My Food Job Rocks!

It is an honor to interview the man who introduced one of the first popular culinary science books and probably has inspired thousands of food science professionals, Harold McGee. Harold McGee’s writing style is unique because he really deep dives into a very specific topic. Food Science and culinary friends might recognize him from the book, On Food and Cooking: The Science and Lore of the Kitchen [https://amzn.to/3fHrtmq], but now he has a new, stellar book about smells! Nose Dive, A Field Guide to the World of Smells [https://amzn.to/2V8d1KK] is a fascinating book that dives into not just food smells, but also dives into other interesting smells such as flowers, the human body, and the stars! If you are a food scientist, having a grasp of smells, might be useful in your career. What is probably the best lesson from the famed author Harold McGee, is that he reinvented himself multiple times. His intent was actually being an astronomy but he pivoted multiple times form literature, and then food and what you discovered is that Harold McGee’s success comes from this unlimited curiosity whenever he is passionate in a subject. So these threads, from astronomy, to poetry, to cooking, to smells, has a common theme: intense curiosity. Lots of things to uncover in this interview. From the journey that Harold McGee took to write his smash hit, his lucky opportunity getting the book out there, and Harold’s thoughts on how food has eveolve din his life time. Also learn why Harold wrote a new book, and what he thinks about humans recreating animal-like products like meat and honey. He has a closer connection to it than you think. Show Notes Harold McGee wrote about food in 1970 [https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2011/feb/03/harold-mcgee-food-science] I started writing about food because I couldn’t get a job in literature I did Astronomy first and then switched to literature Why did you get into Astronomy?: I recall a project in 2nd or 3rd grade Cal Tech [https://www.caltech.edu/] I was able to study with a person who figured out that the elements were from the stars What got you into literature?: Standing looking in the stars had to do more with feelings and emotions rather than calculations and I realized I wanted to write What influenced your writing style?:  I did a thesis on 19th century English poetry What is your opinion on Science and Art?: I try to not pigeon-hole science and try and shape it to be more understanding Liebig – Searing meats seal in the juices? [https://grillhunters.co/searing-meat-seal-juices/] Science doesn’t even have a lock on authority. My publisher liked me to talk about cooking, but to add stories when describing things. He really changed the way I write Keys to Good Cooking [https://amzn.to/2V9MEnV] How do you write about a specific topic?: I really love research. Especially these days, we have the internet If you research a lot, you have to cut things?: Yes, I have a ton of left over notes. Who was talking with you when this book came out?: Actually, nobody in the 1980s. Nobody was really using unique cooking ingredients. Mimi Sheraton [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mimi_Sheraton] – Wrote an article on Time Magazine about the book and it exploded The people I heard form most were not professional cooks, but actually students who wanted to be professional cooks. They would try to get professional chefs to answer questions that wasn’t answered in the book but the chefs wouldn’t give them stellar advice How has food evolved in your life time?: More accessibility to more cool things. A growing interest in food and drink and experience. Food has evolved, hasn’t it?: Yes, how I ate and my kids ate is completely different My Food Job Rocks: I’m amazed about the complexity of cooking. And there’s more to come Let’s talk about the science of smells: I started to dive into flavors at first but then my curiosity took me to a new place: smells. Why did flowers have the same smell of oysters? Borage flowers [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Borage] have the same smell of oysters and cucumbers I had to talk to Flavor Chemists when we work together. How do you communicate smells?: Smells are based off of objective facts and biological memories. Training is all about training that database My job was to give a field guide to smells. Not fully subjective, but a mix of both In the book, there are tons of comparative tables If you “listen” to smells, you can actually get a lot more out of things Top Note Base Note Perfumers actually have a similar method on describing smells When you focus, the smells actually dissipate and you can understand the aroma better. Do you have a method of smelling?: I kind of “pump” my breath so you breathe out and you get some interesting smells. I create an accordion motion with my tongue and that gives me more of a sequence of experiences than one long understanding How do you feel about alternative meat?: Actually, my kids played soccer with Pat Brown’s kids so I knew him in the circles. One day, Pat called me and we had a talk about a crazy food idea that ended up being Impossible Foods. [https://impossiblefoods.com/] The products are getting closer and for the right reasons. I’m greatful for the personal happenstance that allowed me to get into that industry Will this help scientists?: Yes, it’s a good overview of understanding smells. It can help you be a human GCO in some sense GCO – Gas Chromatography [https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0167450106800075] What is one thing in the food industry you’d like to know more about?: I get a lot of alerts from science journals Journal of Agriculture and Food Chemistry [https://pubs.acs.org/journal/jafcau] Chemistry and Biodiversity [https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/journal/16121880] Do you have any advice for someone to stretch their curiosity?: Yes, take advantage of the availability of information. You can get interested in something and go to Google Scholar [https://scholar.google.com/] and just type in a couple of key words and you’ll see amazing things that are published Don’t just limit yourself to a particular discipline or a particular field, they bloom when they synergize Where can we find you for advice?: Nose Dive should be on the shelves and also online stores I can be found at my website, HaroldMcGee.com [https://www.curiouscook.com/]

Today we have Arvind Gupta, Co-Founder of IndieBio and Po Bronson, Managing Director of IndieBio. They both wrote a book together called Decoding the World, A Roadmap for the Questioner. A, I would say an anthology of all of the wonderful technologies Po and Arvind have incubated through their journey in IndieBio. For those that don’t know, IndieBio is this amazing biotechnology incubator in San Francisco. I’ve spoken there a few times myself. Basically, imagine this incubator that takes these fantastic ideas but also has the equipment to create a viable product for future funding. A lot of companies like Memphis Meats, Clara Foods, Prime Roots, Geltor, Perfect Day, NotCo, Endless West, New Age Meats, Finless Foods. Why am I naming so many of them? Because not only are these companies hot, up and coming superstars in the food industry, but I personally have friends in all of these food companies! It’s been an honor to have the opportunity to interview the team in charge of sparking the flame and I ask how they started and got involved in IndieBio, how young people can contribute to this biotech movement,  and I think we have a very touching and important discussion about the value of doing creative art with your science career. Po and Arvind have great chemistry and it was a blast talking to them. I added a bit of pre-audio banter, because I found it so funny. Show Notes IndieBio – Independent Biology [https://indiebio.co/] Located in Jessie Street Why IndieBio?: It lowers the barrier of entry of BioTech Startup IndieBio: What are huge problems that no one can address that we can solve? We have areas in new York, China, etc Notable companies that went through IndieBio Memphis Meats [https://www.memphismeats.com/] Clara Foods [https://www.clarafoods.com/] Prime Roots [https://www.primeroots.com/] Geltor [https://geltor.com/] Perfect Day [https://perfectdayfoods.com/] NotCo [https://notco.com/] Endless West [https://endlesswest.com/] New Age Meats [https://www.newagemeats.com/] Finless Foods [https://www.finlessfoods.com/] Sandhill Road: Silicon Valley Money Worldly Priorities: Do we need an environmental disaster to finally understand that this is an issue?: Cognitive Dissonance is a huge problem. [https://www.simplypsychology.org/cognitive-dissonance.html] We might need something bigger to happen Do you think there’s going to be more companies solving this?: The younger generation is taking note and they are asking “what can I do to change it?” In most situations, the taste will always have to win for consumer acceptance. Environmental challenges are generally second-teir How did you start?: Arvind: My thesis was modifying e.coli to dissolve wood at 1996 Venture Capital is the ultimate business model to take all the risk How do we have scientists take more risk?: Most safe jobs aren’t as safe as you think Generally, you’ve already bet on yourself with your PhD For Po: IndieBio is a movement, not everyone needs to be a founder, but everyone can be part of the movement. It’s not just the scientists Author of 7 New York Times Best Seller Indie books People thrive in a balance between security and risk and different people have different thresholds Po, you’re an author, why are you in food?: I’ve grown up in it my whole life around food Why did Po and Arvind create a book?: We’re both artists so we get along Dr. June Axup [https://indiebio.co/jun-axup/] – plays Ukelele and sings science songs In this industry, your mind has to be extremely fast Also, most companies that go here have a sense of performance art because it’s so ambitious My Food Job Rocks: Arvind: We play an important role in having scientists build meaningful companies Po: I love proving people Wrong How do people get into IndieBio?: A one-page application. You can attach a pitch deck if you got it We do 10 startups twice a year every 6 months in San Francisco and New York Where can we find your work? Indiebio.co [https://indiebio.co/] – You can select SF or NY Decoding the World – DecodingtheWorld.com [https://www.decodingtheworld.com/] Social Media: Po Bronson [https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS901US901&ei=RwO8X8n_K7KLwbkPlqu6qAM&q=%40pobronson&oq=%40pobronson&gs_lcp=CgZwc3ktYWIQAzoECAAQR1DWFVjWFWDsF2gAcAJ4AIABZYgBZZIBAzAuMZgBAKABAaoBB2d3cy13aXrIAQXAAQE&sclient=psy-ab&ved=0ahUKEwiJv7TIqZntAhWyRTABHZaVDjUQ4dUDCA0&uact=5] Social Media: Arvind Gupta [https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS901US901&ei=bgO8X9yrJoeVwbkPzJeA4Ac&q=Arvind+Gupta+indiebio&oq=Arvind+Gupta+indiebio&gs_lcp=CgZwc3ktYWIQAzIFCAAQyQMyAggAOgcIABDJAxAeOgQIABAeOgcILhBDEJMCOggIABCxAxCDAToCCC46CwguELEDEMcBEKMCOggILhCxAxCDAToOCC4QsQMQgwEQxwEQowI6BQgAELEDOgUILhCxAzoICC4QxwEQrwE6CwguELEDEMcBEK8BOgoILhDJAxBDEJMCOggILhDHARCjAjoUCC4QyQMQkQIQiwMQmgMQqAMQkwI6FAguEMkDEJECEIsDEKgDEJoDEJMCOggIABDJAxCRAjoFCAAQkQI6BggAEBYQHlCfQFjeXWDfX2gAcAB4AoAB2wOIAaAYkgEKNS4xNC4yLjAuMZgBAKABAaoBB2d3cy13aXq4AQLAAQE&sclient=psy-ab&ved=0ahUKEwjcmvvaqZntAhWHSjABHcwLAHwQ4dUDCA0&uact=5] How’s the pandemic treating you this year?: This batch, we couldn’t do food companies but next batch has a few promising food ones

This amazing episode is with Ryan Bethencourt, Founder and CEO of Wild Earth [https://wildearth.com/pages/landing-bof?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=DX-branded&gclid=Cj0KCQiAwMP9BRCzARIsAPWTJ_H3dWFwf7nyzqNXOmGhzCC7C8Xsnx2M59sRjDzIiLpECtxqtt55kc0aArgUEALw_wcB], but this guy invests, mentors and influences and has had such an impact in the alt-meat and biotech community. If you’re in the plant-based community and don’t know Ryan, get to know him, follow him on LinkedIn, he is one of the lynchpins in this innovative field and shares a ton of amazing content. So what has Ryan done so far?  Well, started a company? Several. Invested in innovative technology? Scientist? Yep. Been on Shark Tank? Got an investment on Shark Tank! This guy has done everything! A big takeaway from this episode is that Ryan was told no all the time. Why? Because he had dyslexia as a kid but after reading some science fiction and then busting his butt working really hard, he kept on breaking expectations and is now a literal limitless human being and has leveraged his weakness into his greatest strength. I know Ryan personally, and I never knew this story! You’ll learn a bit more about his personal life such as why he moved out of Silicon Valley to Research Triangle Park in North Carolina and set up an awesome sustainable food fund with his wife. Based on the length of the episode and the quality of today’s guest, I don’t have to tell you that you will learn a lot and be inspired in this interview. The best takeaway in this episode is that even if people say you can’t, you can. Show Notes Mark Cuban Shark Tank Deal [https://vegconomist.com/products-and-launches/mark-cuban-backed-wild-earth-launches-worlds-first-high-protein-meat-free-dog-food/] What do you call yourself when you talk to people?: If it’s simple I say I run a dog food company I also have invested in/helped build 130 startups I cofounded Indiebio and I cofounded Wild Earth The first investor in Memphis Meats, [https://www.memphismeats.com/] Not Co, Geltor, Clara Foods Arvind and Po’s Book [https://amzn.to/3nvLEqr] Silicon Valley actually has a biotech ecosystem but it was hard to break in. Once the recession hits, we bought biotech equipment and put them into our garage SOS Ventures [https://sosv.com/] backe dour company called IndieBio [https://indiebio.co/] and we would provide a lab to scientists Y-combinator [https://www.ycombinator.com/] NotCo in the US [https://notco.com/] Wait, are you an investor and a CEO?: Yes, I’m an AND person. I do both Sustainable Food Ventures [https://www.sustainablefoodventures.com/] What Are You?: I’m many things, but you and I have done the “and”. Give yourself permission to do both and it’s ok to fail and don’t listen to the people who say no I was dyslexic as a child and really had a handicap in school. My parents always believed in me and introduced me to science fiction Science fiction told me about what is possible and taught me to work harder to make these goals happen Once I found that computers helped me work faster, I leveraged technology to do great job. Eventually, after I looked up from the grindstone, I became more knowledgable people GATTACA – the swimming part [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ll5qiWa6YDk] Book: Three Body Problem Series – Chinese Fiction - Three part series [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Three-Body_Problem_(novel)] What other cultures can do science fiction well? Each culture can give us a different lense into science fiction Silicon Valley – The Rome of Technology Ryan was always looking at multiple hubs to leave Silicon Valley Steve Case – AOL Focus on the Rise of the Rest [https://www.bizjournals.com/washington/news/2020/01/14/steve-case-gases-up-the-bus-for-another-rise-of.html] Research Triangle Hub [https://hub.rtp.org/] Marilis Holme, my wife and I created a new future of food fund in the triangle called Sustainable Food Ventures [https://www.sustainablefoodventures.com/team] It is harder to set up a fund in undeveloped projects but it’s worth it What is your strategy in developing cities? Big Idea Ventures [https://myfoodjobrocks.com/230andrew/] Veggie Victory – Rise of Plant-based Meat in Nigeria [https://www.pri.org/stories/2019-04-23/meet-nigeria-s-small-growing-vegetarian-and-vegan-community] Plant-based Meat is supposed to be 1% of the meat market right now How do people get money from startups?: Just ask us. We help Book: Zero to One [https://amzn.to/2IFcblQ] Golden Beef- Real Beef but slaughtered free [https://www.studyfinds.org/golden-meat-healthier-beef-products-plant-nutrients/] Tufts University Golden Rice [https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2013/09/golden-rice-not-so-golden-tufts] Better Meat Co [https://myfoodjobrocks.com/a-better-bet/] Motif Foodworks [http://madewithmotif.com/] Why did you start Wild Earth?: Funny enough, no one wanted me to make this company and they wouldn’t want to invest in me on dog food Dogs eat everything We are actually getting some interesting data on dogs eating a plant-based diet. We are funding future research For Wild Earth, it’s not just that we’re plant-based, but we care about our pet’s nutrition We want Wild Earth to be the leader of plant-based dog food and make an impact with giant companies. The more we can convince large pet food companies join us, the more impactful you can be Book: Hyper Competition – Managing Dynamics of Strategic Maneuvering [http://daveni.tuck.dartmouth.edu/research-and-ideas/hypercompetition] Porter’s 5 Laws are Wrong. They only matter in a  static system, not a dynamic system The true barrier is constant innovation Telsa is an example of a constantly innovating product Book: Elon Musk Biography by Ashley Lance [https://amzn.to/36GFjBp] Moonshots – Elon needs our help to bring the future of food to feed people in Mars Book: The Future is Faster Than You Think [https://amzn.to/32MWK22] Peter Diamandas from X-prize [https://www.xprize.org/about/people/peter-h-diamandis-md] My Food Job Rocks: I get to feed my dog an amazing product that was once an idea and now is a product Venture Capitalists: generally are risk adverse Softbank and WeWork [https://www.cnbc.com/2020/05/18/softbank-ceo-calls-wework-investment-foolish-valuation-falls-to-2point9-billion.html] How do we kick people in the pants about climate change?: I believe in humanity in the long term. I believe we can solve a lot of problems. The Tech investors in the West coast might have awoken to the sheer issue with the climate situation Book: Wizard and the Prophet [https://amzn.to/3ntal6E] How do you inspire scientists to take risks to start businesses to save the world?: Scientists want to make science for the love of it. It’s hard for them to take risks. Give yourself permission to try. If you have a  good idea, email me at ryan@sustainablefoodventures.com [ryan@sustainablefoodventures.com] SustainableFoodVentures.com [https://www.sustainablefoodventures.com/] – We love to fund idea stage companies

We kick off this interview with some product development tips. Lindsey Wisener works with all sorts of clients big and small and so we talk about the best way to say, communicate feedback. Lindsey owns WiseBev, a consultancy with a built-out lab in Indiana It’s important to note that Lindsay built a consultancy with a functional lab from scratch but it took her a while to do so but by leveraging her experience and doing it right, she now thrives with a  small team, making innovative products. We break down step by step how she did it. From what she studied in University to the value of keeping your connections close when you’re ready to try something new. Show Notes Peas on Moss with Lindsay Wisner [https://peasonmoss.libsyn.com/preview-wisebev-founder-lindsay-wisener-on-her-scariest-rd-moment] Robert Kay from Isagenix [https://www.isagenix.com/digestive-health] What do you say in a sentence eor less?: I help people bring their beverage to life I own and operate WiseBev and specifically do beverage I have a small team of scientists. I live in a rural part of Indiana Is it hard to get clients when you’re rural?: Sort of, so I made my own business How do you communicate projects?: I do live tastings with my clients and have an objective when we taste. I take notes while we’re live. How do you communicate feedback?: If it’s objective like a comparison, it’s a bit easier. If the objective is subjective, we talk a bit more specifically about the flavor profile Who do you usually talk to during a tasting?: Generally the Internal R+D team. Once it goes through the gauntlet, I’ve probably done around 50 or so samples so I have a generally good idea How did you find out about food science?: Living in rural areas allows you to be iin tuned to food science. My animal science class had a video about being a food scientist I ended up being a graduate student in dairy chemistry and worked at Johnson Nutrition Johnson Nutrition [https://www.meadjohnson.com/] focuses on three different types of formula: Baby, Toddler, and Older-than-Toddler Then I worked at Kellogg’s nutrition Insights on failed projects: Sometimes it truly is feasibility. The technology isn’t there yet How is it different from working with Kelloggs and Entrepreneurs?: The big companies are still guarded by financials and technology. The smaller ones have different problems Generally for Entrepreneurs, we have a two day working session and go through the whole process in understanding the challenges of making a beverage What usually shocks people?: Generally the process cost and MOQ quantities. You can’t just make 2000 units. You have to make millions. MOQ- Minimum Order Quantities [https://dearsystems.com/minimum-order-quantity/#:~:text=A%20minimum%20order%20quantity%20(MOQ,t%20sell%20it%20to%20you.] Shipping Water When did you start your consulting business?: I was 30 and had my first kid and decided to do contract work. I started my LLC 2 years later My first client was from my old boss at Johnson Nutrition that I still kept in contact with. I started with a pH, aW meter, and some scales and had to drive to the local college to use the complex machinery. Eventually, I had enough money to create my own lab I have a 25 acre place and thought I could create lab there. Unfortuantely, there were a lot of challenges such as rezoning, put in a new septic system, approvals, inspection, and it cost 3 x as much and 3 x as long But now it’s all good 4 years later. It’s a good investment for this type of situation My Food Job Rocks: I get to spend all day in a lab creating new beverages What trends or technology are you excited about?: Coffee innovation in tea. You might see some cool things in the tea space in the retail space Have you noticed anything different in the clients you’re getting during the pandemic?: Alternate/non-dairy proteins is not going away. Hard Seltzer/Mocktails and some keto products What is one thing in the food industry you would like to know more about?: Sensory science Ivy Koliker’s episode [https://myfoodjobrocks.com/237ivy/] Do you recommend any books?: Gen Sincero. You Are a Badass [https://amzn.to/3eND8j6] What about podcasts?: Biz Chicks [https://bizchix.com/], Consulting Success [https://www.consultingsuccess.com/?gclid=CjwKCAiAkan9BRAqEiwAP9X6UfCdoBgr1AiBPD7B65n598693WEpA6Ut-vnAXQnNsWuBBCPiWqU53xoCgU0QAvD_BwE] What is some advice you can give on how to start consulting?: Do something you know really well. People kept on calling me on product development Where can we find you?: I’m on Linkedin [https://www.linkedin.com/in/lindsaywisener/] Lindsey@wisebev.com [Lindsey@wisebev.com]

Today, I interview Toni Okamoto, founder of Plant-based on a Budget and Michele Cehn, founder of World of Vegan to talk about their new book and their journey in building their business. Combined, they have over 1.5 million Instagram followers and numbers in the six figures on various platforms such as youtube, email lists, and everything else. Toni and Michelle built their following from scratch and turned what they did from hobby to business. In this episode, you will learn the journey that Toni and Michelle took to get there as long as some really insightful tips on running an influencer company. But most importantly, they’re a dynamic duo and an amazing case study of how collaboration amplifies everyone. The funny story is that I’ve met them personally and have even playtested their recipe. Why Funny you should ask. Toni’s husband is Paul Shapiro, author of Clean Meat, and a popular interview in episode 102. [https://myfoodjobrocks.com/102paul/] When I moved to Sacramento to start Better Meat Co [https://myfoodjobrocks.com/a-better-bet/], Toni was one of the first people I met in Sacramento and Michelle also lives there. Since they loved to cook, they would do a lot of fun parties and cook delicious food. One of my favorites is a chocolate pie made of silken tofu. Toni and Michelle are probably the most down to Earth people I’ve ever met.  They are super authentic, super passionate in what they do, and they are just such nice, accommodating people who are just full of sunshine. You can find their new, collaborative cookbook The Friendly Vegan Cookbook [https://amzn.to/3oP3DJP] wherever you can find books, and we have a link to it in our shownotes! About Toni Toni Okamoto is the founder of Plant-Based on a Budget, the popular website and meal plan that shows you how to save dough by eating veggies. She’s also author of the Plant-Based on a Budget Cookbook, co-author of The Friendly Vegan Cookbook, and the co-host of The Plant-Powered People Podcast. Okamoto’s work has been profiled by NBC News, Parade Magazine, and she’s a regular presence on local and national morning shows across the country, where she teaches viewers how to break their meat habit without breaking their budget. She was also featured in the popular documentary What the Health. When she’s not cooking up a plant-based storm, she’s spending time with her husband and their rescued dog in Sacramento, CA. About Michelle Michelle Cehn is the founder of the popular food and lifestyle website World of Vegan and a YouTube personality who has reached millions through her creative and relatable videos. She is also co-host of the Plant-Powered People Podcast and co-creator of the 12-Day Dairy Detox, Plant Based on a Budget Meal Plans, and 7 Days documentary. Michelle has been on a lifelong mission to make kind and healthy living enticing, easy, and fun, ever since the age of eight when she first became a vegetarian. Also a passionate photographer and filmmaker, you can find her dishing out mouth-watering food photos and inspiration daily on Instagram, hanging with her pup Chance, and stepping into parenthood with her hubby Dan. Show Notes During the pandemic Michelle now has a new baby Toni now has a new dog. Pitbull handle - @eddiethepittie [https://www.instagram.com/eddiethepittie/?hl=en] Toni Okamoto – I’m an author [https://plantbasedonabudget.com/] Michelle – I own the website World of Vegan [https://www.worldofvegan.com/] Toni’s Platform Toni’s Instagram: [https://www.instagram.com/plantbasedonabudget/?hl=en] 400,000 followers E-newsletter: 60,000 followers Website Plant-based on a budget: 15,000 users/day Michelle’s Platform Michelle’s Instagram: [https://www.instagram.com/vegan/?hl=en] @vegan: 1.1 million people Also do youtube videos Toni’s audience is more budget friendly Michelle’s audience is more focused on veganism Over time, our audience blends We chose the word The Friendly Vegan to promote the love of food On our book, we look for cheaper ways and more available options for the world What’s the most underrated plant-based protein?: Lentils Lentil Shepard’s pie [https://vegnews.com/2008/12/savory-vegan-shepherds-pie] Tuna Salad made of Chickpeas [https://plantbasedonabudget.com/how-to-make-an-easy-vegan-meal-chickpea-sandwich/] How does the process work?: We started veganiging our family recipes and went from there How did you find out about Veganism? Toni Okamoto’s story: stopped eating meat at 16, then became full vegan in college and then with 11 years of experience, did animal advocacy. Plant-based on a budget is actually a side project What the Health [https://www.whatthehealthfilm.com/] exposure exploded Toni’s career Michelle Cehn’s story: I worked on world of vegan for a while and when I lost my job, I had a choice and ended up working my butt off and ended up getting much more money than I thought I could get What were your metrics on going forward with your blogging projects?: I always had low expectations in terms of how much I need to survive. I would always review business goals Toni Okamoto’s Story: I was always poor and to the point, I was always surviving. I had Paul Schwartz (friend of ours) help me push myself to make bigger goals. I found a $70k salary was an extremely ambitious goal Patreon [https://www.patreon.com/home] What was your first Sponsorship story? Toni Okamoto: I did a sponsored post for a baby stroller and got $200 dollars. I had no kids and was transparent that I was doing this to keep the lights on Michelle Cehn: I went to Natural Products Expo West and saw people paying social media influencers I would give companies my media kit and charged $25 dollars per post. Every time I would communicate for a brand and they kept on saying yes so I double the price As an Influencer, surprisingly the difference in success is price per user. If you charge more, you survive more All big companies have a plant-based company now There’s a lot of information, too much so a lot of our content is focused on recipe development and help lift that sector up Vegan is generally a bad word. A lot of people who approach us love us because we’re friendly What is one piece of advice about becoming a professional blogger?: Just do it. Know that there will be challenges and don’t try to focus on the competition What was the make-or-break point that made you keep going?: For Toni, she got an email that talked about this mother taking care of her family using plant-based on a budget For Michelle, it’s every warm piece of feedback Plant-powered People Podcast [https://www.plantbasedmealplan.com/podcast]