publicis’ transformation and the criticism their ‘Power of One’ strategy received at the time, despite it now arguably inspiring their HoldCo. competitors. Justin describes navigating that change and why many of the decisions made back then are now proving decisive. We also explore the growing divide between specialist agencies and one-stop shops. Justin explains why the real threat to agencies isn’t their competitors, but platforms, consultancies and clients increasingly building their own capabilities. And of course, AI informs the whole conversation – not least how this new industrial revolution is disrupting certain areas of marketing over others, including market research, where Justin’s AI venture, Simbioniq, is rewriting the playbook. HIGHLIGHTS: [02:56] Lessons from Publicis [07:58] Mystery creates margin [11:38] End to end partners [14:41] The observability problem [18:43] Balancing specialisation [21:16] Ideology as positioning [25:26] The art of choosing [26:08] AI and the iron triangle [31:25] Doctor heal thyself [39:15] Simulating people not data MORE ABOUT JUSTIN: LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/justinbillingsley [https://www.linkedin.com/in/justinbillingsley/] Website: simbioniq.com [https://simbioniq.com/] HOST SOCIALS: LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonn [https://linkedin.com/in/robinbonn] Twitter: twitter.com/robonn [https://twitter.com/robonn] MORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY: Website: codefinery.com [https://codefinery.com] Book: Market of One [https://marketofone.agency] Mentioned in this episode: Get Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire Is your agency  really as differentiated as you think? And have you fully embraced the commercial disruption that AI is bringing? To find out, take five minutes to complete Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire. It's quick, free, and thought provoking, and you get a tailored report with practical guidance for sharpening your competitive edge. Visit codefinery.com/dq [https://the-immortal-life-of-ag.captivate.fm/dq]

MSQ's Executive Director: Growth in the ‘Goldilocks’ zone – Ben Rudman

Today’s guest is Ben Rudman, Executive Director at MSQ, one of the fastest growing, private equity backed marketing services groups, positioning itself between the traditional holding companies and independent agencies. Ben shares why the agency model is at a pivotal moment, as AI accelerates the shift from selling time to selling outcomes, products and packaged services. He explains how MSQ has scaled to nearly 2,000 people while maintaining their entrepreneurial agility, and why client-centricity must be behavioural, not rhetorical. The conversation explores the so-called Goldilocks zone between scale and flexibility, the realities of working with procurement, and why agencies must align commercial models to client goals from the outset, rather than retrofit them later. With refreshing honesty, Ben reflects on what hasn’t yet been cracked, the talent challenges AI presents, and why creativity and ideas remain the industry’s enduring advantage. HIGHLIGHTS: [02:25] Scaling MSQ [05:11] Revenue beyond headcount [10:07] Uncertainty driving change [13:33] Aligning to outcomes [18:04] Commercial momentum model [22:50] Client centricity by design [25:51] Creating a Market of One [31:33] Building the AI backbone [33:57] Behaviour shapes culture [39:00] Charging for ideas MORE ABOUT BEN: LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/benrudman [https://www.linkedin.com/in/benrudman/] Website: msqpartners.com [https://www.msqpartners.com/] HOST SOCIALS: LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonn [https://linkedin.com/in/robinbonn] Twitter: twitter.com/robonn [https://twitter.com/robonn] MORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY: Website: codefinery.com [https://codefinery.com] Book: Market of One [https://marketofone.agency] Mentioned in this episode: Get Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire Is your agency  really as differentiated as you think? And have you fully embraced the commercial disruption that AI is bringing? To find out, take five minutes to complete Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire. It's quick, free, and thought provoking, and you get a tailored report with practical guidance for sharpening your competitive edge. Visit codefinery.com/dq [https://the-immortal-life-of-ag.captivate.fm/dq]

M+C Saatchi Group's Global CEO: When a client CMO leads an agency – Zaid Al-Qassab

Today’s guest is Zaid Al-Qassab, Global CEO of M+C Saatchi Group. Fascinatingly, having been client-side CMO with the likes of P&G, BT and Channel 4, this is his first agency role. So his rare perspective is gold dust. Zaid explains why agencies must stop talking to themselves and start truly understanding the complexity faced by modern CMOs – not least how the old brief-led model is being replaced by the need for orchestration. He shares how M+C Saatchi has repositioned itself around ‘Cultural Power’ and why that can – and should – be measurable. The conversation also explores AI, productisation and why agency leaders must make a stronger case for embracing a changing market. HIGHLIGHTS: [03:00] Agency navel gazing [06:28] Treating agencies as partners [07:47] Searching for a new model [11:14] Flexible orchestration [14:08] A former CMO’s advantage [17:32] The Goldilocks zone [22:22] Cultural Power as a proposition [30:35] AI as a democratizer [36:01] AI and the future of work [38:06] Three things that matter MORE ABOUT ZAID: LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/zaid-al-qassab [https://www.linkedin.com/in/zaid-al-qassab-366a2a/] HOST SOCIALS: LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonn [https://linkedin.com/in/robinbonn] Twitter: twitter.com/robonn [https://twitter.com/robonn] MORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY: Website: codefinery.com [https://codefinery.com] Book: Market of One [https://marketofone.agency] Mentioned in this episode: Get Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire Is your agency  really as differentiated as you think? And have you fully embraced the commercial disruption that AI is bringing? To find out, take five minutes to complete Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire. It's quick, free, and thought provoking, and you get a tailored report with practical guidance for sharpening your competitive edge. Visit codefinery.com/dq [https://the-immortal-life-of-ag.captivate.fm/dq]

Code and Theory's CCO: Raising the bar for customer experience – Craig Elimeliah

Today's guest is Craig Elimeliah, Chief Creative Officer at Code and Theory, sharing his passion for why technology and creativity must go hand in hand. In his view, clients have been carrying the burden of fragmentation for far too long. That’s why his role blends engineering, strategy and craft to help clients navigate modern complexity. The discussion also explores Stagwell’s orchestration platform, The Machine, and how it’s reshaping integration across the marketing lifecycle. And perhaps most provocatively, Craig challenges our industry’s obsession with scale. If bigger isn’t always better, then agility and systems thinking matter far more. HIGHLIGHTS: [02:29] Inseparable disciplines [04:28] Thinking like architects [07:35] Creativity as change [17:25] AI as creative accelerator [22:59] Platformisation of holdcos [26:14] Evolving business models [30:13] Agentic operating systems [36:05] Knowing what to automate [42:31] Mediocrity scales exponentially MORE ABOUT CRAIG: LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/craigelimeliah [https://www.linkedin.com/in/craigelimeliah/] Website: codeandtheory.com [https://www.codeandtheory.com/] HOST SOCIALS: LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonn [https://linkedin.com/in/robinbonn] Twitter: twitter.com/robonn [https://twitter.com/robonn] MORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY: Website: codefinery.com [https://codefinery.com] Book: Market of One [https://marketofone.agency] Mentioned in this episode: Get Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire Is your agency  really as differentiated as you think? And have you fully embraced the commercial disruption that AI is bringing? To find out, take five minutes to complete Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire. It's quick, free, and thought provoking, and you get a tailored report with practical guidance for sharpening your competitive edge. Visit codefinery.com/dq [https://the-immortal-life-of-ag.captivate.fm/dq]