Two Shrinks on the Farm

2SOTF Episode 14: Pain, Purpose, and the Timeline Shift

Episode 14: Pain, Purpose, and the Timeline Shift In this deeply moving episode, Barb returns to the mic for the first time since her life-threatening fall from a horse. What unfolds is a raw, luminous conversation between two lifelong psychologists—and friends—about pain, meaning, and the strange ways life reroutes us. Inside this episode: * Barb’s harrowing account of her injuries, surgeries, and recovery—including the thirty minutes she spent in unbearable pain without medication. * How pain changes identity: from professional achiever to someone forced into stillness. * The privilege of medical access, and the despair of realizing how many don’t have it. * What happens to creativity when pain (or pain medication) becomes a constant companion. * The parallels between physical pain and psychological trauma—and how both demand meaning. * The eerie synchronicity of both Barb and Robyn starting TikTok accounts the same week as the accident. * A conversation about timelines, fate, and “spooky action at a distance.” * The intersection of psychology and spirituality: knowing when to apply science, and when to allow for mystery. * The question that lingers: When the future crumbles, do we crumble with it—or create something entirely new? Quotes from the episode: > “Pain has been my constant companion. The best it gets is background noise; the worst is thunder.” – Barb > “We construct meaning with the universe, not in isolation.” – Barb > “When the future collapses, we can despair—or we can build what’s never existed before.” – Robyn Mentioned in this episode: * Chronic pain and pain management * Psychological trauma and creativity * Existential therapy and meaning-making * Cultural privilege in healthcare access * TikTok as a platform for midlife reinvention * Quantum entanglement, spirituality, and science Hosts: Dr. Robyn McKay & Dr. Barbara Kerr Recorded live from Kansas and California Produced by sheology by dr robyn mckay [https://drrobynmckay.com] if you're interested in having your personality tested and interpreted by the two of us, or you're ready to bring us in to work with your teams, Get started by sending an email to robyn@drrobynmckay.com and we'll help you start the process. Don't forget to follow us on Instagram for more behind the scenes fun from the farm, creative insights, and plenty of laughs from the reels that I'm constantly posting in stories. You can find us on instagram at @twoshrinksonthefarm [https://www.instagram.com/twoshrinksonthefarm]. Last thing: we'd really love it if you'd rate and review our podcast on whatever platform you listen to us on - and share us with your buddies - the more the merrier!

2SOTF Ep 13: Stillness Is Medicine: Healing the Ones Who Hold Us All (ft. Michael Diana)

In this episode, Robyn is joined by Michael Diana, a PhD student in Counseling Psychology and the youngest member of Barb’s academic lineage. They come together in the wake of Barb’s recent injury to reflect on what it really means to let healers receive the care they so often give. Together, they explore themes of presence, spiritual bypassing, helper dynamics, and how to discern when we’re being helpful versus performative. The episode closes with a Loving-Kindness Meditation dedicated to Barb—and to every healer learning how to rest. In This Episode: * What happens when the healer is laid out * Presence vs. performance in support * Healing dynamics in high-functioning helpers * Why some people can’t stop fixing—even at the bedside * Bioenergetic coherence and the ripple effects of nervous system calm * Personal stories of checking in, holding back, and choosing discernment over urgency * Loving-Kindness Meditation (for Barb and beyond) Guest: 👨‍🎓 Michael Diana PhD candidate in Counseling Psychology at the University of Kansas Instagram: @michaeldiana [https://www.instagram.com/michaeldiana] Mentions & Resources: * Barb (our beloved co-host and mentor) * Research on Loving-Kindness Meditation and trauma recovery * Transcendental Meditation and Washington D.C. crime rate study * Power of prayer and field coherence in healing * Calls to Action: 📝 Subscribe to Two Shrinks on the Farm 💬 Leave a review and share this episode 📧 Subscribe to Robyn’s LinkedIn newsletter: The Work Beyond Work [https://www.linkedin.com/newsletters/the-work-beyond-work] 📲 Follow Robyn on TikTok: @dr.robynmckay if you're interested in having your personality tested and interpreted by the two of us, or you're ready to bring us in to work with your teams, Get started by sending an email to robyn@drrobynmckay.com and we'll help you start the process. Don't forget to follow us on Instagram for more behind the scenes fun from the farm, creative insights, and plenty of laughs from the reels that I'm constantly posting in stories. You can find us on instagram at @twoshrinksonthefarm [https://www.instagram.com/twoshrinksonthefarm]. Last thing: we'd really love it if you'd rate and review our podcast on whatever platform you listen to us on - and share us with your buddies - the more the merrier!

2SOTF Ep. 12: The One Where We Remember What Freedom Feels Like

Recorded from a perch above the white sand dunes of Lake Michigan, this episode is part love letter to Camp Miniwanca, part reckoning with the state of academia, and full-bodied remembrance of what true freedom feels like—beyond the metrics, meetings, and masked brilliance. Dr. Robyn McKay and Dr. Barbara Kerr drop in from Professor Camp, where each summer, faculty from across the country gather to reconnect with the parts of themselves that don’t fit on a CV. In this episode, we talk about: * The paradox of intellect in America—why professors are resented and revered * Barb’s new book, The Psychology of Liberty, and what we’ve lost in our cultural definition of “freedom” * Time poverty and the myth of virtuous overwork * The heartbreak of masking your brilliance just to survive * Why creative kids—and the adults they grow into—need each other * What it actually feels like to be free (spoiler: it’s not a tax cut) * Community as refuge, rest as rebellion, and nature as reminder We also share personal stories of leaving the academy, reclaiming creativity, and finding flow again—whether in a desert in Arizona, or under the Icelandic sky. Mentioned in this episode: * The Psychology of Liberty by Dr. Barbara Kerr - you can order your copy from your favorite indy bookstore - please & thank you! * The cultural co-opting of freedom * Smart girls, creative misfits, and masked intellectuals * Rest, rebellion, and redefining success * The birds. Yes, you can hear them. 🎙 Listen now to The One Where We Remember What Freedom Feels Like. Then maybe take a nap. Consider it revolutionary. if you're interested in having your personality tested and interpreted by the two of us, or you're ready to bring us in to work with your teams, Get started by sending an email to robyn@drrobynmckay.com and we'll help you start the process. Don't forget to follow us on Instagram for more behind the scenes fun from the farm, creative insights, and plenty of laughs from the reels that I'm constantly posting in stories. You can find us on instagram at @twoshrinksonthefarm [https://www.instagram.com/twoshrinksonthefarm]. Last thing: we'd really love it if you'd rate and review our podcast on whatever platform you listen to us on - and share us with your buddies - the more the merrier!

2SOTF Ep 11: Breaking the Spell (Again): A Two Shrinks x Bewitched Crossover

Breaking the Spell (Again): A Two Shrinks x Bewitched Crossover Recorded at: Saguaro Lake Ranch, Arizona [https://www.saguarolakeranch.com/] In this special crossover episode of Two Shrinks on the Farm, Dr. Robyn McKay and Dr. Barbara Kerr trade the Kansas prairie for the Arizona desert as they meet at the historic Saguaro Lake Ranch—a place steeped in memory, healing, and academic roots. Together, they unpack the darker side of spiritual mentorship in the wake of Dr. McKay’s 24-day misadventures, into what can only be described as a psychologically and spiritually injurious retreat. What begins as a reflection on shared history quickly unfolds into a compelling dialogue on the anatomy of spiritual harm, psychological resilience, and how even the most well-adjusted among us can find ourselves under the spell of charismatic—but ultimately dangerous—leaders. You’ll hear: * Why “if it can happen to us, it can happen to anyone” is more than just a warning—it's a truth about openness, intellect, and altered states. * Barb's reflections on her own spiritual misadventure decades ago—and how it mirrors Robyn’s experience. * The psychology behind cult-like dynamics, and how spiritual teachers can slide from benevolent mentors to manipulative leaders. * The difference between spiritual crisis and psychiatric diagnosis—and why the integration of wisdom from both is essential to healing. * The Dark Tetrad of personality and how delusions, narcissism, and moral injury intersect. * What to keep, what to leave behind, and how to reclaim your gifts after spiritual betrayal. ✨ Plus: An unapologetically sharp and wise conversation on rituals, walk-ins, demon possession, and why spiritual healing doesn’t need to come with a side of psychological warfare. 🎧 This episode is part of the Bewitched series, co-hosted by Robyn McKay and Alyse Bacine, released alongside Louisa’s story. 🎧 Listen to Louisa’s powerful story—dropping today—over on She{ology} by Dr. Robyn McKay [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/she-ology-by-dr-robyn-mckay/id1677555563]and get caught up on the 7 previous episodes of Bewitched while you’re there. Thank you for being part of this conversation—we’re just getting started. Also, you can... follow Barb on Facebook [https://www.facebook.com/barbara.alane.kerr] follow Robyn on IG [https://www.instagram.com/robynmckayphd] 🔗 Reserve your copy of the upcoming ebook Healing the Healers: 11 Things Every Spiritually Intelligent Leader Needs to Know About Helping Clients After Spiritual Harm. You can do that right here: Healing the Healers [https://robyn-mckay.myflodesk.com/healingthehealers] if you're interested in having your personality tested and interpreted by the two of us, or you're ready to bring us in to work with your teams, Get started by sending an email to robyn@drrobynmckay.com and we'll help you start the process. Don't forget to follow us on Instagram for more behind the scenes fun from the farm, creative insights, and plenty of laughs from the reels that I'm constantly posting in stories. You can find us on instagram at @twoshrinksonthefarm [https://www.instagram.com/twoshrinksonthefarm]. Last thing: we'd really love it if you'd rate and review our podcast on whatever platform you listen to us on - and share us with your buddies - the more the merrier!

2SOTF Ep 10: Two Shrinks and a Gynecologist Walk Into Menopause

Hosts: Dr. Robyn McKay & Dr. Barbara Kerr Guest: Kimberlee McKay, MD (OBGYN, Maternal-Fetal Medicine Specialist) Menopause isn’t the end—it’s just another beginning (with some hot flashes, hormone fluctuations, and a whole lot of societal myths to unravel). In this episode, Barb and Robyn welcome a very special guest—Dr. Robyn’s younger sister, Dr. Kimberlee McKay, an OB-GYN and maternal-fetal medicine expert, who brings her signature blend of medical wisdom and sharp humor to the conversation. From the reality of perimenopause to the myths of menopause and the cultural phenomenon of female invisibility after 50, this episode covers it all. Kimmy shares her clinical insights on why menopause is different for every woman, what’s actually effective for managing symptoms, and why your give-a-shit gene might just turn off completely (and that’s a good thing). TOPICS COVERED: ✔️ The truth about perimenopause (and why it can last up to a decade) ✔️ Menopause vs. stress: how modern life speeds up hormonal shifts ✔️ Barb pokes holes in the grandmother theory ✔️ Weight gain, night sweats, brain fog—what’s real, what’s nonsense ✔️ How menopause symptoms mimic anxiety & depression (and why many women are misdiagnosed) ✔️ The invisibility effect after 50—and why some women refuse to disappear ✔️ HRT, bioidenticals, and why estrogen got such a bad rap ✔️ The NEO Personality Inventory, emotional regulation, and how menopause changes who you are ✔️ Why menopause might just be the ultimate glow-up Barb also shares a legendary cowgirl story about wrinkles, Kimmie drops some OB-GYN wisdom on birth control after 40, and Robyn reflects on how menopause shifts your life purpose, self-acceptance, and confidence. CONNECT & RESOURCES: 🌿 Want Barb and Robyn to analyze your personality with the NEO Personality Inventory? Reach out at robyn@drrobynmckay.com 🐴 Follow Dr. Kimberlee McKay on X (formerly Twitter) @OBGYNKenobi 📖 More about Dr. Robyn McKay’s work: @robynmckayphd on Instagram 📍 Follow us on Instagram: @twoshrinksonthefarm 🎧 Subscribe to Two Shrinks on the Farm for more fresh takes on psychology, creativity, and life beyond the ordinary Press play and find out why menopause might just be the most freeing chapter yet if you're interested in having your personality tested and interpreted by the two of us, or you're ready to bring us in to work with your teams, Get started by sending an email to robyn@drrobynmckay.com and we'll help you start the process. Don't forget to follow us on Instagram for more behind the scenes fun from the farm, creative insights, and plenty of laughs from the reels that I'm constantly posting in stories. You can find us on instagram at @twoshrinksonthefarm [https://www.instagram.com/twoshrinksonthefarm]. Last thing: we'd really love it if you'd rate and review our podcast on whatever platform you listen to us on - and share us with your buddies - the more the merrier!