For The Love With Jen Hatmaker Podcast

Description: Today’s episode is an absolute treat. Catherine Newman, the beloved author of both fiction and nonfiction writing, known for her sharp wit, emotional resonance, and profound insights into everyday life, sits down with Jen to talk about our August JHBC selection, Sandwich, which quickly gained national attention for its honest, tender, and hilarious reflection on real life in the messy middle years.  In this discussion that feels like a conversation between lifelong friends, Jen and Catherine delve into the unique challenges faced by the Sandwich Generation.  Catherine writes so beautifully about the ache of watching our kids become adults—still ours, but not really, meanwhile exploring what it looks like to engage in the caretaking and slow grief of watching our parents age. And with hilarious candor, she peels back the curtain of what it’s like to endure all of this in the throes of menopause.  It’s a book that feels like it crawled inside our minds, hearts, and lives.  Catherine also gives glimpses into how many of the characters and storylines were inspired by real life experiences, which is perhaps why it tugs so tenderly on our heartstrings and strikes such a raw and honest chord with its readers. Thought-provoking Quotes: * “I became like a total writing-for-money whore. I couldn't believe you could write for money. It was so intoxicating to me and I started writing everything I could if they would pay me for it and I did this until last year. And it didn't really matter what they would pay me for it. And I wrote everybody's alumni magazines. I wrote advertorial copy for websites. I wrote the etiquette column for Real Simple Magazine for 10 years, like a billion different things. And here I am.”  – Catherine Newman * “Talk about ‘sandwich’. I'm the filling that's slowly extracting itself. I'm like the bologna creeping out the back door while the sandwich takes care of itself. An incredible system.” – Catherine Newman * “How did I not know this stuff? I thought menopause really was the cessation of your period. Like it was a train you got on when you were 12 and then you just stepped off of it when you were 50. Not that you stepped off this train and entered this hellscape.” – Catherine Newman * “I stopped reading the Goodreads reviews for Sandwich — somebody did call the book ‘grinding and plotless’. It was a three-word review and I loved it so much, like this is the slow drip of shame and hubris for me…. I want that on my tombstone ‘grinding and plotless’, like ‘tell me about it, you only had to read about it, this is my actual life.’” – Catherine Newman To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy [https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices [https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices]

Description: In this episode, we open the mic to our incredible podcast community, spotlighting the diverse feedback and personal stories from our listeners that have shaped our discussions. Hear firsthand accounts of the impact our guests and their insights have had. Listeners Melinda, Tracy, Joanna, Erin, Kelly, Laura, and Sarah share a wide range of experiences: navigating major life changes like empty-nesting, building new friendships, wrestling with evolving faith, and even becoming an unwilling country music convert. We also dive into some humorous reflections about Travis and TayTay, rest stop kittens, and open mic nights. Join us as we celebrate the voices that make our podcast a vibrant and dynamic space for conversation and connection. Tune in and be part of the dialogue. Thought-provoking Quotes: * “Let the top rung of the ladder be your sincere convictions. That's the one to keep sturdy, clear, and visible, and hold that one as tight as you can.” – Jen Hatmaker * “Anchor your feet into the ground and stand in this storm. Let it rage. Weather it, weather your own discomfort, weather everybody else's discomfort and whatever loss or change comes along with it, because it will end, and there will come a day when it is not that chaotic and what you will be left with is your integrity and that is enough.” – Jen Hatmaker * “Women are capable of getting through the hardest things.  Maybe it’s a trope because it’s true. Maybe the women who are betrayed grieve and recover and rebuild because that's what women do. So maybe it's not such a surprise that we can flourish.” – Amy Hardin * “I’m just convinced, this is the time for us to reinvent. Look how awesome we are.” – Jen Hatmaker Resources Mentioned in This Episode: * Taylor Swift and Travis Kelce engagement post [https://www.instagram.com/p/DN02niAXMM-/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&igsh=MTQ4YWwzOGcycWJlcA==] - https://www.instagram.com/p/DN02niAXMM-/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&igsh=MTQ4YWwzOGcycWJlcA== * [ENCORE] When the Truth Goes Viral: The Cost (and Benefit) of Living Honestly with Jonathan Merritt [https://jenhatmaker.com/podcasts/series-64/encore-when-the-truth-goes-viral-the-cost-and-benefit-of-living-honestly-with-jonathan-merritt/] - https://jenhatmaker.com/podcasts/series-64/encore-when-the-truth-goes-viral-the-cost-and-benefit-of-living-honestly-with-jonathan-merritt/ * Awake: A Memoir [https://amzn.to/3VnMb0k] by Jen