Just When I Thought It Couldn’t Get Worse: Debra Kaplan and The Hidden Relationship Between Financial Infidelity and Sexual Betrayal | Rise Season 2, Episode 24

Healing After Betrayal From Within: A Mindfulness Approach With Dallin Brunn, MBSR (Rise Season 2, Episode 26)

When betrayal shatters your reality, it's natural to look outward for safety. But safety can be difficult to find when you feel disconnected from yourself, questioning your instincts, doubting your reality, and struggling to regulate overwhelming emotions. What if healing begins by learning to trust yourself again? Healing doesn't begin by controlling your emotions—it begins by changing your relationship with them. In this episode of Rise: Hope and Healing After Sexual Betrayal, host MaryAnn Michaelis, LICSW, CSAT, CPTT, welcomes mindfulness expert and therapist Dallin Bruun, AMFT, MBSR, for an inspiring conversation about using mindfulness to recover from betrayal trauma. Together they explore why mindfulness isn't simply meditation—it's learning to meet your pain with curiosity, compassion, and presence instead of fear or avoidance. Dallin explains how betrayal activates survival responses like fight, flight, and dissociation, and how mindfulness gently teaches the nervous system that safety can begin from within. You'll also hear practical ways to begin reconnecting with yourself through breath, body awareness, self-compassion, and simple grounding practices that anyone can begin today. Whether you're newly navigating discovery or further along your healing journey, this episode offers hope that trusting yourself again is possible. In This Episode You'll Learn * Why betrayal trauma disrupts self-trust * The difference between reacting and responding * How mindfulness calms the nervous system * Why your body holds emotional pain * How self-compassion helps heal betrayal trauma * Practical mindfulness exercises for emotional regulation * Why awareness—not fixing—is often the beginning of healing * How to reconnect with your intuition after gaslighting * Gentle grounding techniques you can practice today * Why healing starts with your relationship to yourself Memorable Quote "You can become the source of the safety, compassion, and trust you've been searching for." Resources Mentioned * Tara Brach and the RAIN meditation practice * Kristin Neff's Mindful Self-Compassion practices * Mindfulness-Based Stress Reduction (MBSR) * Mindful Self-Compassion (MSC) courses * Somatic approaches for trauma healing Connect with MaryAnn and the Human Intimacy Team If this episode encouraged you, subscribe to Rise: Hope and Healing After Sexual Betrayal, leave a review, and share this episode with someone navigating betrayal trauma. For additional resources, courses, and support for betrayal trauma recovery, visit www.humanintimacy.com [http://www.humanintimacy.com].  If there's a topic you would like us to address, or you would like to share comments, questions or concerns, please send an email to: maryann@humanintimacy.com

How Do You Know When You're Ready For Couples Therapy After Betrayal? An Attachment-Based Conversation with Dan Oakes (Rise 2:25)

How do you know when you are ready for couples therapy after betrayal? An Attachment-Based Conversation with Dan Oakes Healing after betrayal isn't simply about stopping unwanted behaviors—it's about rebuilding safety, restoring attachment, and learning an entirely new way of relating. In this episode, MaryAnn Michaelis, LCSW, CSAT, CPTT, sits down with Dan Oakes, LPC, CSAT, and Certified Sex Offender Treatment Specialist, founder of the Arizona Family Institute, for a thoughtful conversation on what true recovery looks like after sexual betrayal. Through the lens of attachment theory, Dan explains why compulsive sexual behaviors are best understood as disruptions in the attachment system, why couples counseling should never begin too early, and how both partners can begin rebuilding trust. Together they explore why healing isn't about "getting over it," but about creating a relationship where fear can be spoken, received, and soothed. In This Episode You'll Learn * When couples counseling is appropriate—and when it's too soon * The essential conditions that create emotional safety before relationship repair can begin * Why betrayed partners often experience fearful-avoidant attachment after discovery * How betrayal trauma affects the nervous system long after disclosure * Why honesty and transparency matter more than perfection * The difference between traditional couples therapy and betrayal-informed couples therapy * Why healing requires learning entirely new emotional skills * How therapists help couples create corrective emotional experiences that rebuild secure attachment * Why recovery isn't about eliminating fear—but learning how to respond to it together Key Takeaways Recovery Is About More Than Stopping Behaviors Dan explains that compulsive sexual behaviors are often attempts to regulate distress through artificial sources of dopamine rather than healthy human connection. Lasting recovery requires rebuilding the attachment system—not simply relying on willpower. Couples Therapy Requires Readiness Healing together begins only after meaningful safety has been established. This includes honesty, accountability, stabilization of compulsive behaviors, and the betrayed partner feeling ready to begin reconnecting. Betrayal Changes the Attachment System After betrayal, many partners experience fearful-avoidant attachment. They deeply desire closeness while simultaneously experiencing intense fear and nervous system activation around the very person they love. The Nervous System Is Protecting, Not Failing Hypervigilance, intrusive thoughts, sleep disruption, emotional flooding, and avoidance are not signs of weakness—they are adaptive responses designed to keep someone safe after profound relational injury. The Most Powerful Skill in Healing One of Dan's most memorable insights is that long-term healing depends on creating conditions where the betrayed partner feels safe enough to express fear—and where the offending partner actively seeks out that fear with curiosity, compassion, and accountability rather than defensiveness. Recovery Is a Lifelong Practice The goal isn't reaching a point where betrayal is never discussed again. Instead, healthy relationships become places where fears, insecurities, and emotional needs can always be expressed and lovingly received. Memorable Quotes "Secure attachment isn't the absence of fear. It's knowing that when fear shows up, someone will respond." "Healing isn't about never talking about betrayal again. It's about creating a relationship where you always can." "Recovery isn't just solving a problem. It's learning how to build a life together." About Dan Oakes Dan Oakes is a Licensed Professional Counselor, Certified Sex Addiction Therapist (CSAT), and Certified Sex Offender Treatment Specialist. He is the founder and Clinical Director of the Arizona Family Institute in Mesa, Arizona, where he specializes in attachment-based treatment for betrayal trauma, compulsive sexual behaviors, couples healing, and family therapy. Resources Mentioned * Arizona Family Institute [https://www.arizonafamilyinstitute.com/?utm_campaign=gmb&utm_medium=organic&utm_source=google&utm_term=mesa-website] * SHIFT Men's Intensive If this episode encouraged you, please subscribe, leave a review, and share it with someone navigating healing after betrayal. For individual and couple online resources, courses, and support, visit www.humanintimacy.com

