Allbirds' Former CEO Talks $4B IPO, Starting Over, and His New Playbook | Joey Zwillinger

The Lean Startup Author on Why Building Fast Isn't Enough | Eric Ries

Eric Ries wrote The Lean Startup, the book that gave a generation of founders the MVP, the pivot, and the build-measure-learn cycle. He's also an early Bubble investor who believed in the democratization of building before most of Silicon Valley took it seriously. In this episode, Emmanuel sits down with Eric to talk about his new book, Incorruptible, and the forces that quietly corrupt even the best companies. Eric introduces the concept of "financial gravity" — the structural pressure that bends successful companies away from their founding purpose — and explains why it starts pulling the moment you succeed, not after. He also makes a sharp case against vibe coding and AI-assisted building without understanding. Topics covered: * Why AI tools can make founders less capable, not more * "Financial gravity": the invisible force that corrupts good companies from within * The difference between "mission-driven" and "mission-controlled" * Why governance is a creative design decision, not a legal formality * How Incorruptible builds on The Lean Startup Find this episode’s full show notes here: * https://bubble.io/blog/the-new-build-10-eric-ries [https://bubble.io/blog/the-new-build-10-eric-ries] Links: * Incorruptible by Eric Ries: incorruptible.co [http://incorruptible.co] * Eric's podcast: ericriesshow.com [http://ericriesshow.com] * Eric's newsletter: news.theleanstartup.com [http://news.theleanstartup.com] * Eric on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/eries [http://linkedin.com/in/eries] * Eric on X: x.com/ericries [http://x.com/ericries] * AnswerAI: answer.ai [http://answer.ai] Start building: ⁠ [http://bubble.io]bubble.io [http://bubble.io]⁠ [http://bubble.io] * * * * * Chapters [00:00:47] Introduction [00:02:20] How AI and no-code changed the game Eric predicted  [00:05:20] Why most people use AI wrong [00:06:00] Dark flow: vibe coding is a slot machine  [00:08:15] The artifact is not the progress [00:09:30] What Incorruptible is about [00:11:02] Financial gravity: the invisible force that corrupts good companies  [00:13:35] The Bill Gates intern story [00:16:23] The FedMart and Costco story: 200 years of companies losing their soul  [00:22:45] When should founders think about governance?  [00:24:58] The "most evil company" exercise: what your charter actually commits you to  [00:27:01] The PBC filing: a two-page fix most founders don't know about  [00:29:15] Mission-driven vs. mission-controlled: the Google "don't be evil" test  [00:33:00] Does Incorruptible conflict with The Lean Startup?  [00:35:48] Eric's blueprint: the path of ethos and the path of integrity  [00:40:10] Is Eric optimistic?

Bootstrapping a 300-Person Company Without Raising a Dollar | Clément Llehi (Makko)