Hatmaker - https://amzn.to/3VnMb0k * The Interview: Jen Hatmaker’s Life Exploded in Middle Age. So She Built a Better One. [https://www.nytimes.com/2025/08/23/magazine/jen-hatmaker-interview.html] – https://www.nytimes.com/2025/08/23/magazine/jen-hatmaker-interview.html * Shiny, Happy People [https://tv.apple.com/us/show/shiny-happy-people/umc.cmc.68y3j8gmhyj647n1j8hgscd3p] - https://tv.apple.com/us/show/shiny-happy-people/umc.cmc.68y3j8gmhyj647n1j8hgscd3p * No Filter, Just The Mirror: Trisha Yearwood Reflects On New Seasons and New Ambitions [https://jenhatmaker.com/podcasts/series-64/no-filter-just-the-mirror-trisha-yearwood-reflects-on-new-seasons-and-new-ambitions/] - https://jenhatmaker.com/podcasts/series-64/no-filter-just-the-mirror-trisha-yearwood-reflects-on-new-seasons-and-new-ambitions/ * Trisha Yearwood - The Mirror [https://trishayearwood.lnk.to/TheMirror] – https://trishayearwood.lnk.to/TheMirror * Awake Book Tour with guest moderator Trisha Yearwood - Austin, TX [https://www.eventbrite.com/e/bookpeople-presents-jen-hatmaker-awake-tickets-1388635428949?aff=oddtdtcreator] - https://www.eventbrite.com/e/bookpeople-presents-jen-hatmaker-awake-tickets-1388635428949?aff=oddtdtcreator * I Choose Me: Jennie Garth on Midlife, Reinvention & Owning Your Next Chapter [https://jenhatmaker.com/podcasts/series-64/i-choose-me-jennie-garth-on-midlife-reinvention-owning-your-next-chapter/] - https://jenhatmaker.com/podcasts/series-64/i-choose-me-jennie-garth-on-midlife-reinvention-owning-your-next-chapter/ * Gretchen Rubin [https://gretchenrubin.com/] - https://gretchenrubin.com/ * Our Epidemic of Loneliness and Isolation | The U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory on the  Healing Effects of Social Connection and Community, 2023 [https://www.hhs.gov/sites/default/files/surgeon-general-social-connection-advisory.pdf] - https://www.hhs.gov/sites/default/files/surgeon-general-social-connection-advisory.pdf Connect with Jen!Jen’s Website [https://jenhatmaker.com/] - https://jenhatmaker.com/ Jen’s Instagram [https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker] - https://instagram.com/jenhatmakerJen’s Twitter [https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/] - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/ Jen’s Facebook [https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker] - https://facebook.com/jenhatmakerJen’s YouTube [https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker?sub_confirmation=1] - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy.  To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy [https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices [https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices]

Description: Today, Jen has a discussion with her longtime friend, brilliant thought-leader and activist, Austin Channing Brown. You probably know Austin from her viral first book, I’m Still Here: Black Dignity in a World Made for Whiteness, which flew off shelves in 2020 following the murder of George Floyd, as we were witnessing worldwide protests, calls for police reform, and a radical change to our racial justice systems. Countless people trusted Austin to help them unpack and understand the racial reckoning going on in our country at that time. Now, Austin is releasing a new project that shares some of her hard-fought learnings gained since that tumultuous time. Full of Myself: Black Womanhood and the Journey to Self-Possession is a love letter to the black women, like Austin herself, who are exhausted from being everything to everyone but themselves. Across essays titled “I Love Myself When I Am Laughing,” “When I Am Awkward,” “When I Am Failing,” and more, Austin celebrates the fullness of her humanity. Each chapter becomes a mirror, asking women—especially Black women—to consider where they’ve given themselves away and what it would mean to live with self-possession instead. Highlights from this conversation include: * What it means to Austin to be “full of herself”—a phrase she reclaimed as an act of resistance, dignity, and spiritual integrity * What happens in our bodies when we operate out of alignment with ourselves * What it means to be a Black woman striving to live fully in a world that often demands her silence, her labor, and her conformity * And the inspirational, life-saving advice that Austin received from activist, Tarana Burke This is such a good conversation starter and one to be shared, for sure. Thought-provoking Quotes: * “I'm sick of white people telling me I have to remain in unhealthy workplaces, unhealthy worship spaces, unhealthy towns in order to save them. Everywhere I go, I'm told I should sacrifice myself for the possibility of whiteness getting its shit together.” – Austin Channing Brown * “I grew up in an era that we called racial reconciliation. ‘Racial justice’ was too hard. It implied that there were two people who had both done wrong and needed to come together. And the way that was often phrased for people of color was that we needed to teach, we needed to offer grace, we needed to bend over backwards, we needed to touch hearts and minds, endless patience, we needed to watch our tone, we needed to be open and inviting. It was all about what we needed to do.” – Austin Channing Brown * “There is an