Just When I Thought It Couldn’t Get Worse: Debra Kaplan and The Hidden Relationship Between Financial Infidelity and Sexual Betrayal | Rise Season 2, Episode 24

Financial infidelity is a hidden but powerful dimension of betrayal that can significantly intensify the emotional, relational, and financial impact of sexual betrayal. Drawing on her unique background in both Wall Street finance and clinical therapy, guest Debra L. Kaplan, MA, MBA, LPC, PACT-II, CSAT-S joins MaryAnn Michaelis, LCSW, CSAT, CPTT as they explore the often overlooked intersection of financial infidelity and sexual betrayal. This episode sheds light on the profound impacts of financial secrecy, hidden accounts, debt accumulation, and violations of agreed-upon financial boundaries on betrayed partners.  Together, they examine how financial betrayal impacts not only trust and emotional safety, but also financial security, stability, and long-term planning, often leaving betrayed partners overwhelmed and unsure of where to begin. This episode also offers practical, grounded guidance for early discovery—how to begin identifying financial information, what steps to take first, and how to rebuild both emotional and financial self-trust after betrayal. Key Topics Covered Financial Infidelity and Sexual Betrayal Trauma How financial infidelity often co-occurs with sexual betrayal, creating compounded trauma and a deeper sense of destabilization. Why Financial Betrayal Feels So Destabilizing The impact of financial infidelity on safety, security, housing stability, and long-term financial planning. The Spectrum of Financial Infidelity From small undisclosed purchases to major financial abuse including hidden accounts, debt accumulation, and misuse of shared assets. Financial Secrecy vs Financial Privacy Understanding the difference between healthy financial autonomy and harmful secrecy within relationships. Financial Abuse and Control Dynamics How financial abuse may involve restricting access to funds, manipulating accounts, or covertly shifting financial responsibility or debt. First Steps After Discovery Practical initial steps for betrayed partners including accessing bank records, gathering financial documentation, and seeking legal or financial consultation when appropriate. Rebuilding Financial Self-Trust How individuals begin restoring confidence, agency, and clarity after financial betrayal and relational destabilization. About the Guest Debra L. Kaplan, MA, MBA, LPC, PACT-II, CSAT-S, is an author, speaker, and licensed therapist specializing in sexual addiction/compulsivity, sexual and financial infidelity, and relational trauma. After a career on Wall Street, Ms. Kaplan transitioned into psychology, integrating her financial expertise with clinical practice. She is the author of: * For Love and Money: Exploring Sexual & Financial Betrayal in Relationships * Battle of the Titans: Mastering the Forces of Sex, Money, and Power in Relationships * Coupleship Inc: From Financial Conflict to Financial Intimacy (Lead Author) She facilitates workshops, trainings, and intensives focused on emotional, sexual, and financial intimacy, helping clients and couples rebuild trust after betrayal. Contact Information (Guest) Debra L. Kaplan (she/her/hers) MA, MBA, LPC, PACT-II, CSAT-S ✉️ www.debrakaplancounseling.com [http://www.debrakaplancounseling.com] About the Host MaryAnn Michaelis, LCSW, CSAT, CPTT is the host of Rise: Hope and Healing After Sexual Betrayal. She specializes in betrayal trauma, sexual addiction recovery, and relational healing using trauma-informed, attachment-based approaches to support individuals and couples rebuilding trust after betrayal.

