BE THAT LAWYER

Jordan Ostroff & Jeremy Baker: From Big Law and Prosecution to Thriving Solo Practices (Part 1)

Thinking about going solo but stuck in anxiety and overplanning? In this episode, two lawyers who successfully left prosecution and big law share the real math, mindset, and first 90‑day moves that make or break a new solo practice.   In this episode, Steve Fretzin, Jordan Ostroff, & Jeremy Baker discuss: * Deciding when and why to go solo * Leaving a firm the right way and preserving relationships * Planning for cash flow, costs, and the first 90 days * Using AI and lean tech instead of heavy overhead * Common mistakes with hiring, planning, and business development   Key Takeaways: * The decision to launch a solo practice often comes from a clear moment of misalignment, realizing the “next promotion” or status quo is not the life or career you actually want. * A realistic financial and marketing plan, what you’ll spend, how you’ll earn, and where new files will come from, is more important than a perfect logo, office, or tech stack. * Maintaining integrity and open communication when you leave a firm protects your reputation, preserves referrals, and can turn former colleagues into long-term allies. * Early-stage solos should prioritize cash flow and relationships over tinkering with systems; networking your existing contacts usually beats waiting on websites and ads to work. * AI tools can dramatically reduce startup costs and speed up execution, but they are a supplement to, not a substitute for, consistent outreach and business development.   "What I did wrong in year one was I didn't hire people, and what I did wrong in year two is I hired people the wrong way." —  Jeremy Baker   Check out my new show, Be That Lawyer Coaches Corner, and get the strategies I use with my clients to win more business and love your career again.   Join the Be That Lawyer Community [https://fretzin.com/community/?utm_source=chatgpt.com] and connect with ambitious lawyers who are serious about growing their book of business, strengthening their brand, and becoming confident, consistent rainmakers.   Ready to go from good to GOAT in your legal marketing game? Don’t miss PIMCON—where the brightest minds in professional services gather to share what really works. Lock in your spot now: https://www.pimcon.org [https://www.pimcon.org/]/   Thank you to our Sponsor! LEX Reception: https://www.lexreception.com/partners/bethatlawyer [https://www.lexreception.com/partners/bethatlawyer] Rankings.io: https://rankings.io/ [https://rankings.io/] Lawyer.com: https://www.lawyer.com/ [https://www.lawyer.com/]   Ready to grow your law practice without selling or chasing? Book your free 30-minute strategy session now—let's make this your breakout year: https://fretzin.com/ [https://fretzin.com/]   About Jordan Ostroff: Jordan Ostroff is the CEO of Driven Law and Carpe Diem Consulting. A former prosecutor and the first lawyer in his family, Jordan overcame $200,000 in early business debt to build a thriving, low-volume personal injury practice. Now the best-selling author of Love Your Law Firm, he works 20–25 hours a week, allowing him time for family and coaching other attorneys to achieve a similar high quality of life.   About Jeremy Baker: Jeremy Baker is a veteran construction attorney and litigator representing owners, developers, and design professionals. In his sixth year of solo practice, he specializes in cost-efficient solutions for issues like contract negotiation and sustainable design. While an experienced litigator in 30+ venues and dozens of arbitrations, Jeremy prioritizes dispute avoidance and alternative dispute resolution. An early proponent of the Guided Choice Dispute Resolution System, he provides strategic advocacy to resolve high-stakes claims without the need for traditional litigation.   Connect with Jordan Ostroff:  Website: https://www.legaleasemarketing.com/ [https://www.legaleasemarketing.com/] LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jordan-ostroff/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/jordan-ostroff/]   Connect with Jeremy Baker:   Website: https://designbuildlaw.com/ [https://designbuildlaw.com/] LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeremysbaker/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeremysbaker/]   Connect with Steve Fretzin: LinkedIn: Steve Fretzin [https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevefretzin/] Twitter: @stevefretzin [https://twitter.com/stevefretzin] Instagram: @fretzinsteve [https://www.instagram.com/fretzinsteve/] Facebook: Fretzin, Inc. [https://www.facebook.com/fretzinsteve] Website: Fretzin.com [https://fretzin.com/] Email: Steve@Fretzin.com [Steve@Fretzin.com] Book: Legal Business Development Isn't Rocket Science [https://www.fretzin.com/about/books/] and more! [https://fretzin.com/about/books/] YouTube: Steve Fretzin [https://www.youtube.com/user/SalesResultsInc] Call Steve directly at 847-602-6911   Audio production by Turnkey Podcast Productions. [https://www.turnkeypodcast.com/] You're the expert. Your podcast will prove it.

Simone Fulmer Gaus: Building a Law Firm on People, Pipeline, Process, Product, and Profit

What happens when a trial lawyer stops replicating the traditional firm model and starts treating her practice like a business? In this episode, Simone Fulmer Gaus shares the five-part framework that took her from burnout and cash-flow crises to a scalable, values-driven law firm.   In this episode, Steve Fretzin and Simone Fulmer Gaus discuss: * Facing hard truths and business challenges in law practice * Leaving the traditional firm model to build a different kind of practice * The five pillars: people, pipeline, process, product, profitability * Delegation, time blocking, and working on the business * Values-based hiring and retaining the right team   Key Takeaways: * You cannot build a healthy, scalable practice if you insist on personally controlling every aspect of the firm. * Treating the firm as its own “entity” that needs care and strategy, separate from the legal work, changes how you make decisions. * Structuring the business into clear buckets (people, pipeline, process, product, profitability) gives clarity on what’s broken and what to fix first. * Setting aside dedicated time each week to work on the business, not just in it, is essential to moving out of chaos. * Hiring and retaining the right people depends less on résumés and more on alignment with clearly defined core values.   "You can automate so much of what you could do, you can delegate so much of what you do, and you can definitely, whether you believe it or not, eliminate a whole lot of those hats you're wearing." —  Simone Fulmer Gaus   Check out my new show, Be That Lawyer Coaches Corner, and get the strategies I use with my clients to win more business and love your career again.   Join the Be That Lawyer Community [https://fretzin.com/community/?utm_source=chatgpt.com] and connect with ambitious lawyers who are serious about growing their book of business, strengthening their brand, and becoming confident, consistent rainmakers.   Ready to go from good to GOAT in your legal marketing game? Don’t miss PIMCON—where the brightest minds in professional services gather to share what really works. Lock in your spot now: https://www.pimcon.org [https://www.pimcon.org/]/   Thank you to our Sponsor! LEX Reception: https://www.lexreception.com/partners/bethatlawyer [https://www.lexreception.com/partners/bethatlawyer] Rankings.io: https://rankings.io/ [https://rankings.io/] Lawyer.com: https://www.lawyer.com/ [https://www.lawyer.com/]   Ready to grow your law practice without selling or chasing? Book your free 30-minute strategy session now—let's make this your breakout year: https://fretzin.com/ [https://fretzin.com/]   About Simone Fulmer Gaus: Simone Fulmer Gaus is a nationally recognized plaintiff trial lawyer and co-founder of Fulmer Sill, with nearly three decades of experience in high-stakes civil litigation. Specializing in insurance bad-faith disputes and catastrophic injury cases, Simone brings a unique "insider" perspective to her practice, having begun her career in the general counsel’s office of a major insurance company. Since 1998, she has leveraged this knowledge to hold powerful insurers accountable, ensuring they honor their obligations to policyholders and injured individuals. Beyond the courtroom, Simone is a respected author and speaker, focusing on law firm leadership and operational structure. Her work is informed by both professional rigor and personal experience; after a family member sustained a traumatic brain injury, she deepened her commitment to families facing life-altering harm. Today, she balances her role as an advocate with her work as the author of The Set-Up, helping other trial firms achieve sustainable growth through disciplined preparation and strategic clarity.   Connect with Simone Fulmer Gaus: Website: https://www.fulmersill.com/ [https://www.fulmersill.com/] LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/simonefulmergaus/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/simonefulmergaus/]   Connect with Steve Fretzin: LinkedIn: Steve Fretzin [https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevefretzin/] Twitter: @stevefretzin [https://twitter.com/stevefretzin] Instagram: @fretzinsteve [https://www.instagram.com/fretzinsteve/] Facebook: Fretzin, Inc. [https://www.facebook.com/fretzinsteve] Website: Fretzin.com [https://fretzin.com/] Email: Steve@Fretzin.com [Steve@Fretzin.com] Book: Legal Business Development Isn't Rocket Science [https://www.fretzin.com/about/books/] and more! [https://fretzin.com/about/books/] YouTube: Steve Fretzin [https://www.youtube.com/user/SalesResultsInc] Call Steve directly at 847-602-6911   Audio production by Turnkey Podcast Productions. [https://www.turnkeypodcast.com/] You're the expert. Your podcast will prove it.

Elise Holtzman: The Three Pillars of Business Development for Lawyers

Most lawyers are taught to color inside the lines until they realize that won’t build the book of business they want. In this episode, you’ll learn how to move from random acts of marketing to a focused, scalable rainmaking strategy using relationships, visible expertise, and a true support team.   In this episode, Steve Fretzin and Elise Holtzman discuss: * Mindset shift from “born rainmaker” to “learned skill” * Getting started: moving beyond random acts of marketing * The three pillars of business development (relationships, visible expertise, thoughts/time/team) * Breaking through plateaus at $500K+ and $1M+ books of business * Delegation, building a team, and the role of a “lieutenant”/sponsor   Key Takeaways: * Business development is a learnable skill, not an innate talent reserved for a select few; lawyers who treat it like any other competency they’ve mastered can grow serious books of business. * Hope is not a strategy. Clarity on ideal clients, referral sources, and where they “hang out” must replace scattered networking and random acts of marketing. * Visible expertise is essential: becoming “famous in your niche” through speaking, writing, and thought leadership ensures you’re not the best-kept secret in your practice area. * As a book of business grows, time, team, and the courage to say no become critical levers; lawyers must deliberately delegate and build a trusted support structure if they want to scale beyond early successes. * Every revenue level introduces new, different challenges; plateaus are not signs of failure but signals that it’s time to reassess, refine strategy, and upgrade how you use your time, team, and leadership.   "Stepping outside the comfort zone with support is the way to go." —  Elise Holtzman   Check out my new show, Be That Lawyer Coaches Corner, and get the strategies I use with my clients to win more business and love your career again.   Join the Be That Lawyer Community [https://fretzin.com/community/?utm_source=chatgpt.com] and connect with ambitious lawyers who are serious about growing their book of business, strengthening their brand, and becoming confident, consistent rainmakers.   Ready to go from good to GOAT in your legal marketing game? Don’t miss PIMCON—where the brightest minds in professional services gather to share what really works. Lock in your spot now: https://www.pimcon.org [https://www.pimcon.org/]/   Thank you to our Sponsor! LEX Reception: https://www.lexreception.com/partners/bethatlawyer [https://www.lexreception.com/partners/bethatlawyer] Rankings.io: https://rankings.io/ [https://rankings.io/] Lawyer.com: https://www.lawyer.com/ [https://www.lawyer.com/]   Ready to grow your law practice without selling or chasing? Book your free 30-minute strategy session now—let's make this your breakout year: https://fretzin.com/ [https://fretzin.com/]   About Elise Holtzman: Elise is the founder and CEO of The Lawyer’s Edge, a coaching and consulting firm that helps lawyers and law firms strengthen business development, leadership, and communication skills. A former practicing attorney with experience at Am Law 100 firms, including Fried Frank and Morgan Lewis, Elise combines her legal background with executive coaching to help attorneys grow profitable practices and build healthier firm cultures. She is a frequent speaker on leadership and rainmaking, host of The Lawyer’s Edge Podcast, and has been featured in publications including Law360 and The New York Law Journal. Elise earned her J.D. from Columbia Law School and her B.A. in Psychology from the University of Pennsylvania.   Connect with Elise Holtzman:   Website: https://thelawyersedge.com/ [https://thelawyersedge.com/] LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/eliseholtzman/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/eliseholtzman/]   Connect with Steve Fretzin: LinkedIn: Steve Fretzin [https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevefretzin/] Twitter: @stevefretzin [https://twitter.com/stevefretzin] Instagram: @fretzinsteve [https://www.instagram.com/fretzinsteve/] Facebook: Fretzin, Inc. [https://www.facebook.com/fretzinsteve] Website: Fretzin.com [https://fretzin.com/] Email: Steve@Fretzin.com [Steve@Fretzin.com] Book: Legal Business Development Isn't Rocket Science [https://www.fretzin.com/about/books/] and more! [https://fretzin.com/about/books/] YouTube: Steve Fretzin [https://www.youtube.com/user/SalesResultsInc] Call Steve directly at 847-602-6911   Audio production by Turnkey Podcast Productions. [https://www.turnkeypodcast.com/] You're the expert. Your podcast will prove it.

Rob Hanna: Why Lawyers Must Embrace Content, Community, and Brand to Stay Relevant

In a world where technology and AI are reshaping legal services, simply doing great work is no longer enough. In this episode, you’ll learn how leveraging content, personal brand, and community can keep you relevant, visible, and in demand as the market rapidly evolves.   In this episode, Steve Fretzin and Rob Hanna discuss: * Health, habits, and intentional self-care for high performers * Legal career journey, recruiting, and launching a podcast * Thought leadership, content creation, and personal brand for lawyers * The rise and power of online and offline communities * Technology, AI, and the shifting expectations of legal clients   Key Takeaways: * Treat your health as a non-negotiable business asset; intentionally scheduling exercise, sleep, and recovery fuels better performance, energy, and longevity in your career. * Content is not a vanity play. It’s how you stay visible, demonstrate expertise, and become the “go-to” choice when clients are finally ready to buy. * Community gives law firm owners and lawyers a safe space to be seen, heard, and supported, breaking the isolation that comes with leadership and entrepreneurship. * Technology and AI are eroding the value of pure grunt work, making human judgment, brand, and community presence more crucial than ever to remain relevant. * You don’t need to build a massive empire to benefit from community; starting small, with a few peers, a simple WhatsApp group, or light-touch LinkedIn activity, can compound into powerful opportunities over time.   "I've never met anyone who's built a community who's regretted it.” —  Rob Hanna   Check out my new show, Be That Lawyer Coaches Corner, and get the strategies I use with my clients to win more business and love your career again.   Join the Be That Lawyer Community [https://fretzin.com/community/?utm_source=chatgpt.com] and connect with ambitious lawyers who are serious about growing their book of business, strengthening their brand, and becoming confident, consistent rainmakers.   Ready to go from good to GOAT in your legal marketing game? Don’t miss PIMCON—where the brightest minds in professional services gather to share what really works. Lock in your spot now: https://www.pimcon.org [https://www.pimcon.org/]/   Thank you to our Sponsor! LEX Reception: https://www.lexreception.com/partners/bethatlawyer [https://www.lexreception.com/partners/bethatlawyer] Rankings.io: https://rankings.io/ [https://rankings.io/] Lawyer.com: https://www.lawyer.com/ [https://www.lawyer.com/]   Ready to grow your law practice without selling or chasing? Book your free 30-minute strategy session now—let's make this your breakout year: https://fretzin.com/ [https://fretzin.com/]   About Rob Hanna: Rob Hanna is the founder and host of Legally Speaking Podcast, one of the leading platforms spotlighting legal professionals and industry innovators around the world. With a background in legal recruitment and a passion for storytelling, he has built a global community by sharing insightful conversations on careers, leadership, and the future of law. Known for his engaging style and commitment to adding value, Rob connects lawyers, entrepreneurs, and thought leaders through content that informs, inspires, and elevates the legal profession.   Connect with Rob Hanna: Website: https://legallyspeakingpodcast.com/ [https://legallyspeakingpodcast.com/]   Connect with Steve Fretzin: LinkedIn: Steve Fretzin [https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevefretzin/] Twitter: @stevefretzin [https://twitter.com/stevefretzin] Instagram: @fretzinsteve [https://www.instagram.com/fretzinsteve/] Facebook: Fretzin, Inc. [https://www.facebook.com/fretzinsteve] Website: Fretzin.com [https://fretzin.com/] Email: Steve@Fretzin.com [Steve@Fretzin.com] Book: Legal Business Development Isn't Rocket Science [https://www.fretzin.com/about/books/] and more! [https://fretzin.com/about/books/] YouTube: Steve Fretzin [https://www.youtube.com/user/SalesResultsInc] Call Steve directly at 847-602-6911   Audio production by Turnkey Podcast Productions. [https://www.turnkeypodcast.com/] You're the expert. Your podcast will prove it.

Jason Stiehl: Relationships Over Sales – How Real Connections Build a Legal Practice

What does it really take to move from overworked service partner to trusted rainmaker—without feeling salesy or inauthentic? In this episode, you’ll hear a candid breakdown of career missteps, relationship-first business development, and how patience and consistency can transform a legal practice.   In this episode, Steve Fretzin and Jason Stiehl discuss: * Transitioning from service partner to rainmaker * Relationship-based business development * Honesty, trust, and cross-marketing inside a firm * Content creation, podcasts, and visibility for lawyers * Career mistakes, firm moves, and learning from missteps   Key Takeaways: * Developing a real book of business starts with owning client relationships directly, not just doing great work behind the scenes. * The most effective business development feels less like selling and more like building genuine, long-term relationships based on trust. * Honesty about what you and your firm can and cannot do is a powerful differentiator—and sometimes means referring work elsewhere. * Consistency in follow-up, presence, and outreach matters far more than one-off networking “sprints” or scattershot emails. * Before making a big firm move, dig deeply into culture, capabilities, and expectations; the wrong platform can cost time, clients, and momentum.   "You have to go to different markets. You have to go to different people. You have to realize that if the audience you’re reaching is the same all the time, you're never going to grow." —  Jason Stiehl   Check out my new show, Be That Lawyer Coaches Corner, and get the strategies I use with my clients to win more business and love your career again.   Join the Be That Lawyer Community [https://fretzin.com/community/?utm_source=chatgpt.com] and connect with ambitious lawyers who are serious about growing their book of business, strengthening their brand, and becoming confident, consistent rainmakers.   Ready to go from good to GOAT in your legal marketing game? Don’t miss PIMCON—where the brightest minds in professional services gather to share what really works. Lock in your spot now: https://www.pimcon.org [https://www.pimcon.org/]/   Thank you to our Sponsor! LEX Reception: https://www.lexreception.com/partners/bethatlawyer [https://www.lexreception.com/partners/bethatlawyer] Rankings.io: https://rankings.io/ [https://rankings.io/] Lawyer.com: https://www.lawyer.com/ [https://www.lawyer.com/]   Ready to grow your law practice without selling or chasing? Book your free 30-minute strategy session now—let's make this your breakout year: https://fretzin.com/ [https://fretzin.com/]   About Jason Stiehl: Jason Stiehl is a partner in Crowell & Moring’s Chicago office, where he focuses on class action defense and trade secret protection. An experienced trial lawyer with a nationwide practice, he represents clients across industries in complex litigation, including consumer class actions, advertising disputes, and intellectual property matters. Known for immersing himself in his clients’ businesses, Jason develops strategic defenses to protect their most valuable assets, from brand reputation to proprietary technology. His work spans high-stakes domestic and cross-border disputes, and he has been recognized for his role in securing major dismissals in consumer fraud class actions.   Connect with Jason Stiehl:    Website: https://www.crowell.com/en/professionals/jason-stiehl [https://www.crowell.com/en/professionals/jason-stiehl] LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jason-stiehl-22a82b4/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/jason-stiehl-22a82b4/]   Connect with Steve Fretzin: LinkedIn: Steve Fretzin [https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevefretzin/] Twitter: @stevefretzin [https://twitter.com/stevefretzin] Instagram: @fretzinsteve [https://www.instagram.com/fretzinsteve/] Facebook: Fretzin, Inc. [https://www.facebook.com/fretzinsteve] Website: Fretzin.com [https://fretzin.com/] Email: Steve@Fretzin.com [Steve@Fretzin.com] Book: Legal Business Development Isn't Rocket Science [https://www.fretzin.com/about/books/] and more! [https://fretzin.com/about/books/] YouTube: Steve Fretzin [https://www.youtube.com/user/SalesResultsInc] Call Steve directly at 847-602-6911   Audio production by Turnkey Podcast Productions. [https://www.turnkeypodcast.com/] You're the expert. Your podcast will prove it.