Podcasts By Dr. Kirk Adams
Podcasts By Dr. Kirk Adams: Interview with James Dykstra, Founder, Code Stack Systems
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🎙️ Podcasts By Dr. Kirk Adams: Interview with James Dykstra, Founder, Code Stack Systems https://drkirkadams.com/podcasts-by-dr-kirk-adams-06-09-2026/ [https://drkirkadams.com/podcasts-by-dr-kirk-adams-06-09-2026/] In this forward-looking episode of Podcasts by Dr. Kirk Adams, host Dr. Kirk Adams sits down with James Dykstra, founder of Code Stack Systems, to unpack why so many businesses are watching their AI initiatives stall, and what it actually takes to fix that. Dykstra traces his path from a childhood spent tinkering with DOS to finance and strategy roles at Amazon and Microsoft, then to co-founding a services firm built on the conviction that technology should improve lives. The central insight: companies rush to buy powerful AI tools, but those tools only magnify the gaps in fragmented, poorly tracked data. Using the analogy of a high-performance engine that is useless until it is connected to the rest of the vehicle, and of data as crude oil that must be extracted, refined, and piped before it can power anything, Dykstra explains Code Stack's "work backwards" methodology: start with a client's three-year vision, identify the tools and data required to reach it, and consolidate that data into a single platform rather than ripping out and replacing existing systems. The conversation closes on the future, where Dykstra is candidly optimistic. He anticipates a convergence of robotics, language models, new sensors, and cheaper energy driving steep cost declines, alongside real disruption and the rise of agentic AI, in which people task teams of AI "direct reports" much like human staff. Adams connects this to the accessibility frontier he knows firsthand, noting how rapidly AI-powered access to visual information has gone from novelty to expectation in the blindness and low-vision community, with agentic AI now emerging as the next horizon. Dykstra leaves listeners with a message of hope tempered by realism: the road will be hard, but the foundational investments made now, in the right data behind the right tools, will determine who thrives. TRANSCRIPT: Podcast Commentator: Welcome to podcasts by Doctor Kirk Adams, where we bring you powerful conversations with leading voices in disability rights, employment and inclusion. Our guests share their expertise, experiences and strategies to inspire action and create a more inclusive world. If you're passionate about social justice or want to make a difference, you're in the right place. Let's dive in with your host, Doctor Kirk Adams. Dr. Kirk Adams: Welcome, everybody to another episode of podcast by Doctor Kirk Adams. I am that Doctor Kirk Adams talking to you from my home office a blustery Seattle Washington. Today. You might hear some rain whipping against the windows in June Seattle that's that's that's the way we like it. Today I have a really interesting guest from a very interesting company. James Dykstra, the founder of Code Stack Systems, is with us today. Hi, James. James Dykstra: Hello, doctor. Kirk Adams, thank you very much for having me on the show. Dr. Kirk Adams: Yeah, absolutely. So encountered code stack. I attended and, and gave a keynote presentation to a two day, two day gathering here in Seattle in March of start up companies and entrepreneurs and incubators and people interested in innovative technologies. And afterwards, one of the attendees, a gentleman named Ruben, came up to me and he said, I was really struck by your keynote presentation and in particular, your differentiation between impairment and disability. And it really resonated with me and I think it would resonate with my team. So would you. Would you be interested in getting on a call and talking more about it, and learning about what we do, and telling us more about what you do, and see if we could work together in some form or fashion. And I of course said, of course. I'm, I'm very prone to say, yes, let's, let's let's get to know one another and let's find where we share common ground and how we can help each other move forward. And so did that. Got on a call with, with the team. And we're continuing dialogue as I am an advisor to in a shareholder in another, a number of disability tech startups and always wanting to understand how innovation can create a more inclusive world and a world that's more accessible to everybody. And in my case, particularly people with disabilities. And so I will take just one minute 90s to talk about that differentiation between impairment and disability that that Rubin was struck by. Dr. Kirk Adams: So myself. Yeah. So myself, I'm totally blind, have been since age five. And I live in a world of work and play and scholarship and family. And many of the environments I operated in are not constructed specifically with me in mind. My impairment, visual impairment, my inability to see. And so we think about living in three different environments that we as human beings have created. One is built, which is the physical, one is social and one is digital. And as a person with an impairment, I only am in disabling situations when certain aspects of those three built environments don't allow me to interact the way I want to with the environment. And a super simple example I always use. If you've listened to the podcast before, you can go get a cup of coffee because I'm going to say it again. But one example is if I'm leading a board meeting, which I've done many, many times, and I'm at the head of the boardroom conference table and I have my my agenda, my minutes, my committee reports in Braille since I am a Braille reader although I have a visual impairment, I'm