integrity, accountability, and power that comes with being full of myself. And there is a lack of needing to please anybody else. Because I'm full of me.” – Austin Channing Brown Resources Mentioned in This Episode: * Full of Myself: Black Womanhood and the Journey to Self-Possession [https://amzn.to/4k0SQI1] by Austin Channing Brown - https://amzn.to/4k0SQI1 * I'm Still Here: Reese's Book Club: Black Dignity in a World Made for Whiteness [https://amzn.to/4jElqyn] by Austin Channing Brown - https://amzn.to/4jElqyn * Nikki Giovanni, poet [https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poets/nikki-giovanni] - https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poets/nikki-giovanni  * Zora Neale Hurston [https://www.zoranealehurston.com/] - https://www.zoranealehurston.com/ * I Love Myself When I Am Laughing And Then Again When I Am Looking Mean & Impressive [https://amzn.to/3FVpGvA] by Zora Neale Hurston - https://amzn.to/3FVpGvA * Tarana Burke [https://www.taranaburke.com/] - https://www.taranaburke.com/ Guest’s Links: Website [https://austinchanning.com/] - https://austinchanning.com/ Instagram [https://www.instagram.com/austinchanning/] - https://www.instagram.com/austinchanning/ Twitter [https://x.com/austinchanning] - https://x.com/austinchanning Facebook [https://www.facebook.com/austinchanningbrown] - https://www.facebook.com/austinchanningbrown Substack [https://substack.com/@austinchanning] - https://substack.com/@austinchanning Connect with Jen!Jen’s Website [https://jenhatmaker.com/] - https://jenhatmaker.com/ Jen’s Instagram [https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker] - https://instagram.com/jenhatmakerJen’s Twitter [https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/] - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/ Jen’s Facebook [https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker] - https://facebook.com/jenhatmakerJen’s YouTube [https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker?sub_confirmation=1] - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy [https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices [https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices]

Description: Today’s conversation might have you clutching your pearls and purity rings. Jen and Amy sit down with Dr. Celeste Holbrook—sexologist, educator, and author of Missionary Position: A Slightly Irreverent Guide to Sex After Purity Culture—for the candid, hilarious, and healing “sex talk” you never had but always deserved. From busting purity culture myths to unpacking women’s complicated relationship with pleasure, Dr. Holbrook shares the four “inner missionaries” that shape our approach to sex, why sexual shame runs so deep, and how to reclaim intimacy as the joyful gift it was always meant to be. Highlights include:  * Unpacking women' s complicated relationship with pleasure * Dr. Holbrook prescribes the best sexy-time soundtrack * Review of the four inner missionaries (the Analyst, the Assassin, the Healer, and the Explorer) – the archetypes that define our individual approach to sex  * Celeste reveals a surprising fact that both golf carts and ejaculate have in common * How the combination of purity culture, patriarchy and capitalism are the oppression cocktail for sex * And the conversation veers off course when the trio discusses an exercise that uses Jason Mamoa to evaluate their sexual ethics Thought-provoking Quotes: * “When I say sex education saved my relationship, I am not being bombastic. It really did help me find myself.” – Dr. Celeste Holbrook * “We view sex through a patriarchal lens. Media tells us how to feel about sex and what is sexy. So what is sexy has been historically white, thin, able-bodied, young… And the way that we view ourselves then says, well, what if I'm not all of those things? Am I still sexy? Is my body still OK?” – Dr. Celeste Holbrook * “The work for us, especially as women, is to anchor into our body to experience sensuality in order to experience sex instead of perform sex.” – Dr. Celeste Holbrook * “We need to be inside the system in order to take down the system.” – Dr. Celeste Holbrook Resources Mentioned in This Episode: * Jen Hatmake’s Sex MeCourse: SexEd For the Rest of Us [https://shop.jenhatmaker.com/products/sex-101] - https://shop.jenhatmaker.com/products/sex-101 * Pantsuit Politics [https://www.instagram.com/pantsuitpolitics/?hl=en] - https://www.instagram.com/pantsuitpolitics/ * Missionary Position: A Slightly Irreverent Guide to Sex after Purity Culture [https://amzn.to/46StjOa] by Dr. Celeste Holbrook - https://amzn.to/46StjOa * For the Love of Men [https://amzn.to/41JtRSS] by Liz Plank – https://amzn.to/41JtRSS  * Say Yes to Pleasure: How to Talk About Sex and Rekindle Intimacy in Midlife with Vanessa Marin [https://jenhatmaker.com/podcasts/series-64/say-yes-to-pleasure-how-to-talk-about-sex-and-rekindle-intimacy-in-midlife-with-vanessa-marin/] – https://jenhatmaker.com/podcasts/series-64/say-yes-to-pleasure-how-to-talk-about-sex-and-rekindle-intimacy-in-midlife-with-vanessa-marin/ * A Tribe Called Quest [https://atribecalledquest.com/blogs/discography] – https://atribecalledquest.com/blogs/discography * The Pleasure Club [https://www.drcelesteholbrook.com/https/thepleasureclub] - https://www.drcelesteholbrook.com/https/thepleasureclub