Cover image of show Justice Then, Justice Now

Justice Then, Justice Now

Podcast by Tobias Roche, Evelyn Bozon Pappa

English

True crime & mysteries

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About Justice Then, Justice Now

This podcast explores the American criminal justice system from all angles, including perspectives from: law enforcement, prosecution, inmates, fugitives and everything in between.

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20 episodes

episode Ep 20: Robert Almonte - Policing Border Challenges and Combating Cartels artwork

Ep 20: Robert Almonte - Policing Border Challenges and Combating Cartels

This episode we welcome the esteemed Robert Almonte, a veteran with decades under his belt and a wealth of experience to share. From his beginnings at the El Paso Police Department to his impactful tenure as the U.S. Marshal for the Western District of Texas, Robert offers a riveting exploration of the highs and lows of a career dedicated to community safety. Prepare to be inspired by his journey from patrol officer to deputy chief, and eventually leading the Lone Star Fugitive Task Force, where his leadership made a profound difference. Dive into the intricate realities of policing in border towns like El Paso, where unique challenges shape the landscape. Robert provides a candid look at issues faced by officers due to proximity to the Mexican border, including the pressures of shift work and the complexities of undercover operations. He sheds light on the rise of gangs like the Tren de Aragua and their connections to Mexican cartels, emphasizing the urgent need for effective training to combat these threats. Through stories of both peril and progress, this episode unpacks the multifaceted nature of law enforcement. Join us as we also discuss Robert's reflections on the broader implications of drug trafficking, corruption, and the evolving gang landscape in America. From the influence of notorious figures like Pablo Escobar to the heroic story of Kiki Camarena, we explore the far-reaching impact of these elements on law enforcement. Stay tuned for insights into upcoming events like the International Summit for Mexican Cartels and Gangs, where experts are coming together to arm officers with the knowledge they need to face modern-day challenges. Produced by: Citrustream, LLC

16 Oct 2024 - 1 h 13 min
episode Ep 19: Leon Ives - Counterintelligence, Cartels, and Child Safety Insights artwork

Ep 19: Leon Ives - Counterintelligence, Cartels, and Child Safety Insights

Join us for a captivating conversation with Leon Ives, who brings an extraordinary wealth of experience from his days as a U.S. Army military policeman to his intricate work with U.S. Customs. Leon’s journey through the world of counterintelligence and international drug trafficking investigations offers a rare glimpse into the life of a law enforcement professional navigating the complex, often dangerous terrains of Miami and beyond. We promise that by listening, you’ll gain valuable insights into the realities of undercover operations, the challenges posed by international smuggling, and the relentless fight against financial crimes. Our discussion ventures into Leon’s compelling narrative about tackling major drug cartels, including a riveting case involving the Hell's Angels. Leon recounts the trials and triumphs of working with major agencies like the DEA and FBI in the high-stakes environment of Miami. He also shares eye-opening stories about corruption within law enforcement circles and the innovative strategies used to combat financial crimes. This episode doesn’t just highlight high-profile cases but also delves into the personal aspects of Leon’s career, including moves influenced by post-9/11 security expansions and the pursuit of retirement benefits. In the latter part of our session, Leon opens up about the pressing issue of missing children—a topic he passionately addresses in his book, "Vanished and Missing." He shares practical advice for parents on how to protect their families, emphasizing the importance of preparedness and regular training. The conversation extends to Leon’s personal experiences of international travel and his reflections on current border issues, providing listeners with a genuine and informed perspective. This episode promises to leave you with a deeper understanding of law enforcement challenges and practical strategies to ensure family safety. Produced by: Citrustream, LLC

8 Oct 2024 - 1 h 2 min
episode Ep 18: Billy Dekle - Navigating Danger and Redemption artwork

Ep 18: Billy Dekle - Navigating Danger and Redemption

Billy Dekle, famously known as Gringo Billy, takes us on an exhilarating and heart-wrenching ride through his life, from a humble farm boy to an infamous drug smuggler and now an author. In this episode, Billy reveals his journey, recounting his early years in Union County, his passionate pursuit of flying, and the moral dilemmas he faced when he first encountered the world of airborne smuggling. He shares not only his thrilling adventures but also the dangerous reality of the trade, including run-ins with severe weather, mechanical failures, and tense moments of low visibility. Billy's captivating anecdotes transport us to the perilous 1970s, where he navigated the treacherous logistics of smuggling, encountered notorious figures like Fabio Ochoa and Carlos Lehder, and faced the inevitable law enforcement scrutiny. He doesn't shy away from discussing the complex legal battles that followed, detailing strategic maneuvers that led to reduced sentences and his eventual clemency release. His narrative also explores the emotional and ethical struggles of living as a fugitive and the personal toll of such a high-risk lifestyle. In a poignant conclusion, Billy opens up about family, the joys of grand-parenting, and his aspirations for the future. Sharing stories about his grandchildren and reflecting on the happiness they bring, he offers a glimpse into the more personal side of his life. Through continuous learning and storytelling, Billy finds a path to redemption, providing a powerful reminder of the resilience and strength it takes to rebuild one's life. Join us for a remarkable episode that blends thrilling escapades with heartfelt reflections, showcasing the man behind the moniker Gringo Billy. Produced by: Citrustream, LLC

1 Oct 2024 - 2 h 0 min
episode Ep 17 - Ken Cates: Border Skies and Smuggling Takedowns artwork

Ep 17 - Ken Cates: Border Skies and Smuggling Takedowns

In this episode we learn how someone with aspirations of becoming a high school history teacher from Mesquite, Texas ended up chasing drug smugglers in the skies over the U.S.-Mexico border? Veteran federal agent Ken Cates shares his extraordinary journey from aspiring educator to DEA and ATF operative, revealing the twists of fate that led him to a distinguished career in law enforcement. Ken's compelling stories offer a ground-level look at the unique challenges of working the southwestern border, and how the Vietnam Veterans Readjustment Act program unexpectedly set him on this path. Ken pulls back the curtain on high-stakes undercover operations and the crucial role of informants in generating cases, and the infiltration of dangerous groups like the Aryan Nation. We delve into the camaraderie among agents, their collaboration with the LAPD Intel Unit, and the dramatic raids that defined a thrilling era of law enforcement. You'll hear firsthand accounts of innovative sting operations in South Central LA, punctuated by the wild nature of the job during those intense years. Join us as we recount the chaotic yet humorous start to the transition from the ATF to Customs, leading into the high-octane world of air smuggling operations. Listen to tales of chasing drug-smuggling aircraft with primitive yet effective methods and intense aerial pursuits that characterized customs enforcement along the border. From the spontaneous assignments to the adrenaline-pumping chases, this episode provides a vivid and captivating glimpse into the life of a federal agent patrolling the skies. Produced by: Citrustream, LLC

25 Sep 2024 - 1 h 29 min
episode Ep 16: Bob Starkman - From Narcotics Agent to Basketball Mentor artwork

Ep 16: Bob Starkman - From Narcotics Agent to Basketball Mentor

Join us on Justice Then Justice Now as we bring you the captivating life of Robert Starkman. Bob takes us through his early career in a maximum-security prison, his dogged determination during the 1980s narcotics crisis, and his unforgettable encounters with notable figures like Joseph Pistone, a.k.a. Donnie Brasco. His stories aren’t just thrilling; they’re a testament to his ironclad commitment to integrity and safety in law enforcement. Bob’s journey to law enforcement in Florida is one for the books—starting with a fortuitous phone call that led to an unexpected opportunity. From his early assignments and surprising connections to iconic mentors and the adventures of undercover operations, Bob shares the highs and lows of his career. He recounts memorable experiences, like overcoming his aversion to boats, navigating Miami’s unique culture, and the profound influence of supervisors who shaped his path. Bob's reflections offer a rare glimpse into the camaraderie and challenges faced by law enforcement agents in the field. But there’s more to Bob than just his badge. Transforming his passion for basketball into a successful coaching career, Bob’s stories from the court are as compelling as his law enforcement tales. From playing in legendary New York courts to coaching youth in Florida, his dedication shines through. Hear how his coaching philosophy, deeply influenced by his law enforcement background, has made a lasting impact on his players. Whether it’s high-stakes operations or strategizing on the basketball court, Bob Starkman’s life lessons are sure to inspire and entertain. Produced by: Citrustream, LLC

17 Sep 2024 - 1 h 9 min
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