not in a disabling situation because I can interact effectively with the built environment because of the Braille. If you have brought, if you've if you brought me a a stack of print materials and handed it to me and asked me to run the meeting, then my impairment, my visual impairment, my lack of being able to see puts me in a disabling situation because I am not able to interact with the environment the way I want, because the piece of the built environment I'm trying to interact with this print, I cannot access that because of my impairment. Dr. Kirk Adams: So now another little example is if I'm in a large meeting room and I come to this point in my talk and I say, is there anyone in the room who's five foot two or shorter? I clap your hands. It's always a couple people. And I say, you have a characteristic of your height. If you walk into a room and there's a package that you need and it's on a shelf eight feet off the floor your characteristic of height does not allow you to interact effectively with the built environment of the high shelf. So you can, you can get a tool like a stepladder or stool to reach the package. You can create a team with a taller person with characteristic of higher, taller height and ask them to help you get the package down. You can make a modification to your environment, build a lower shelf. So next time you don't face that situation. So those are just some simple examples of what I meant. And sometime during the day, Ruben from, from code stack systems did approach me and, and said, you know, that, that really struck me. Dr. Kirk Adams: I just kept keep thinking about it, thinking about how my company can create better fits for people and environments and how we can reduce the number of disabling situations for people with various characteristics. And again, he asked if I would like to talk to the team. So long winded path to tell you how I met James. James and I have had a couple conversations and are planning to have many more, but really, really interested in what code stack does with their really I'd say guru guru level, enlightened level of understanding of systems including AI and how AI can, can work to serve us as human beings and can work to help companies move forward and just ask James if he would come on the podcast talk about his journey a little bit about your past experience. James, how you got your life before code stack the company journey so far where you're at the types of projects that you're involved in that you're interested in that, that fire the team up. And then maybe a little bit about the, what you're seeing for the future. So I'm going, I'm going to hand you the talking stick and I'll pop in with questions from time to time as as they as they occur to me. So thanks again for being here. Looking, looking forward to learning. James Dykstra: Well, thank you very much for having me, Doctor Adams. It's an honor to be here with you. The it's a long story, but I'll make it short. I would always go to soup kitchens and go to church with my mom and dad growing up. And so I was taught from a young age to, to work at things that really help, help improve people's lives and create opportunities for others. And, you know, at the same time I discovered computers my earliest memories of my, of me sitting on the floor and my mom fuddling with computer manuals, trying to set up a computer that was probably in 93 or 94, and I, I wrote my first line of code, which was doom dot exe from, from from DOS, you know, the command prompt access. You know, when I was at the age of six just trying to hide the fact that I was playing inappropriate games from my parents. And so I carried on that passion for technology and that interest for helping other people as I, as I went into the corporate world and I began working on financial consolidations and pricing, and it wasn't as rewarding as I wanted it to be. I didn't feel fulfilled. That said, I'm extremely grateful for the experiences I've had, helping with the, the pricing teams and Amazon and Microsoft and the finance teams and Amazon and the strategy teams at Amazon and Microsoft. James Dykstra: And I really wanted to make a bigger and distinct impact of my own. And so when I met Rubin at Amazon, he was working in business intelligence engineering, and I was working in financial consolidations. And so we were both trying to paint a picture of the business reality. And we both loved consulting. We loved understanding what makes a business profitable and how to position a business and optimize operations to create durable profitability. And so we said, well, we'd love to have a software company one day. And yet at that time, building software was pretty expensive and we didn't want to sell our restricted stock that had recently vested. And so we created a services firm where we sought to improve lives with technology by Improving the availability and observability of intelligence in a business. Dr. Kirk Adams: Then roughly, when was this? James Dykstra: Oh gosh, I think this was let's see, 2019, 2018, 2019. Dr. Kirk Adams: Oh seven, seven, seven, seven years ago. Okay. James Dykstra: Yeah. And so we said, well, okay, which businesses can we serve that will make a meaningful difference in the world? And so we sought out ag tech. We sought out nonprofits to serve in helping them improve the profitability of their business and to advance their mission through, through service. And, you know, it's not exactly really glamorous data consolidations and improving the general operational observability of a business, but it lays the foundation for these businesses to track their KPIs and to improve their overall performance, which keeps them in business. And so we're really, really passionate about increasing