Braving with Michelle Mays: Attachment, Identity, Belonging, Self-Trust, and the Betrayal Bind | Rise Season 2, Episode 23

In this episode of Rise, MaryAnn Michaelis sits down with Michelle Mays for a deeply grounded conversation on BRAVING, attachment injury, identity, belonging, self-trust, and the Betrayal Bind. Michelle Mays is a licensed clinician, betrayal trauma specialist, and the creator of the BRAVING Hope® framework, an attachment-based model for healing after sexual betrayal and relational trauma. Her work helps individuals and couples understand how betrayal impacts the nervous system, attachment systems, identity, and the capacity for self-trust. Together, MaryAnn and Michelle explore how betrayal disrupts not only relationships, but also internal identity structures, emotional safety, and the sense of belonging to self and others. They discuss how the nervous system organizes around attachment injury and why healing requires both relational understanding and internal reconnection. This conversation draws from Michelle’s clinical work, her Braving Hope® immersive program and training model, and her book The Betrayal Bind: How to Heal When the Person You Love the Most Hurts You the Worst, which offers an attachment-based framework for understanding betrayal trauma and the path toward recovery. In this episode, we explore: * The BRAVING framework and what it reveals about attachment injury * Why betrayal trauma disrupts identity and nervous system regulation * The concept of the Betrayal Bind and the “impossible relational dilemma” it creates * How self-trust is fractured in betrayal—and how it is rebuilt over time * Why belonging becomes unstable after relational rupture * The role of attachment systems in trauma responses and healing * How Michelle’s Braving Hope® program supports structured recovery * Clinical insights from The Betrayal Bind and real-world healing pathways Key themes: Attachment trauma • Betrayal trauma • Identity reconstruction • Nervous system regulation • Self-trust • Belonging • BRAVING Hope® framework • The Betrayal Bind • Emotional safety • Relational healing About Michelle Mays Michelle Mays, LPC, CSAT-S, is a clinician, educator, and author specializing in betrayal trauma and attachment injury. She is the creator of the BRAVING Hope® treatment model and immersive program, and the author of The Betrayal Bind: How to Heal When the Person You Love the Most Hurts You the Worst. Her work integrates attachment theory, nervous system science, and clinical experience to help individuals rebuild safety, identity, and self-trust after betrayal. Learn more about her work, programs, and resources at: michellemays.com About the Host MaryAnn Michaelis, LCSW, CSAT, CPTT, is a licensed clinical social worker and trauma therapist specializing in betrayal trauma, sexual addiction, and attachment injury. She is the founder of the HART Recovery Institute and host of Rise: Hope and Healing After Sexual Betrayal, where she explores the lived experience of betrayal trauma and the process of rebuilding identity, self-trust, and relational safety. Her clinical work integrates attachment theory, nervous system science, EMDR, and trauma-informed approaches to support individuals and couples in deep relational healing. About The Betrayal Bind The Betrayal Bind is Michelle Mays’ foundational book on betrayal trauma and attachment injury. It explores the relational paradox at the heart of betrayal: when the person you depend on for safety is also the source of harm. The book offers an attachment-based framework for understanding trauma responses and provides a pathway toward rebuilding self-trust, emotional regulation, and relational clarity. About BRAVING Hope® The Braving Hope® immersive experience is Michelle Mays’ signature program for betrayed partners. It provides structured education and experiential work focused on attachment healing, nervous system regulation, and identity restoration after betrayal trauma. About Rise Rise is a podcast exploring betrayal trauma, attachment injury, and the process of rebuilding identity, self-trust, and connection after relational rupture. Season 2, Episode 23

Betrayal Didn’t Create All of the Pain—It Exposed Old Wounds: Why Healing Requires More Than Understanding the Betrayal with Dr. Karen Strange Rise Season 2, Episode 22