Most founders build software first and a business second. Clément Llehi did it the other way around — and that sequence might be exactly why Makko works. In this episode, Abhinav sits down with Clément, the bootstrapped solo founder of Makko, a facility management company based in France. Starting with no co-founder, no outside funding, and no coding background, Clément spent his early mornings cleaning offices at 5 AM while consulting at Capgemini by day and designing what would eventually become a platform running operations for 300 employees and over 600 enterprise clients by night. He shares the moment he knew it was time to go all in, what it actually takes to earn the trust of major companies when you're a small, self-funded team, and why he restructures his company every six months on purpose. Topics covered: * Leaving a consulting career at Capgemini to start a cleaning company — and why people thought he was making a big mistake * Doing the cleaning himself first, and why that changed every product decision he made * How the pandemic forced him to pause and build the platform that now runs the whole operation * The moment winning his first big enterprise contract made everything feel real * What consulting taught him about user experience — and why the FM industry still hasn't caught up * Building enterprise trust as a small, bootstrapped, founder-led team * Why he deliberately restructures Makko every six to eight months * How AI is changing Makko's internal operations, and what he's thinking about for clients next * The competitor's comment that meant more to him than any client win Find this episode’s full show notes here: * https://bubble.io/blog/the-new-build-09-makko [https://bubble.io/blog/the-new-build-09-makko] Links: Makko: makko.fr [http://makko.fr] Clément on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/clementllehi/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/clementllehi/] ✦ ✦ ✦ ✦ ✦ Chapters [00:00:00] Why the early days of building Makko felt like the best and worst time of Clément's life [00:00:22] Introducing Clément, founder and CEO of Makko [00:02:23] Why Clément left a consulting career at Capgemini to start a cleaning company [00:03:38] The brutal early grind: cleaning at 5 AM, working 9-5, building the platform at night [00:05:26] Why Clément entered the industry as an operator first rather than building a platform from the outside [00:13:36] Discovering Bubble: How Clément found no-code and built an MVP in a month during COVID [00:15:51] From first clients to 600+ B2B accounts: What earning enterprise trust actually looked like [00:19:06] How a consulting background gave Makko a customer experience edge in a notoriously old-school industry [00:21:43] Overcoming skepticism: Why some people couldn't believe a tech-forward company could also be the best at cleaning [00:24:57] Why Makko deliberately restructures every six to eight months — and what that looks like in practice [00:31:03] Clément's playbook for building a bootstrapped business that enterprise clients can trust [00:33:13] Knowing when to leave your day job: Why you need both traction data and gut instinct [00:36:13] The micro signals most entrepreneurs ignore — and how one small complaint can signal a bigger cultural problem [00:40:16] The competitor compliment that told Clément he was building something truly different

Allbirds' Former CEO Talks $4B IPO, Starting Over, and His New Playbook | Joey Zwillinger

We recorded this just after Allbirds made headlines this month for selling its footwear assets, but before they announced their pivot to AI infrastructure under a new name — all roughly two years after Joey Zwillinger stepped down as CEO. He founded the company in 2015, took it public at a $4 billion valuation in 2021, then watched the stock collapse more than 96% before stepping down in March 2024. Rather than retreat, he's back—building Biologica, a women's hormonal health company, with lessons that only come from living through the full lifecycle of building, losing, and starting over. In this episode, Emmanuel talks with Joey about what actually broke at Allbirds, why being a public company made the turnaround harder, and the specific frameworks he's applying differently the second time around. You'll hear his "slope of ignorance" hiring philosophy, why he believes "take the money and spend like you don't have it," and what advice he's giving early-stage founders today that's genuinely different from five years ago. Topics covered: * From biotech to footwear: Why Allbirds was always a material innovation company * The "slope of ignorance": Hiring for competitive moats, not urgency * Selling $1M in shoes in 30 days with zero advertising * What broke after the $4B IPO: False signals from COVID's volatile consumer behavior * Why the $160 Tree Flyer running shoe was a strategic mistake * The public company trap: Quarterly reporting creating negative externalities * Why being too small as a public company ($300M revenue) made turnarounds brutal * Stepping down as CEO: The transition process with Joe Vernachio * Starting Biologica with his wife Liz: Hormonal age, not chronological age * What he's doing differently: Subscription model, lean team (6 people), research-first * The second-time founder paradox: People assume you'll succeed (and stop giving honest feedback) * "Spend like you don't have it": The investor advice he didn't internalize until too late * Why the music will stop: Capital allocation in an optimistic market * Building vs. buying technology: Why consumer companies shouldn't build their own tech Find this episode’s full show notes here: * ⁠https://bubble.io/blog/the-new-build-08-joey-zwillinger [https://bubble.io/blog/the-new-build-08-joey-zwillinger] Links: * Biologica: https://biologica.com [https://biologica.com] * Joey on LinkedIn:  https://www.linkedin.com/in/jzwillinger [https://www.linkedin.com/in/jzwillinger]

Building a Marketplace Where Doing Good Pays the Bills | Giselle Gonzales (EqualReach)

Most impact-conscious businesses treat social good as a cost center‌ — ‌something funded by profits from the "real" business. EqualReach flipped that model: When refugee talent gets paid for dignified work, EqualReach gets paid too. The mission and the revenue are structurally the same thing. In this episode, Abhinav talks with EqualReach Founder and CEO Giselle Gonzales and Product Lead Olena Voloshyna about how they built a freelancing marketplace connecting displaced talent with businesses that need digital work‌,  ‌and why the only way EqualReach makes money is when that talent gets paid fair rates. You'll hear how 10 years of research led Giselle to identify the missing piece in refugee employment (market access, not training), why Olena went from intern to product lead in 18 months through "trust as currency," and the specific platform features that make dignified work‌ — ‌not exploitation‌ — ‌the default. Topics covered: * Why "dignified work" means the opposite of exploitation * The 10-year research journey that revealed the real gap: market access, not skills * How EqualReach's fee structure aligns incentives with refugee talent getting paid * Building the platform during Bubble's Immerse program with zero product experience * Why Giselle hired a product lead before having a product * "Trust as currency": How giving ownership unlocks 90% more potential * Smart contracting: Giving teams control over payment terms and pricing * Impact reporting as a feature: Tracking jobs created, KPIs improved, stories told * Why most people think "refugee" = "low-skilled person in a camp" (and how to change that) * The compliance challenge: Perceived risk vs. actual risk for businesses * One Young World moment: 80% of the room commits to the vision * How a Palestinian marketing team used AI to deliver studio-quality training videos * Starting with the "why," not the "how" Find this episode’s full show notes here: * ⁠https://bubble.io/blog/the-new-build-07-equalreach [https://bubble.io/blog/the-new-build-07-equalreach] Links: * EqualReach: http://equalreach.io [http://equalreach.io] * Giselle on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gisellegonzales/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/gisellegonzales/] * Olena on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/olena-amina-voloshyna-49a571113/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/olena-amina-voloshyna-49a571113/]

Patterns from 100s of Launches: What Separate Winning Founders | Matt Graham

Matt Graham's agency RapidDev has 220 employees working on 250+ active projects. That means he sees more product launches in a month than most investors see in a year‌ — ‌and the learnings are clear. In this episode, Emmanuel talks with Matt about what actually separates successful founders from those who stall out, why being "too smart" kills momentum, and the specific mistake that wastes the most money in early-stage development. You'll hear why Matt walked away from a company that became a $1.5B unicorn (and doesn't regret it), his thesis on why we're entering the biggest services boom in history while everyone else runs away from agencies, and the culture shift that transformed RapidDev from a two-person freelance operation to a 220-person company that grew revenue 340% in one year. Topics covered: * Why founders who are "too smart" and too cerebral fail more often * The #1 mistake: Endlessly building before getting any users * What successful founders have in common (hint: it's not intelligence) * Why Matt left a company that became a $1.5B unicorn‌ — ‌and chose the agency path instead * The services boom thesis: Why AI creates massive consulting demand * How RapidDev scaled from 2 to 220 people in 5 years * Diversification strategy: Why agencies plateau and how to avoid it * Client work reality check: Managing expectations when things go wrong * Why pricing is collapsing but premium services will always exist * The AI brain monitoring every Slack message and email for escalations * M&A as a forcing function: Why acquisitions stretch your organization * Culture over process: How Matt is rewiring 220 people to think the same way * The biggest bottleneck right now: Finding AI implementation consultants Find this episode’s full show notes here: * ⁠⁠ [⁠https://bubble.io/blog/the-new-build-06-matt-graham-rapiddev]https://bubble.io/blog/the-new-build-06-matt-graham-rapiddev⁠ [https://bubble.io/blog/the-new-build-06-matt-graham-rapiddev⁠] Links: * RapidDev: http://rapidevelopers.com [http://rapidevelopers.com] * Matt on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/matt-graham-nocode/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/matt-graham-nocode/] * Start building: bubble.io [http://bubble.io]