access to information and the ability to make a positive change in the world. And we've always done that through deeply understanding what data is available, identifying areas where we can insert additional tracking to give better visibility to a business operation. And then with that intelligence, empower the broader team to take action on those insights, no matter where they are in their skill journey. You know, most of these business owners that we were contracting with, they didn't have the technical prowess to, to access the data. And oftentimes they weren't tracking the right insights. And so they didn't have operational visibility to really improve their business and to hold themselves and their teams accountable to their goals. And so that's, that's been our, our path over the last seven years has been really helping businesses that we believe were improving the quality of life of people by creating that observability and enabling all people to action business intelligence. And right now, we're at the best time of my lifetime to be able to make that positive impact. Because right now, when a business is able to consolidate its data, to create accessibility in its data and have the ability to really observe the operation, whether it's with machine vision or better tracking of operations through sensors. Everyone is empowered then to potentially in the future, task agents as as directors. And so it's very, very exciting time. Dr. Kirk Adams: Yeah. If you could walk through a hypothetical, maybe you said something that struck me, and I'm not going to be able to quote you verbatim, but that the, the, the teams of the companies you're working with may not have the May not have the data they need, or they might be looking at the wrong data or they might not be asking the right questions or they, they might be tracking elements that aren't optimal. And I don't exactly remember how you said it, but the gist was they may be looking at the wrong things. So yeah, you know, how, how would you, how do you work with a company or perhaps a either a real life story of a company you've worked with or a hypothetical, but what's the methodology? How do you how do you dig in and help, help these companies understand what they should be looking at and how to look at it, how how to gather the data, and then what does the data consolidation? How does that manifest for them? James Dykstra: Yeah. True to our background, we focus on working backwards, which is an Amazonian principle. James Dykstra: We sit down with the business owner and we talk with them. We say, hey, what are your three year goals? Where do you want to take this? What is your vision for the future? And most businesses say, well, we want to increase revenue by 50% or two X boost. They typically say, we want to keep our operation lean and see our margins expand as we scale And so, for example, if the manufacturer. We we often find that they have limited visibility in terms of as the inventory or the, the raw materials come in, how effectively those are processed and then oftentimes installed post post manufacture. And so very often we're seeing opportunities right now, especially with the advances in AI, to install sensors that are able to capture a control tower view of the manufacturing operation, overseeing the floor where everyone is working, and you can see the performance of each contributor to the process. You can see how much material is being produced. You can more readily gauge defect rates, and we're really able to help businesses get a better sense of how do I create value efficiently, and how do I keep my costs low and hold my team accountable to the standards we have, especially around quality control and a manufacturing operation? And so that's an example, a more recent example of a very exciting opportunity where we are able to track new information to improve the business results. James Dykstra: That said, we're still doing the traditional where we look at each of the tools the business is currently using in that early conversation, typically with the general manager or CTO and COO Or the owner of the business. And we'll ask, well, given your three year goal, which tools do you need to achieve that vision? And we list out all the tools they're currently using. And we, we seek an understanding of where do data silos exist? Because very often one tool doesn't connect to another. And then critical insight is lost because it's living in a separate place. And so for example, you might have a difficulty understanding your, your accounts receivable or producing a price quote in an automated fashion. If part of the data is living in six different systems. Dr. Kirk Adams: Right? James Dykstra: So after we have that conversation about the tools to get them where they need to go, we have a conversation regarding will, which data App is required to power those tools. Right now, more than ever, we are seeing enormous enthusiasm about AI, and it's warranted. It's incredible. The technology is wonderful. The number of lives that are going to be positively impacted. I'm hugely optimistic about the future. It's very, very exciting. And understandably, when a business owner and their staff see a really exciting new product, they say, well, let's, let's buy it. Let's try it. Very understandable. Well, they buy it and they try it. And it only magnifies the current defects in their data capture process. And so they're buying the new tool, but they don't have the data to power that tool and to get the results that they expect out of it. Dr. Kirk Adams: Okay. James Dykstra: So we find ourselves in this situation right now where so many business owners are seeing their AI pilots fail. I read a. Dr. Kirk Adams: Gartner and I read. Dr. Kirk Adams: I read very recently, and I can't quote the statistics, but I can quote the, the, the gist of the, the research was that AI seems to be increasing, enhancing the productivity of individuals and a large percentage of individuals using AI find it helpful. And correspondingly, organizations, structures, companies are having a, the reverse experience. You know, far fewer organizations are finding AI, making them more productive and effective. So I think. Dr. Kirk Adams: That's. Dr. Kirk Adams: That that's along the lines of what you've been learning as people as you say, understandably want to always embrace the, the latest technology and innovation and be, be on that cutting edge. They, they, they employ AI and what, what I just heard you say is that it, it oftentimes reveals the structural structural problems that they have in the organization. It magnifies them or amplifies them. Is that what I'm hearing? James Dykstra: Absolutely. And Ruben showed me recently a Gartner survey, I believe it was early 2026 survey could be mistaken on the the date. It stated that the estimated Gartner estimates that 60% of enterprise AI pilots will fail by the end of 2026. Dr. Kirk Adams: Okay. James Dykstra: 60%. That's that's unheard of. Perhaps in the history of business pilots. And the reason they're failing is because they've, they've bought the new tool. It's an incredibly powerful tool and they've fed it the data that they have. Dr. Kirk Adams: Right. James Dykstra: And oftentimes that data is incomplete. They're it may live in the ERP and the CRM in order to paint the whole picture, for example, or their database. And without bringing that data together in a consolidated view. James Dykstra: A single consolidated data platform, which is part of our expertise code stack systems. Dr. Kirk Adams: Right. James Dykstra: They aren't able to paint a complete view of the business. And so there's something critical missing when those models give outputs and recommendations to these businesses. Dr. Kirk Adams: I think you gave me the analogy of a an engine. You buy this powerful engine and put it in a vehicle, but it doesn't do any good unless it's connected to all of the other systems in the vehicle. James Dykstra: Exactly. Exactly. And what I like to say to many business owners and, and other founders is that. Just like an engine or as a machine might be powered by gasoline, your data is, is an asset like, like crude oil that needs to be extracted from the systems in which it lives. It also needs to be identified and potentially new wells drilled tracking new data that you haven't currently had a reason to to track in the past, for example. And so first you have to identify where that data is. Extract it, refine it, really clean the data, and then you have to store it effectively. And so after it's extracted and refined and then stored safely and compliantly, then you have an opportunity to build a pipeline like a data pipeline and connect it to that machine. And unless those things happen, the machine does not run as expected. Dr. Kirk Adams: And so if I'm a client of code stack systems, and since I know manufacturing, I'm a manufacturer and I've engaged you and you come in and, and lead lead through the process. What's our vision for three years? What tools do we need? What data do we need to support those tools? Then when when you when you finish the product project, the initiative, the work, what what what are you leaving me? What are you leaving me with? Is it an ERP system? Is it a dashboard? Is it a set of tools? What, what I guess what is the, the manifestation of your work that, that you're, you're giving to me as the owner of the manufacturing enterprise? James Dykstra: Yeah. So when we think about what are the tools that power the change in the business, we recognize that the tool is simply a leverage point. And what we're really looking for is to deeply understand what are the business processes happening in the business and how do we essentially optimize those business processes? We can improve the reliability of manufacturing, for example. And through implementing new sensors and automations. And so at the end of the day, what we're leaving behind are optimized business processes that are supported with automation. Oftentimes AI automation and the underlying data platform that can feed all of your future AI tools. Dr. Kirk Adams: Okay. James Dykstra: So it's a very big unlock. Being able to consolidate the data in an automated and effective way from all the systems that a business has. So at the end of the day, when we walk away, a business then has the foundation to Use the AI tools of the future needed to hit their three year goal, and they have as a top priority the business processes and functioning tools needed to grow sales or to optimize productivity in the manufacturing operation. Dr. Kirk Adams: So I, I've been, I've been moving down my path. I have a manufacturing company, I have a ERP system, a Oracle based or whatever it is. And I'm managing my business not as optimally as I can. And you're going to come help me. Are you replacing my systems? Are you enhancing my systems? Are you adding stuff, taking stuff out? What does that look like? James Dykstra: We try to avoid ripping and replacing systems and meeting the business where they are. Dr. Kirk Adams: Okay. James Dykstra: We've found that most businesses cannot stomach the huge change management challenge and systems implementation challenge of ripping and replacing systems, right? At times, we will work with the business to determine when a new additional system is appropriate. For example, perhaps they want to move to SAP and they are using QuickBooks with some really advanced tooling that they've built, oftentimes a custom