Organize the Rich Radio

What's it like to give away $25 million? Interview with Katrina Schaffer

In this bonus double length episode, Michael interviews his dear friend and former client, Katrina Schaffer. Katrina is part of the 4th generation of the family that owns the Hallmark corporation. Katrina’s family is quite wealthy. They have a large family office, with close to 30 employees, that manages their money.  In her lifetime, Katrina is expected to inherit around 94 million dollars, mostly in yearly distributions of around 1.3 million after taxes. Since 2019, Katrina has moved more than 25 million dollars of her personal wealth to social justice organizing and power building efforts with her main priority areas being climate justice, electoral organizing and disability justice. Over 60% of the money she moved was to organizations, campaigns or individuals where there was no tax break for the donation. Since recording this interview in the Spring of 2025, after 6 years of working intensively together, Michael transitioned out of his  paid donor advisor role to take on the work with Organize the Rich fully. This interview with Katrina is the story of one person, born into a wealthy family, trying to do it differently. In a family system setup to pass down massive amounts of wealth, generation after generation, Katrina has been attempting to move the money out of her control and into the hands of organizers and communities trying to build a more healthy, just and equitable world. As part of this process, she has been working towards the goal of ending her own dependence on inherited wealth. And trying to bring her family along with her in the process. Not lose them or reject them but get free together.  Listen in to learn more. ----------------- Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/organize-the-rich-radio/id1803894829], Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/4SIa4QwxLoEuMmGXyY4lpM] or wherever you get your podcasts [https://www.buzzsprout.com/2456220/follow]. If you like what you hear, please rate and review it on Apple podcasts, and share it with others. We’re relying on our community, like you, to help us spread the word. To learn more about Organize the Rich and find us on Substack, YouTube or Instagram: https://linktr.ee/organizetherich [https://linktr.ee/organizetherich] Organize the Rich Radio is produced in partnership with Rowhome Productions [https://rowhomeproductions.com/].

From rural North Carolina to the Times100: Talking about money, class and movement building with Monica Simpson

In the last episode of this season, hosts Michael Gast and Allison Budschalow sit down with Monica Simpson. Monica is, among many things, the Executive Director of SisterSong [https://www.sistersong.net/], the United States' largest organization dedicated to reproductive justice for women of color, and one of TIME magazine's 100’s most influential people of 2023. She is also a member of the Trust Web, the redistribution project we learned about in our first episode with Elspeth Gilmore [https://www.buzzsprout.com/2456220/episodes/16701614-movement-money-elspeth-gilmore-and-the-trust-web].  Monica shares her journey from a small rural town in North Carolina to becoming a national leader for reproductive justice, and how her nickname "Money" foreshadowed a life deeply engaged with questions of wealth, power, and equity. Monica reflects on her experience with the Trust Web—a collective of 12 social justice leaders who redistributed a $7 million inheritance through no-strings-attached gifts. She discusses what she calls the "generational poverty mindset," exploring how it shaped her relationship with money and how breaking through it has transformed both her personal life and her leadership of SisterSong. This conversation delves into the challenging and essential work of building cross-class, multiracial relationships and coalitions. Monica talks about pivotal moments that taught her to see the humanity in people across class divides, the spiritual dimensions of money and survival, and why showing up at uncomfortable tables is crucial for movement building. Interested in wealth redistribution, cross-class organizing, reproductive justice,  and what it takes to build movements that transform? This is the episode for you. What a great bookend to our first season! Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/organize-the-rich-radio/id1803894829], Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/4SIa4QwxLoEuMmGXyY4lpM] or wherever you get your podcasts [https://www.buzzsprout.com/2456220/follow]. If you like what you hear, please rate and review it on Apple podcasts, and share it with others. We’re relying on our community, like you, to help us spread the word. To learn more about Organize the Rich and find us on Substack, YouTube or Instagram: https://linktr.ee/organizetherich [https://linktr.ee/organizetherich] Organize the Rich Radio is produced in partnership with Rowhome Productions [https://rowhomeproductions.com/].

