Starbucks Follow-Up with Zoran Svetlicic

Go “Pro” in Every Product Category or Just “Good Enough”?

A question from a previous guest sparks this episode: Do we go “pro” in every product category or do we eschew the spec arms race & embrace “good enough”? We interrogate our own behaviors & share implications for people in the business of making products. INTRO & FOLLOW-UPS – 02:51 Starbucks Follow-Up with Zoran Svetlicic [https://learnmakelearn.buzzsprout.com/2299404/episodes/18101708-starbucks-follow-up-with-zoran-svetlicic] Generative AI x Product with Anmol Anubhai [https://learnmakelearn.buzzsprout.com/2299404/episodes/15433541-generative-ai-x-product-with-anmol-anubhai] What McDonald’s is REALLY Like in Italy [https://youtu.be/Nc20Dy1h1Kg?si=uW-oXxe7eNz9y8xp] How to Try Int’l McDonald’s Menu Items in the US [https://www.foodandwine.com/mcdonalds-global-menu-restaurant-chicago-8728683] JOACHIM’S PROFILE PREFS FOR CLAUDE – 07:40 J’s TAKE: A PORTFOLIO APPROACH – 16:40 Testing the Same Products from 1975 and 2025 [https://youtu.be/I4C62HC1HSo?si=dU5uXFAbHMQ9K2Yg] SHEIN's plan to take over FASHION [https://youtu.be/ClohMVBSUeQ?si=J3eg2DsQor9ZhJge] E’s TAKE: SPECIALISTS OVER GENERALISTS – 27:03 Do Pharmacists Buy Bayer? Informed Shoppers and the Brand Premium [https://web.stanford.edu/~gentzkow/research/generics.pdf] Why Doesn't Everybody Buy Cheap, Generic Headache Medicine? [https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2013/07/05/198504001/why-doesnt-everybody-buy-cheap-generic-headache-medicine] The Secrets of Shopping [https://www.chicagobooth.edu/review/secrets-of-shopping] The Rise of Indie Running Brands [https://run.outsideonline.com/gear/the-rise-of-indie-running-brands/] SPECIALIZATION vs HYPERGROWTH – 34:43 How I Built This: Tim Leatherman [https://www.npr.org/2022/01/28/1076433969/leatherman-tool-group-tim-leatherman] Pelican’s Indestructible Cases [https://www.insidehook.com/style/review-pelican-solves-the-modern-luggage-nightmare] The Furniture Systems Of USM Haller [https://www.ignant.com/2017/05/03/the-philosophical-furniture-systems-of-usm-haller/] LESSONS FOR PRODUCT PEOPLE – 42:12 Military can’t repair its own equipment [https://www.stripes.com/theaters/us/2025-12-09/defense-policy-bill-right-to-repair-20036995.html] Bad Dye Job [https://daringfireball.net/2025/12/bad_dye_job] RECOMMENDATIONS – 48:33 The Enshittifinancial Crisis [https://www.wheresyoured.at/the-enshittifinancial-crisis/] Matthew Wilcock: 058 Motorway Cycle XI [https://www.instagram.com/p/DOgHmxvCCfm/] FlowingData: Best Data Visualizations of 2025 [https://flowingdata.com/2025/12/31/best-data-visualization-2025/] Notion [https://www.notion.com/] Phantom Thread [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phantom_Thread] Dior and I [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dior_and_I] on Apple TV [https://tv.apple.com/us/movie/dior-and-i/umc.cmc.65fnjizmozfcfooxdna9jqlzx] & YouTube [https://youtu.be/Sd_qAzoCpiI?si=QUyV0h_ND243rRzh] Sentimental Value [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sentimental_Value] CLOSING – 01:00:02 **** Rant, rave or otherwise via email at LearnMakeLearn@gmail.com or on Threads @LearnMakeLearnShow [https://www.threads.net/@learnmakelearnshow]. CREDITS Theme: Vendla / Today Is a Good Day / courtesy of www.epidemicsound.com [http://www.epidemicsound.com/] Drum hit: PREL / Musical Element 85 / courtesy of www.epidemicsound.com [http://www.epidemicsound.com/]