Guest’s Links: Website [https://www.drcelesteholbrook.com/] - https://www.drcelesteholbrook.com/ Instagram [https://www.instagram.com/drcelesteholbrook/] - https://www.instagram.com/drcelesteholbrook/ Facebook [https://www.facebook.com/DrCelesteHolbrook/] - https://www.facebook.com/DrCelesteHolbrook/ Connect with Jen!Jen’s Website [https://jenhatmaker.com/] - https://jenhatmaker.com/ Jen’s Instagram [https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker] - https://instagram.com/jenhatmakerJen’s Twitter [https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/] - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/ Jen’s Facebook [https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker] - https://facebook.com/jenhatmakerJen’s YouTube [https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker?sub_confirmation=1] - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy.  To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy [https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices [https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices]

It’s time for another beloved encore presentation and this time we are bringing back this powerful podcast therapy session for your benefit and enjoyment.  Dr. Sara Kuburic, an existential psychotherapist and author behind The @Millennial.Therapist, offers profound insights into taking ownership of our lives. Dr. Kuburic champions the idea that we are free and responsible agents, shaping our own development through our choices. While it's easy to blame external forces for unhappiness, she encourages us to embrace the amazing opportunity to engage in life fully. She poses a crucial question: how much of what we face is inflicted by us, and how much just happens? As a therapist, she equips people with tools to navigate life’s challenges, asking: “what can you change or how can you change your attitude so the situation is less painful for you?” Beyond existential thought, Jen and Dr. Kuburic explore self-loss and how we can unknowingly deceive ourselves into believing we're living the life we desire, even as our bodies signal distress through depression, anxiety, and panic. Jen and Dr. Kuburic get honest about: * The difference between loving the "idea" of who you are versus who you actually are, and how to stop self-deception. * The point when avoiding change becomes more painful than embracing it. * Acknowledging our physical limits: how our bodies send red flags like anxiety, fear, or panic, even when we feel strong. * How an all-consuming dedication to making something work, even if it's not right for us, can lead to our weakest moments if we don't face the truth. Thought-provoking Quotes: * “We get to engage in life; we can take ownership, we can take responsibility, we can make choices, and I think that that’s really how I see human suffering. My question is always, ‘how much of it happened to you? How much of it did you inflict on yourself?’” – Dr. Sara Kuburic * “Life happens to us but that’s not all that happens. We also happen to life.” – Dr, Sara Kuburic * “The most pain I experienced actually came from my own participation, which included avoidance and self-deceit. I am not hard on myself because it came from such a pure place. I can’t be mad at myself. But, I also understand that it’s not something that serves me.” – Dr. Sara Kuburic * “The truth is there regardless of whether or not you choose to see it. It will dictate your life until you see it. So are you safe enough in yourself to handle the truth that you are resisting or avoiding? That’s a really delicate question that we need to honor.” – Dr.  Sara Kuburic Resources Mentioned in This Episode: * Dr. Sara Kuburic’s “For the rest of 2025” Instagram post [https://www.instagram.com/p/C_WjH0mzF9z/] - https://www.instagram.com/p/C_WjH0mzF9z/ * It’s On Me: Accept Hard Truths, Discover Yourself and Change Your Life [https://amzn.to/3Uf40yf] * by Dr. Sara Kuburic - https://amzn.to/3Uf40yf * Dr. Sara Kuburic’s USA Today Column [https://www.usatoday.com/staff/7586635002/sara-kuburic/] - https://www.usatoday.com/staff/7586635002/sara-kuburic/ Guest’s Links: Website [https://www.sara-kuburic.com/] - https://www.sara-kuburic.com/ Instagram [https://www.instagram.com/millennial.therapist/?hl=en] - https://www.instagram.com/millennial.therapist/?hl=en Twitter [https://x.com/SaraKuburic] - https://x.com/SaraKuburic Facebook [https://www.facebook.com/sarakuburic/] - https://www.facebook.com/sarakuburic/ Connect with Jen!Jen’s Website [https://jenhatmaker.com/] - https://jenhatmaker.com/ Jen’s Instagram [https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker] - https://instagram.com/jenhatmakerJen’s Twitter [https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/] - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/ Jen’s Facebook [https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker] - https://facebook.com/jenhatmakerJen’s YouTube [https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker?sub_confirmation=1] - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy.  To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy [https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices [https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices]