Secrets and Spies Podcast: Current Affairs | Geopolitics | Intelligence

Chris speaks with researcher and author Ross Downing about his book Germanic and Slavic Paganism: Security Threats and Resiliency. Ross, who works with a network of scholars and specialists focused on minority religions and extremism, explores how modern pagan traditions, particularly those rooted in Germanic and Slavic identity, are increasingly weaponized by extremist movements on both sides of the Ukraine War. From the myth of the warrior ideal to the role of neo-paganism in Russian special forces and the Azov movement, Ross unpacks the ideological messiness, spiritual camouflage, and social vulnerabilities that make these belief systems ripe for radicalization. They also discuss the “folkish vs. inclusive” divide, the algorithm’s role in spreading conspiratorial spirituality, and why mainstream institutions need to step up—not just to contain extremism, but to support resilient, non-violent expressions of cultural identity. Find Ross’s book: https://www.bloomsbury.com/us/germanic-and-slavic-paganisms-9781350423916/ [https://www.bloomsbury.com/us/germanic-and-slavic-paganisms-9781350423916/] Watch on YouTube to see Ross talk about Pagan symbols used by Russian and Ukrainian forces: https://youtu.be/IMJ3OH3czMA [https://youtu.be/IMJ3OH3czMA] [https://youtu.be/IMJ3OH3czMA] Subscribe and share to stay ahead in the world of intelligence, geopolitics, and current affairs. SUPPORT SECRETS AND SPIES Become a “Friend of the Podcast” on Patreon for £3/$4: https://www.patreon.com/SecretsAndSpies [https://www.patreon.com/SecretsAndSpies] Buy merchandise from our shop: https://www.redbubble.com/shop/ap/60934996 [https://www.redbubble.com/shop/ap/60934996] Subscribe to our YouTube page: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDVB23lrHr3KFeXq4VU36dg [https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDVB23lrHr3KFeXq4VU36dg] For more information about the podcast, check out our website: https://secretsandspiespodcast.com [https://secretsandspiespodcast.com] CONNECT WITH US ON SOCIAL MEDIA Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/secretsandspies.bsky.social [https://bsky.app/profile/secretsandspies.bsky.social] Instagram: https://instagram.com/secretsandspies [https://instagram.com/secretsandspies] Facebook: https://facebook.com/secretsandspies [https://facebook.com/secretsandspies] Spoutible: https://spoutible.com/SecretsAndSpies [https://spoutible.com/SecretsAndSpies] Follow Chris and Matt on Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/chriscarrfilm.bsky.social [https://bsky.app/profile/chriscarrfilm.bsky.social] https://bsky.app/profile/mattfulton.net [https://bsky.app/profile/mattfulton.net] Secrets and Spies is produced by F & P LTD. Music by Andrew R. Bird Photo by Olga Maltseva/AFP Secrets and Spies sits at the intersection of intelligence, covert action, real-world espionage, and broader geopolitics in a way that is digestible but serious. Hosted by filmmaker Chris Carr and writer Matt Fulton, each episode examines the very topics that real intelligence officers and analysts consider on a daily basis through the lens of global events and geopolitics, featuring expert insights from former spies, authors, and journalists.

There will be no show today. Our next show will be on Saturday 24th May, which will be an interview with Ross Downing, looking at Pagan Extremism, Warrior Myths, and the Culture Wars of Russia and Ukraine. Our next Espresso Martini will be on Saturday 31st May. Please send us your listener questions by Wednesday 28th May. Please send us an email to secretsandspiespodcast@gmail.com [secretsandspiespodcast@gmail.com] or DM us on our social channels.     IN YOUR MESSAGE, PLEASE INCLUDE:  * Question or Topic with a relevant news or online publication link  * How you would like us to read out your name & location online SUPPORT SECRETS AND SPIES Become a “Friend of the Podcast” on Patreon for £3/$4: https://www.patreon.com/SecretsAndSpies [https://www.patreon.com/SecretsAndSpies] Buy merchandise from our shop: https://www.redbubble.com/shop/ap/60934996 [https://www.redbubble.com/shop/ap/60934996] Subscribe to our YouTube page: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDVB23lrHr3KFeXq4VU36dg [https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDVB23lrHr3KFeXq4VU36dg] For more information about the podcast, check out our website: https://secretsandspiespodcast.com [https://secretsandspiespodcast.com] CONNECT WITH US ON SOCIAL MEDIA Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/secretsandspies.bsky.social [https://bsky.app/profile/secretsandspies.bsky.social] Instagram: https://instagram.com/secretsandspies [https://instagram.com/secretsandspies] Facebook: https://facebook.com/secretsandspies [https://facebook.com/secretsandspies] Spoutible: https://spoutible.com/SecretsAndSpies [https://spoutible.com/SecretsAndSpies] Follow Chris and Matt on Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/chriscarrfilm.bsky.social [https://bsky.app/profile/chriscarrfilm.bsky.social] https://bsky.app/profile/mattfulton.net [https://bsky.app/profile/mattfulton.net] Secrets and Spies is produced by F & P LTD. Music by Andrew R. Bird Secrets and Spies sits at the intersection of intelligence, covert action, real-world espionage, and broader geopolitics in a way that is digestible but serious. Hosted by filmmaker Chris Carr and writer Matt Fulton, each episode examines the very topics that real intelligence officers and analysts consider on a daily basis through the lens of global events and geopolitics, featuring expert insights from former spies, authors, and journalists.

This week, Chris and Matt break down the uneasy truce reached between India and Pakistan after weeks of escalating violence, with the Trump administration stepping in late to help broker a ceasefire and avert a possible nuclear crisis. Then, former NSA and CIA director Gen. Michael Hayden issues a stark warning about the dangers of personal loyalty tests in national security—raising concerns about competence, dissent, and decision-making at the highest levels. Finally, the guys examine President Trump’s controversial plan to accept a former Qatari royal jet as a temporary Air Force One, weighing the security, ethical, and logistical risks of putting the president aboard a previously foreign-owned aircraft. Subscribe and share to stay ahead in the world of intelligence, geopolitics, and current affairs. ARTICLES DISCUSSED IN TODAY’S EPISODE "From missiles to ceasefire: how India and Pakistan pulled back from the brink" by Shah Meer Baloch & Hannah Ellis-Petersen | The Guardian: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/may/12/how-india-and-pakistan-conflict-turned-from-brink-of-war-to-ceasefire-in-days [https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/may/12/how-india-and-pakistan-conflict-turned-from-brink-of-war-to-ceasefire-in-days] "As Truce Seems to Hold, India and Pakistan Both Claim Victory" by Anupreeta Das, Salman Masood & Hari Kumar | The New York Times: https://www.nytimes.com/2025/05/11/world/asia/india-pakistan-kashmir-ceasefire.html [https://www.nytimes.com/2025/05/11/world/asia/india-pakistan-kashmir-ceasefire.html] "Vance called Indian prime minister to encourage ceasefire talks after receiving alarming intelligence, sources say" by Alayna Treene | CNN: https://www.cnn.com/2025/05/10/politics/vance-modi-india-pakistan-intelligence [https://www.cnn.com/2025/05/10/politics/vance-modi-india-pakistan-intelligence] "When It Comes to National Security, Loyalty Tests Should Have No Place" by Gen. Michael Hayden | The Cipher Brief: https://www.thecipherbrief.com/column_article/when-it-comes-to-national-security-loyalty-tests-should-have-no-place [https://www.thecipherbrief.com/column_article/when-it-comes-to-national-security-loyalty-tests-should-have-no-place] "Trump administration poised to accept 'palace in the sky' as a gift for Trump from Qatar" by Jonathan Karl & Katherine Faulders | ABC News: https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/trump-administration-poised-accept-palace-sky-gift-trump/story?id=121680511 [https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/trump-administration-poised-accept-palace-sky-gift-trump/story?id=121680511] "Corruption and a Security Catastrophe in Plane Sight" by Garrett Graff | Doomsday Scenario on Substack: https://www.doomsdayscenario.co/p/corruption-and-a-security-catastrophe-in-plane-sight-c5cd67a113caf678 [https://www.doomsdayscenario.co/p/corruption-and-a-security-catastrophe-in-plane-sight-c5cd67a113caf678] "Turning Qatar’s Gifted 747 Into Air Force One Will Be Anything But Free" by Howard Altman & Tyler Rogoway | The War Zone: https://www.twz.com/air/turning-qatars-gifted-747-into-air-force-one-will-be-anything-but-free [https://www.twz.com/air/turning-qatars-gifted-747-into-air-force-one-will-be-anything-but-free] SUPPORT SECRETS AND SPIES Become a “Friend of the Podcast” on Patreon for £3/$4: https://www.patreon.com/SecretsAndSpies [https://www.patreon.com/SecretsAndSpies] Buy merchandise from our Redbubble shop: https://www.redbubble.com/shop/ap/60934996 [https://www.redbubble.com/shop/ap/60934996] Subscribe to our YouTube page: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDVB23lrHr3KFeXq4VU36dg [https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDVB23lrHr3KFeXq4VU36dg] For more information about the podcast, check out our website: https://secretsandspiespodcast.com [https://secretsandspiespodcast.com] CONNECT WITH US ON SOCIAL MEDIA Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/secretsandspies.bsky.social [https://bsky.app/profile/secretsandspies.bsky.social] Instagram: https://instagram.com/secretsandspies [https://instagram.com/secretsandspies] Facebook: https://facebook.com/secretsandspies [https://facebook.com/secretsandspies] Spoutible: https://spoutible.com/SecretsAndSpies [https://spoutible.com/SecretsAndSpies] Follow Chris and Matt on Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/chriscarrfilm.bsky.social [https://bsky.app/profile/chriscarrfilm.bsky.social] https://bsky.app/profile/mattfulton.net [https://bsky.app/profile/mattfulton.net] Secrets and Spies is produced by F & P LTD. Music by Andrew R. Bird Photos by Senior Airman Nathan Wingate/USAF Secrets and Spies sits at the intersection of intelligence, covert action, real-world espionage, and broader geopolitics in a way that is digestible but serious. Hosted by filmmaker Chris Carr and writer Matt Fulton, each episode examines the very topics that real intelligence officers and analysts consider on a daily basis through the lens of global events and geopolitics, featuring expert insights from former spies, authors, and journalists.

Candace Rondeaux joins Chris to unpack the dark mythology and hard realities behind the Wagner Group, drawing from her investigative book Putin’s Sledgehammer. They explore Wagner’s roots in post-Soviet chaos, its fusion of state power and criminal underworlds, and its critical role in Russia’s foreign policy ambitions from Syria to Africa to Ukraine. Candace explains how Wagner became a key tool for circumventing sanctions, selling arms, spreading disinformation, and exporting Russia’s influence under the guise of deniability. They discuss the rise and fall of Yevgeny Prigozhin, Wagner’s shadowy presence in Zelensky’s early presidency, and how the group evolved into today’s “Africa Corps.” Plus: assassination attempts, troll farms, and how a sledgehammer murder became a viral propaganda symbol. Find more on Candace's research on Wagner here: https://uncoveringwagner.org/ [https://uncoveringwagner.org/] Find Putin's Sledgehammer here:  https://www.hachettebookgroup.com/titles/candace-rondeaux/putins-sledgehammer/9781541703087/ [https://www.hachettebookgroup.com/titles/candace-rondeaux/putins-sledgehammer/9781541703087/] Subscribe and share to stay ahead in the world of intelligence, geopolitics, and current affairs. SUPPORT SECRETS AND SPIES Become a “Friend of the Podcast” on Patreon for £3/$4: https://www.patreon.com/SecretsAndSpies [https://www.patreon.com/SecretsAndSpies] Buy merchandise from our shop: https://www.redbubble.com/shop/ap/60934996 [https://www.redbubble.com/shop/ap/60934996] Subscribe to our YouTube page: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDVB23lrHr3KFeXq4VU36dg [https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDVB23lrHr3KFeXq4VU36dg] For more information about the podcast, check out our website: https://secretsandspiespodcast.com [https://secretsandspiespodcast.com] CONNECT WITH US ON SOCIAL MEDIA Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/secretsandspies.bsky.social [https://bsky.app/profile/secretsandspies.bsky.social] Instagram: https://instagram.com/secretsandspies [https://instagram.com/secretsandspies] Facebook: https://facebook.com/secretsandspies [https://facebook.com/secretsandspies] Spoutible: https://spoutible.com/SecretsAndSpies [https://spoutible.com/SecretsAndSpies] Follow Chris and Matt on Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/chriscarrfilm.bsky.social [https://bsky.app/profile/chriscarrfilm.bsky.social] https://bsky.app/profile/mattfulton.net [https://bsky.app/profile/mattfulton.net] Secrets and Spies is produced by F & P LTD. Music by Andrew R. Bird Photo by TASS & Reuters Secrets and Spies sits at the intersection of intelligence, covert action, real-world espionage, and broader geopolitics in a way that is digestible but serious. Hosted by filmmaker Chris Carr and writer Matt Fulton, each episode unpacks global events through the lens of intelligence and geopolitics, featuring expert insights from former spies, authors, and analysts.

In this week’s Espresso Martini, Chris and Matt dig into a wave of elections across the UK, Canada, and Australia, exploring what they signal for populist movements, center-left parties, and Trump-style politics beyond US borders. They break down the rise of Reform UK, growing concerns over Nigel Farage’s influence, and why British voters seem caught in a cycle of backlash politics. Then, a pair of liberal wins in Canada and Australia suggest that even the faintest whiff of Trumpism remains a liability overseas. Finally, they dissect the demotion of Mike Waltz, explain why combining the roles of secretary of state and national security advisor is historically fraught, and ask whether the Trump White House has learned anything—or simply become more ruthless in its chaos. All that, plus Larry the Cat for PM, the specter of Musk in British politics, and an earnest thank-you to recent reviewers. Subscribe and share to stay ahead in the world of intelligence, geopolitics, and current affairs. PLEASE SHARE THIS EPISODE USING THESE LINKS Audio: https://pod.fo/e/2d365f [https://pod.fo/e/2d365f] YouTube: https://youtu.be/fenomGCz6Ys [https://youtu.be/fenomGCz6Ys] ARTICLES DISCUSSED IN TODAY’S EPISODE “Farage claims Reform UK local election gains ‘beginning of the end’ for Tories" by Peter Walker, Eleni Courea, and Kiran Stacey | The Guardian: https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2025/may/02/farage-reform-uk-local-elections-beginning-of-the-end-for-tories [https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2025/may/02/farage-reform-uk-local-elections-beginning-of-the-end-for-tories] "Does Farage own the future?" by Andrew Marr | The New Statesman: https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk-politics/2025/05/does-farage-own-the-future [https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk-politics/2025/05/does-farage-own-the-future] "First Canada, Now Australia: The Trump Factor Boosts Another World Leader in an Election" by Mike Cherney | The Wall Street Journal: https://www.wsj.com/world/first-canada-now-australia-the-trump-factor-boosts-another-world-leader-in-a-close-election-bef1c5a1 [https://www.wsj.com/world/first-canada-now-australia-the-trump-factor-boosts-another-world-leader-in-a-close-election-bef1c5a1] “Inside Mike Waltz’s White House Exit" by Isaac Stanley-Becker, Ashley Parker, Jonathan Lemire & Shane Harris | The Atlantic: https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2025/05/03/waltz-trump-israel [https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2025/05/03/waltz-trump-israel] "Inside Waltz’s ouster: Before Signalgate, talks with Israel angered Trump" by Michael Birnbaum, John Hudson, Emily Davies, Sarah Ellison & Natalie Allison | The Washington Post: https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2025/05/mike-waltz-trump-fired/682660 [https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2025/05/mike-waltz-trump-fired/682660] SUPPORT SECRETS AND SPIES Become a “Friend of the Podcast” on Patreon for £3/$4: https://www.patreon.com/SecretsAndSpies [https://www.patreon.com/SecretsAndSpies] Buy merchandise from our Redbubble shop: https://www.redbubble.com/shop/ap/60934996 [https://www.redbubble.com/shop/ap/60934996] Subscribe to our YouTube page: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDVB23lrHr3KFeXq4VU36dg [https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDVB23lrHr3KFeXq4VU36dg] For more information about the podcast, check out our website: https://secretsandspiespodcast.com [https://secretsandspiespodcast.com] CONNECT WITH US ON SOCIAL MEDIA Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/secretsandspies.bsky.social [https://bsky.app/profile/secretsandspies.bsky.social] Instagram: https://instagram.com/secretsandspies [https://instagram.com/secretsandspies] Facebook: https://facebook.com/secretsandspies [https://facebook.com/secretsandspies] Spoutible: https://spoutible.com/SecretsAndSpies [https://spoutible.com/SecretsAndSpies] Follow Chris and Matt on Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/chriscarrfilm.bsky.social [https://bsky.app/profile/chriscarrfilm.bsky.social] https://bsky.app/profile/mattfulton.net [https://bsky.app/profile/mattfulton.net] Secrets and Spies is produced by F & P LTD. Music by Andrew R. Bird Photos by Daniel Torok/White House Secrets and Spies sits at the intersection of intelligence, covert action, real-world espionage, and broader geopolitics in a way that is digestible but serious. Hosted by filmmaker Chris Carr and writer Matt Fulton, each episode unpacks global events through the lens of intelligence and geopolitics, featuring expert insights from former spies, authors, and analysts.