After discovery or disclosure, many betrayed partners find themselves searching for answers. They read books, listen to podcasts, join support groups, and begin learning about betrayal trauma. Yet even with all of that information, many continue to feel overwhelmed, disconnected, and deeply wounded. In this episode of Rise, MaryAnn Michaelis, LCSW, CSAT, CPTT, and Dr. Karen Strange, LMFT, CSAT, CPTT, explore the deeper work of betrayal trauma recovery. They discuss how betrayal impacts identity, confidence, self-worth, and attachment, and why healing often requires more than simply understanding what happened. Together, they explore the connection between present pain and earlier life wounds, the role of support groups and therapy, the challenge of integrating head knowledge into heart healing, and the surprising growth that can emerge through recovery. If you have ever wondered why betrayal feels so devastating—or why healing takes more than time—this conversation offers insight, validation, and hope. In This Episode Why Betrayal Trauma Impacts Identity Betrayal often causes people to question who they are. Many betrayed partners experience significant drops in: * Confidence * Self-worth * Self-trust * Sense of identity * Feelings of attractiveness and value MaryAnn and Karen discuss how betrayal can trigger long-standing insecurities and attachment wounds that may have originated years before the relationship. Understanding Core Beliefs After Betrayal Many betrayed partners find themselves asking: * Was I not enough? * Am I too much? * If I were different, would this have happened? The episode explores how betrayal can activate deeply rooted beliefs formed in childhood, adolescence, or previous relationships, and why identifying those beliefs is a critical part of healing. The Disconnect Between What We Know and What We Feel Many individuals understand intellectually that the betrayal was not caused by their shortcomings. Yet emotionally, they continue to feel defective, unwanted, or unworthy. MaryAnn and Karen discuss: * The gap between head knowledge and emotional healing * Why insight alone does not resolve trauma * How therapy can help uncover the roots of persistent self-doubt * The process of transforming beliefs at a deeper level Healing Attachment Wounds and Past Trauma When Betrayal Reopens Old Wounds One of the most powerful aspects of betrayal trauma is its ability to expose unresolved emotional injuries. The pain of betrayal can reactivate experiences from: * Childhood * Family relationships * School experiences * Previous romantic relationships * Earlier attachment injuries While painful, this process can reveal areas that need healing and provide an opportunity for profound personal growth. Trauma-Focused Therapies That May Help Karen discusses the value of working with trained professionals who understand betrayal trauma and attachment injuries. Approaches may include: * EMDR (Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing) * Accelerated Resolution Therapy (ART) * Attachment-focused therapy * Trauma-informed counseling The Importance of Support in Betrayal Trauma Recovery We Are Wounded in Relationship and Healed in Relationship Healing rarely happens in isolation. Karen emphasizes the importance of: * Betrayal trauma support groups * Trusted friendships * Recovery communities * Healthy therapeutic relationships Supportive relationships can help challenge distorted beliefs and provide encouragement during the healing process. Why Community Matters Many betrayed partners believe they are alone in their experience. In reality, countless others are navigating similar challenges. Being surrounded by people who understand can: * Reduce shame * Increase hope * Provide validation * Create opportunities for growth * Strengthen resilience Learning to Trust Yourself Again One of the most painful consequences of betrayal is the loss of self-trust. Many partners spent years sensing that something was wrong only to be dismissed, denied, or manipulated. MaryAnn and Karen discuss: * Rebuilding confidence in your intuition * Giving yourself the benefit of the doubt * Learning to trust your perceptions again * Strengthening self-awareness and personal boundaries The Role of Self-Care in Recovery A powerful moment in the conversation centers on a simple question: "Who's taking care of you?" For many betrayed partners, self-care has been replaced by caretaking, busyness, and survival. The episode explores: * Why self-care is often neglected * How busyness can become a coping strategy * The importance of addressing your own needs * Creating space for healing and personal growth Growth, Healing, and Hope After Betrayal While no one would choose the pain of betrayal, many people discover unexpected growth through the recovery process. Healing can lead to: * Greater self-awareness * Stronger boundaries * Increased self-trust * Deeper emotional resilience * A clearer sense of identity and purpose Recovery is difficult work, but it can also become a pathway to becoming more grounded, authentic, and connected to yourself. Key Takeaways Betrayal trauma affects much more than the relationship. It can impact identity, confidence, attachment, and self-worth. Healing requires more than information. Understanding betrayal trauma is important, but lasting recovery involves deeper emotional work. Support matters. Therapists, support groups, and trusted relationships can play a vital role in the healing process. Self-trust can be rebuilt. Learning to trust yourself again is one of the most important parts of recovery. Growth is possible. Even in profound pain, healing can lead to greater strength, clarity, and self-understanding. Resources Mentioned Books * The Journey from Abandonment to Healing by Susan Anderson Therapeutic Approaches * EMDR (Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing) * Accelerated Resolution Therapy (ART) Connect With Rise If this episode resonated with you, please subscribe, leave a review, and share it with someone who may benefit from this conversation. Healing happens in connection, and no one should have to walk this journey alone.