tooling. And they want to have a CRM. They want to have these systems throughout the business to be able to track the health and performance of each organization. And so what we're really focused on is understanding what tool, which tools are currently in play, which tools need to be added, and then how do we reliably access the data that's being stored and captured by each of these tools? And then we can even refine and improve the data living in those tools. So Ruben likes to say that oftentimes we're building a semantic layer in, in the data that is living outside of these tools. Dr. Kirk Adams: Okay. James Dykstra: So how do we want to define units shipped, for example, in Amazon? There are multiple definitions of units shipped and of sales. Some include for example like sales with or without credits. And so what we're able to do is clearly define Codify what are the business rules and how do we want to interpret the data. And we can build that into the data outside of the systems. Dr. Kirk Adams: Okay. James Dykstra: That are kind of like the initial source. And so we're improving and enriching this data in this consolidated data platform that will then power all the newest and best tools. Dr. Kirk Adams: So I want, I want to ask you about, about future vision and future state and AI and and how, where you see things going and there's always information and opinion swirling and you know, again, I see research reports, I see surveys of recent college graduates and the huge percentage who, you know, for their future employment because they believe AI will be supplanting human beings and the types of jobs that recent college graduates are, are typically hired for. In the accessibility world, there's lots of excitement about how AI can make the world more accessible. And from my standpoint, as a blind person, there are, you know, functions that we in the past needed to rely on sighted assistance that now AI can can provide to increase our independence and create more frequent, better fits between our cells with our impairments and the environment. And we, we see information about productivity and we see people protesting the thoughts of data centers being built in their neighborhoods. And you know, it's very very fluid very much at a, I guess, a Creative frontier. So just with with your long experience and and vastly more sophisticated experience than I have what's top of mind for you? What are what are you seeing? What are you thinking about? What are, what are you imagining? James Dykstra: I'm very, very excited about the future. We've never been in a situation where the cost of, you know, dollars per or whichever denomination, you know, ex currency per mile traveled you know, per kilowatt hour per unit input to a manufacturing process is going to decline so precipitously. And that's going to create utopian abundance. Dr. Kirk Adams: Is that through efficiency? James Dykstra: Yeah, absolutely. Through efficiency, through the application of robotics, reasoning, material science breakthroughs, manufacturing breakthroughs, and of course, energy production. We are making significant advances in all of these areas and the what we like to call downstream impact or like positive lift downstream from all of these advances is extremely cheap transportation in the future. James Dykstra: Extremely cheap manufactured goods, very likely extremely cheap services. With the advent of humanoid mass produced robotics. And the reason why we're seeing this really shocking, shocking Price decrease and it's anticipated over the next really the next three years, we're going to see a huge, huge transformation is because novel technologies have matured and converged in a very, very timely way. So robotics, which is which can be construed as unlimited physical labor and language models, coupled with well organized comprehensive data sets which can be construed as unlimited reasoning. New sensor types and new model types for gathering information. And so it's extremely exciting to see all of these factors come together. That said, every job in the future will be very likely performed differently than it is today. Many new jobs will exist, and at the same time, there will be great disruption and great frustration with the magnitude and sheer acceleration of this change. And so it's not going to be an easy road. Dr. Kirk Adams: Okay. James Dykstra: But the end of the road is very, very bright where work will potentially, for many people, be optional. The baseline quality of living will be dramatically higher than it's ever been in the past. And with the significant enhancements in AI assisted health care, the quality of life will be equally better. We're talking about longevity, escape velocity where we're going to be adding a year and a half for every year that passes within 5 to 10 years. And so the future is very, very bright. And the technology will be a great equalizer amongst people because the ability to sense and gather data from the environment is more incredible right now than ever before. And all of that data can be processed in ways it could never be processed before and made available to us to consume. However, we'd like to consume it. Dr. Kirk Adams: Yeah, I'm just thinking about access to visual information and AI. And it's all there very, very much sweeping the blindness and low vision communities, the smart glasses, for instance, where you can ask AI to describe what's in front of you or even describe a video with with really good accuracy. Of course, there are hallucinations. And if it's if it's if it's a matter of safety or privacy, you know, the need to verify. But I went to the sea Sun conference, the California State University, Northridge, large accessibility assistive technology conference. And the last one I went to most people were talking about access to visual information. And that was in 2025. And now in 2026, it, the focus shifted within 12 months. The image, the access to visual information seem to be an accepted new asset for us, and the next frontier seemed to be agentic AI. And I know when you were first describing Code Stack, you talked about agents or directors, AI directing various functions within companies. Can you talk a little bit about that, about the emergence of AI and whether or not I'm using the right, right terminology? James Dykstra: The the terminology is changing every day. And so you'll see an executive from Microsoft describing the same technology, different from differently from an executive from Nvidia. And so we're, we're still maturing and finding a common nomenclature for these wonderful technologies. My background in AI started with recommendation models and you know, in a pricing context. And then when I moved over to Microsoft, I helped initially lead business planning for the Microsoft Cloud for retail before expanding to include all of the other industries in my purview. And when just focused on retail, we were launching products such as Microsoft's Intelligent Recommendation service that could find visual matches and other predictive matching. And then, of course, over time, AI emerged in new modalities, new models such as small and large language models. And it was very exciting to be in that industry. Business planning capacity explore for each industry. What are the applications for a language model and new types of AI inference and compute heavy workloads to really improve lives with this technology. Because industry is a very, very beautiful thing because it gives us all of our modern products and services and conveniences that underpin our quality of life. James Dykstra: And so after rolling out a number of different models that were that pertained to specific industry applications, we then moved further toward, well, how do I couple this model with knowledge, tools, governance, and the ability to orchestrate across different tools to effectively create what's called an AI agent? By most these days, AI, as we're currently Describing it is really a collection of a number of foundational technologies where the model is only one piece, and without all the other pieces, it is defunct or unsafe. And so as we look to the future and we think about these language models that are equipped with knowledge and tools and governance and the ability to organize which tool should be called for, which purpose, and which data is acceptable to access for which purpose. We have a huge opportunity for us to task these, let's call them tool composites. And for all of us to have a team of direct reports that are the agents that we task to achieve our business outcomes or our creative pursuits. Dr. Kirk Adams: Amazing. Dr. Kirk Adams: So the time has flown. The time has flown by. I've took I've taken a lot of notes. I look forward to working more closely with you and team and learning more and getting a deeper understanding of the nuances of, of what you do. I know more now than I did before we started this conversation today. What, what would you like to leave people listening with? How can people get in touch? How can people connect with you? James Dykstra: Absolutely. I'd like to especially leave behind a message of hope. All of this change will be really challenging. And if we're able to work through these challenges together, we can create an incredibly beautiful future where we have options and where everyone is empowered to lead a fulfilling and gratifying life. So I want everyone, especially those who are involved in, in running businesses and creating some of that value that's going to positively impact the lives of others to consider beyond just the tool. The tool is very exciting. What foundational investments need to be made and what is the priority of those investments? Working backward from that priority business outcome. And so with code stack systems, we want to team up to support businesses that are going to improve lives with technology. And we want to do that by empowering them with the right tools that are powered by the right data. And so to reach out to me and the team, you can reach out to me via LinkedIn and anyone can schedule a meeting with me. Happy to have a one on one and talk and learn from others, and they are happy and welcome to visit the website Code Stack systems.com where they can sign up for a free consultation, where we sit down with business leaders and we learn about their priorities, and we work backward from those objectives. To help define a technology standpoint, what steps need to be taken for them to thrive in the future? Dr. Kirk Adams: Fabulous. Well I'm excited. My my my feelings about AI vacillate between concern and enthusiasm. You've tipped me toward you've tipped me a little bit toward the enthusiasm into the scale today, which I appreciate. And thanks, everyone for listening to another episode of podcast by Doctor Kirk Adams. To connect with me, my website is https://DrKirkAdams.com. You can sign up for my newsletter. You can fill out a contact form. I'm also on LinkedIn every day. Crossed paths with James on LinkedIn from time to time. And again, thanks for listening. And we'll we'll talk to you next time. Podcast Commentator: Thank you for listening to podcasts by Doctor Kirk Adams. We hope you enjoyed today's conversation. Don't forget to subscribe, share or leave a review at https://www.drkirkadams.com. Together we can amplify these voices and create positive change. Until next time, keep listening, keep learning, and keep making an impact.
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