"Whose going to reach my people but me?" Interview with Sharon Chen

In this episode, taped in November of 2024, Michael Gast interviews Sharon Chen, an important U.S. based leader in the work of organizing the rich. Earlier this year, Mike and Sharon's conversation was turned into a Substack post titled, "Who's going to reach my people but me?" [https://organizetherich.substack.com/p/whos-going-to-reach-my-people-but].  Sharon is currently (as of Fall 2025) the Interim Executive Director of Donors of Color Network [https://www.donorsofcolor.org/], the former board chair of Donors of Color Action [https://www.donorsofcoloraction.org/], board member of Women Donors Network [http://womendonors.org/], and emeritus president of the Progress Alliance of Washington [https://washingtonprogress.org/] [the C4 state donor table for WA]. A daughter of immigrants, she was one of three women and the only woman of color to graduate from Princeton University in the 90s with a computer science degree. In the subsequent decades, she became wealthy, along with her husband, working for Microsoft. Listen in to hear about Sharon’s early money memories, and her journey from an apolitical techie to an engaged donor organizer.  With honesty and laughter, Sharon shares her personal story and reflects on the role of embarrassment, shame and redemption in this work, and why it's so important for wealthy progressives to take responsibility for organizing the rich. Later on, Sharon and Mike talk about the importance of having spaces just for wealthy women and wealthy people of color, the role of patriarchy and the "male gaze", and what cross-racial solidarity can look like. This is a must-listen episode that cover so much – UNICEF boxes, carbon in the atmosphere, code-switching, and the importance of moving the rich from behind the microscope to under the microscope.  Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/organize-the-rich-radio/id1803894829], Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/4SIa4QwxLoEuMmGXyY4lpM] or wherever you get your podcasts [https://www.buzzsprout.com/2456220/follow]. If you like what you hear, please rate and review it on Apple podcasts, and share it with others. We’re relying on our community, like you, to help us spread the word. To learn more about Organize the Rich and find us on Substack, YouTube or Instagram: https://linktr.ee/organizetherich [https://linktr.ee/organizetherich] Organize the Rich Radio is produced in partnership with Rowhome Productions [https://rowhomeproductions.com/].

From tenant organizing to running a $135 million foundation: Interview with Lisa Owens

Movement Money is back!  In this episode, co-hosts Allison Budschalow and Michael Gast interview Lisa Owens [https://www.linkedin.com/in/lisaowens/], Executive Director of the Hyams Foundation [https://hyamsfoundation.org/]. We explore her journey from leading tenant organizing in Boston to running a $135 million private foundation whose mission is to build working class power in Massachusetts. Starting with her own money story, Lisa talks about her transition from her childhood as a class straddler and young Black girl in a predominantly white suburban world to working-class-led tenant organizing to the owning class institution of philanthropy.  Recorded just days after the 2024 election, this conversation offers reflections on the political moment, raising questions that we continue to grapple with:  How do we build sustainable movements?  * What role should philanthropy play?  * And how do we create real cross-class solidarity today? The episode concludes with definitions of some movement terminology, making it less jargon-y and (hopefully) more accessible to listeners new to the current buzzwords of progressive organizing and philanthropy. Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/organize-the-rich-radio/id1803894829], Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/4SIa4QwxLoEuMmGXyY4lpM] or wherever you get your podcasts [https://www.buzzsprout.com/2456220/follow]. If you like what you hear, please rate and review it on Apple podcasts, and share it with others. We’re relying on our community, like you, to help us spread the word. To learn more about Organize the Rich and find us on Substack, YouTube or Instagram: https://linktr.ee/organizetherich [https://linktr.ee/organizetherich] Organize the Rich Radio is produced in partnership with Rowhome Productions [https://rowhomeproductions.com/].

"Organizing is a skill like anything else. You can learn it." Interview with Rajasvini Bhansali

The interview from 2023 that turned into the most popular post on the Organize the Rich Substack so far, "Organizing is a skill like anything else. You can learn it [https://organizetherich.substack.com/p/organizing-is-a-skill-like-anything]."   Michael Gast interviews Rajasvini (Vini) Bhansali, Executive Director at Solidaire Network [https://solidairenetwork.org/], an organization that builds relationships between social movements, wealthy people and institutional philanthropy.  In our conversation, Vini opens up about how she came to this work, the indignities along the way, and her honest take on what's working and what's not about how we organize the rich today. Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/organize-the-rich-radio/id1803894829], Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/4SIa4QwxLoEuMmGXyY4lpM] or wherever you get your podcasts [https://www.buzzsprout.com/2456220/follow]. If you like what you hear, please rate and review it on Apple podcasts, and share it with others. We’re relying on our community, like you, to help us spread the word. To learn more about Organize the Rich and find us on Substack, YouTube or Instagram: https://linktr.ee/organizetherich Organize the Rich Radio is produced in partnership with Rowhome Productions [https://rowhomeproductions.com/].