Putting Your Weird to Work with the Co-Directors of The Brand Studios Program at CU Boulder

We get the inside scoop on The Brand Studios master’s program at CU Boulder from its co-directors, Parisa Tashakori & Jeff Gillette. Unique in its accelerated 12-month span & remit across both experience design and creative advertising, the program welcomes those with a passion to “put your weird to work.” Is it right for you? INTRO & FOLLOW-UPS – 00:55 Why is Design So Boring? with Nate Grubbs [https://learnmakelearn.buzzsprout.com/2299404/episodes/15946360-why-is-design-so-boring-with-nate-grubbs] LAP Coffee [https://www.lap.coffee/] The LAP coffee Berlin backlash: when innovation meets resistance [https://tech.eu/2025/09/09/the-lap-coffee-berlin-backlash-when-innovation-meets-resistance/] Ernest to present at Creative Mornings on Dec. 12th [https://creativemornings.com/cities/pdx] MEET PARISA TASHAKORI & JEFF GILLETTE – 10:07 Parisa’s faculty profile [https://www.colorado.edu/cmdi/people/advertising-public-relations-and-media-design/parisa-tashakori] Jeff’s faculty profile [https://www.colorado.edu/cmdi/people/advertising-public-relations-and-media-design/jeff-gillette] ON ACADEMIA VS AGENCY LIFE – 13:52 Higher ed must do more to support teaching [https://www.insidehighered.com/opinion/career-advice/teaching/2022/11/30/higher-education-must-do-more-support-and-value-teaching] THE BRAND STUDIOS: THE WHAT & THE WHY – 19:11 The Brand Studios at CU Boulder [https://www.colorado.edu/thebrandstudios/] AdAge: New portfolio school aims to fill a widening gap in training junior ad professionals in the wake of AI [https://adage.com/career-development/education/aa-new-portfolio-school-at-univeristy-of-colorado-boulder/] (paywall) WHO IS THE PROGRAM FOR? – 36:34 The Students [https://www.colorado.edu/thebrandstudios/thestudents] ON STAYING SMALL & HUMAN – 41:09 GEN AI & BETTING ON CREATIVITY – 49:22 John Maeda on the Design Better podcast [https://designbetterpodcast.com/p/john-maeda-ai-design] Cory Doctorow: Reverse centaurs are the answer to the AI paradox [https://doctorow.medium.com/https-pluralistic-net-2025-09-11-vulgar-thatcherism-there-is-an-alternative-f1428b42a8fd] WEIRDOS WELCOME & HOW TO APPLY – 56:43 Ready to apply? [https://www.colorado.edu/thebrandstudios/apply] RECOMMENDATIONS – 01:01:55 Parisa: The Collaborative Habit [https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/The-Collaborative-Habit/Twyla-Tharp/9781416576518] Jeff: The Art of Whittling [https://www.headline.co.uk/titles/niklas-karlsson-2/the-art-of-whittling/9781802792133/] & Atomic Habits [https://jamesclear.com/atomic-habits] Joachim: BOSS Katana-AIR EX [https://www.boss.info/global/products/katana-air_ex/] & Swag Lee’s Habibi Loops [https://cdm.link/swag-lee-habibi-loops-2/] Ernest: Hamnet [https://www.maggieofarrell.com/titles/maggie-ofarrell/hamnet/9781472223821/] (the novel), Lavinia [https://www.ursulakleguin.com/lavinia] & A Larger Reality [https://www.oregoncontemporary.org/a-larger-reality] at Ox CLOSING – 01:13:26 **** Rant, rave or otherwise via email at LearnMakeLearn@gmail.com or on Threads @LearnMakeLearnShow [https://www.threads.net/@learnmakelearnshow]. CREDITS Theme: Vendla / Today Is a Good Day / courtesy of www.epidemicsound.com [http://www.epidemicsound.com/] Drum hit: PREL / Musical Element 85 / courtesy of www.epidemicsound.com [http://www.epidemicsound.com/]

Starbucks Follow-Up with Zoran Svetlicic

We're joined by Zoran Svetlicic for this fast follow-up to our previous episode on Starbucks’ struggles. A strategist & builder with deep expertise in brand and food & beverage, Zoran pulls no punches in his diagnosis of Starbucks’ ills. And, along the way, schools us on positioning, brand architecture & natural wine. INTRO & FOLLOW-UPS – 00:39 Starbucks’ Struggles and Lessons for Product People [https://learnmakelearn.buzzsprout.com/2299404/episodes/18005908-starbucks-struggles-lessons-for-product-people] MEET ZORAN + CONTEXT SETTING – 04:09 Zoran Svetlicic on LinkedIn [https://www.linkedin.com/in/svetlicic/] Third-Wave Coffee [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third-wave_coffee] NYT Books review of Seeing Like a State [https://archive.nytimes.com/www.nytimes.com/books/first/s/scott-state.html] DIAGNOSING STARBUCKS’ STRUGGLES – 11:56 Mark Ritson: Starbucks needs to cut the crap from its brand positioning [https://www.marketingweek.com/ritson-starbucks-brand-positioning/] Brand Architecture [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brand_architecture] Nestlé Takes Majority Stake in Blue Bottle [https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/14/business/dealbook/nestle-blue-bottle-coffee.html] (paywall) STARBUCKS RESERVE STRATEGY – 25:17 What is the Starbucks Reserve brand — and where is it going? [https://www.nrn.com/beverage-trends/explainer-what-is-the-starbucks-reserve-brand-and-where-is-it-going-] Traditional vs. Occasion-Based Segmentation [https://escalent.co/blog/occasion-based-segmentation-the-better-choice-when-consumers-engage-with-your-brand-frequently/] HETEROGENEITY AT SCALE: McDONALD’S – 32:45 McD’s passes Starbucks as world’s most valuable restaurant brand [https://www.nrn.com/restaurant-finance/mcdonald-s-passes-starbucks-as-the-world-s-most-valuable-restaurant-brand] McD’s Just Dropped a Happy Meal Collab Straight Out of the ’90s [https://www.complex.com/pop-culture/a/lucille-barilla/mcdonalds-just-dropped-a-happy-meal-collab-straight-out-of-the-90s] Why The French Love American Fast Food [https://youtu.be/FcP0mzWFCQU?si=6AQujHESRFHK6yYk] For Some Travelers, McD’s Is a Destination [https://www.nytimes.com/2025/01/28/travel/mcdonalds-international-locations-menu.html] (paywall) GLOBAL + LOCAL: COCA-COLA – 42:12 Coca-Cola Visual ID: Before & After [https://www.jkwarner.com/coca-cola] We leverage design to create simplicity: David Butler [https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/we-leverage-design-to-create-simplicity-david-butler/articleshow/6192310.cms] Share a Coke campaign learnings [https://www.theguardian.com/media-network/media-network-blog/2013/jul/24/share-coke-teach-brands] LESSONS FROM NATURAL WINE – 55:31 RECOMMENDATIONS – 01:05:16 Raisin [https://www.raisin.digital] Piquentum Wines [https://www.piquentum.com] & Label [https://sonda.hr/piquentum-sv-vital-nature-speaks-out-through-label/] UNSTUCK newsletter [https://unstuck.ghost.io] M5Stack Core2 [https://shop.m5stack.com/products/m5stack-core2-esp32-iot-development-kit] Yowana [https://www.youtube.com/@supwell] & Supwell [https://www.supwell.com] CLOSING – 01:17:36 **** Rant, rave or otherwise via email at LearnMakeLearn@gmail.com or on Threads @LearnMakeLearnShow [https://www.threads.net/@learnmakelearnshow]. CREDITS Theme: Vendla / Today Is a Good Day / courtesy of www.epidemicsound.com [http://www.epidemicsound.com/] Drum hit: PREL / Musical Element 85 / courtesy of www.epidemicsound.com [http://www.epidemicsound.com/]

Starbucks’ Struggles & Lessons for Product People

What can product people learn from Starbucks’ recent struggles, and how are these lessons linked to a venerable British book retailer, an upstart French running brand, and a barmy Japanese watchmaker? INTRO & FOLLOW-UPS – 02:47 Starbucks closing stores [https://www.reuters.com/business/starbucks-close-some-stores-part-restructuring-plan-2025-09-25/] SPVs, Credit, and AI Datacenters [https://paulkedrosky.com/weekend-reading-plus-spvs-meta-and-fiber-buildout-2-0/] This is How the AI Bubble Will Pop [https://www.derekthompson.org/p/this-is-how-the-ai-bubble-will-pop] Neue Klasse – 60 Years of the BMW 1500 [https://carslesstraveled.com/2021/09/07/neue-klasse-60-years-of-the-bmw-1500/] World Premiere of the new BMW iX3 [https://www.youtube.com/live/tRA3B-w7BUY?si=KovGEB3_SF53MHBB] BMW Hofmeister Knick—Behind the Lines [https://www.motortrend.com/features/1502-bmw-hofmesiter-kink-design-history] STARBUCKS’ STRUGGLES – 14:08 No Logo at 20 [https://www.theguardian.com/books/2019/aug/11/no-logo-naomi-klein-20-years-on-interview] Globalization and Its Discontents [https://wwnorton.com/books/globalization-and-its-discontents/] The Walmart Effect [https://www.theatlantic.com/economy/archive/2024/12/walmart-prices-poverty-economy/681122/] 100 Cups of Coffee in a City on Fire [https://slate.com/life/2025/09/portland-oregon-trump-national-guard-best-coffee-shops.html] ANTI-HOMOGENEITY FTW – 21:08 Why high street coffee chains may have had their day [https://theweek.com/culture-life/food-drink/why-high-street-coffee-chains-may-have-had-their-day] Why Are Independent Coffee Shops Succeeding? [https://modernrestaurantmanagement.com/why-are-independent-coffee-shops-succeeding/] Starbucks' Digital Dilemma [https://www.readtrung.com/p/starbucks-digital-dilemna] LESSONS FOR PRODUCT PEOPLE – 36:00 Seeing Like a State [https://yalebooks.yale.edu/book/9780300246759/seeing-like-a-state/] Metis matters [https://medium.com/p/6a48270c2731] Lessons learnt from Waterstones’ turnaround [https://medium.com/p/10fa83f92f37] Personality Disorders and Culture [https://archive.org/details/personalitydisor0000alar/] SATISFY [https://satisfyrunning.com/] How Satisfy Got the Cool Kids Into Running [https://www.esquire.com/uk/style/fashion/a62553525/satisfy-interview/] Ernest’s G-SHOCK Frogman [https://www.casio.com/jp/watches/gshock/product.GW-8200K-9/] Ibe Kikuo and the Development of the G-Shock [https://www.nippon.com/en/japan-topics/g01192/] G-SHOCK GA-V01 [https://gshock.casio.com/jp/products/others/ga-v01/] RECOMMENDATIONS – 57:19 Alien: Earth [https://www.fxnetworks.com/shows/alien-earth] Alien: Earth soundtrack [https://www.nme.com/features/tv-interviews/alien-earth-theme-song-soundtrack-black-sabbath-classic-rock-3889180] The Ballad of Wallis Island [https://theconversation.com/the-ballad-of-wallis-island-is-a-masterpiece-of-the-extraordinary-made-ordinary-259635] Charlie Brooker’s Screenwipe [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Brooker%27s_Screenwipe] CLOSING – 01:11:08 **** Rant, rave or otherwise via email at LearnMakeLearn@gmail.com or on Threads @LearnMakeLearnShow [https://www.threads.net/@learnmakelearnshow]. CREDITS Theme: Vendla / Today Is a Good Day / courtesy of www.epidemicsound.com [http://www.epidemicsound.com/] Drum hit: PREL / Musical Element 85 / courtesy of www.epidemicsound.com [http://www.epidemicsound.com/]

Toolbox: Raymond Loewy & the MAYA Principle

Ernest & Joachim go deep on Raymond Loewy’s MAYA Principle: what it is & why it matters, with real world examples of MAYA in action, and what can happen when product teams fail to take the principle to heart. FOLLOW-UPS – 01:00 Toolbox: How “Jobs To Be Done” Can Help You Make, Better [https://learnmakelearn.buzzsprout.com/2299404/episodes/14367154-toolbox-how-jobs-to-be-done-can-help-you-make-better] Fortis Marinemaster [https://www.fortis-swiss.com/collections/marinemaster-collection] A BRIEF INTRO TO RAYMOND LOEWY – 06:04 MoMA on Raymond Loewy [https://www.moma.org/artists/9768-raymond-loewy] 60 Minutes: Raymond Loewy, Father of Industrial Design [https://youtu.be/Zci4r1MWz7c?si=L0jxE6sRHMFl0ugo] LOEWY’S MAYA PRINCIPLE – 09:07 The MAYA Principle in Design [https://www.visionsdesign.co.uk/news/the-maya-principle-in-design] The iPhone only exists because Steve Jobs ‘hated this guy at Microsoft’ [https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/jun/21/apple-iphone-steve-jobs-hated-guy-microsoft-says-scott-forstall] Phil Knight: Shoe Dog [https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/Shoe-Dog/Phil-Knight/9781501135927] How One Designer Saved Tesla From Bankruptcy TWICE [https://youtu.be/34eyFKdGUl4?si=ky3qhOeyGvAaVd8J] IS MAYA INHERENTLY CONSERVATIVE? – 19:36 Apple and the MAYA Principle [https://www.interaction-design.org/literature/article/design-for-the-future-but-balance-it-with-your-users-present] Remembering Apple’s Newton, 30 years on [https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/06/remembering-apples-newton-30-years-on/] MUST BE ROOTED IN EMPATHY & COMPASSION – 24:44 Raymond Loewy and the Skylab Window [https://scalar.usc.edu/works/art--engineering-in-the-space-industry/raymond-lowley-and-the-skylab-window-humanizing-habitability-design] APPLICATIONS BEYOND PRODUCT – 28:20 The Secret Tesla Motors Master Plan [https://web.archive.org/web/20240405170832/https://www.tesla.com/blog/secret-tesla-motors-master-plan-just-between-you-and-me] (via Wayback Machine) BMW Is a Surprise Winner in Electric Vehicles [https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/09/business/bmw-electric-vehicles.html] (paywall) Goodbye to the BMW i3—an Icon of the 21st Century [https://www.wired.com/story/goodbye-bmw-i3-21st-century-icon/] (paywall) The Newton Messagepad was Well Ahead of its Time [https://eshop.macsales.com/blog/64664-apple-newton-messagepad] General Magic documentary [https://www.generalmagicthemovie.com] Intellectual Distance, Novelty, and Resource Allocation in Science [https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC5062254/] RECOMMENDATIONS – 42:48 Patrick McGee: Apple in China [https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/Apple-in-China/Patrick-McGee/9781668053379] Hidden Forces podcast: Patrick McGee [https://hiddenforces.io/podcasts/dangerous-dependency-apple-rise-of-china-patrick-mcgee/] EBL rechargeable AA batteries [https://www.nytimes.com/wirecutter/reviews/best-rechargeable-batteries/] (link to Wirecutter review) CLOSING – 49:34 **** Rant, rave or otherwise via email at LearnMakeLearn@gmail.com or on Threads @LearnMakeLearnShow [https://www.threads.net/@learnmakelearnshow]. CREDITS Theme: Vendla / Today Is a Good Day / courtesy of www.epidemicsound.com [http://www.epidemicsound.com/] Drum hit: PREL / Musical Element 85 / courtesy of www.epidemicsound.com [http://www.epidemicsound.com/]