We Don't Like to Admit We Have Power

Failure isn't the Problem. Skipping the Evaluation Is.

In this episode, Jonathan Malm and Jason Young unpack Chapter 6 of How to Get a Return on Failure by John Maxwell, walking through Maxwell's practical "cycle of improvement" and making the case that it's not failure itself that makes you better, it's what you do with it. Jonathan opens up about his current season of experimenting with AI coding (including building a video game with Claude Code and a live display system for his coworking space). Jason gets honest about the temptation to make too many improvements all at once and why small, compounding tweaks almost always beat sweeping overhauls. In this episode, you'll learn: * The 6-step cycle of improvement: test, fail, evaluate, learn, improve, and re-enter and where most leaders get stuck * Why "evaluated experience" is a better teacher than experience alone * The dangerous gap between learning a lesson and actually incorporating it * How to know if you're operating with a fixed mindset or a growth mindset and why it determines everything * Why the best churches don't chase growth. They pursue excellence until growth is demanded * What Chick-fil-A's Truett Cathy has to say to every church obsessed with getting bigger * Why re-entering after failure takes more courage than the original attempt and why it's non-negotiable Plus Jonathan reflects on what it means to unlearn the wrong lessons from failure, and Jason drops a free tool (the Failure Debrief Loop) you can use with yourself and your team. Download the free Failure Debrief Loop at churchstaffbookclub.com [http://churchstaffbookclub.com]

Nobody Signs Up for Difficult, but It's What You Need

In this episode, Jonathan Malm and Jason Young dig into Chapter 5 of How to Get a Return on Failure by John Maxwell and get surprisingly personal doing it. Jason opens up about navigating a genuinely heavy season in real time. Jonathan reflects on what getting fired, building a business, and supporting his wife through her darkest season all happening simultaneously actually produced in him. And both of them wrestle with the question every church leader eventually has to answer: are you running from God, or running to Him? In this episode, you'll learn: * Why your brain is literally wired to avoid difficult, and how to work against that instinct * The dangerous trap of praying for growth while avoiding the very process that produces it * How playing it safe as a leader doesn't just limit you, it limits everyone on your team * Why the leader who pursues hard builds capacity that comfort simply cannot produce * What Netflix, Blockbuster, and COVID all have to say about ministry resilience * How to lead from underneath a difficult boss in a way that pays dividends for years * The difference between being Job and being Jonah Plus, Jonathan and Jason make the case that the hard season you're tempted to escape right now might be the one that defines your leadership forever.

Building Resilience Through Failure Makes You Irreplaceable

Every leader fails. The question isn't whether it'll happen. It's what you do in the moments after. Do you get bitter, or do you get better? In this episode, Jonathan Malm and Jason Young dig into Chapter 4 of How to Get a Return on Failure by John Maxwell, unpacking how failure can become one of the most powerful tools in your leadership development... if you know how to use it. Jason gets refreshingly honest about a leadership experience that went sideways just days before recording, and Jonathan reflects on why the pressure to perform actually grows the more successful you become. In this episode, you'll learn: * Why your response to failure says more about you than the failure itself * How to ask the right questions after a setback so you actually grow from it * Why the same failure that hardens some leaders softens others and how to make sure you're in the right camp * The trap of posturing at conferences (and why the most desperate people in the room often learn the most) * How building resilience through failure actually makes you irreplaceable over time * Why pain and failure by themselves don't produce growth and what actually does * How to shift from being the person doing the cool things to being the person equipping the people doing the cool things Plus a surprisingly rich detour through Pharaoh's hardened heart, Erasmus, and what clay and wax have to do with your next leadership setback.

Stop Fearing Rejection... Become Unstoppable

Failure is hard enough on its own. But when ego gets involved, it can take a setback and turn it into a full identity crisis. This chapter is about getting out of your own way. In this episode of the Church Staff Book Club, Jonathan Malm and Jason Young dig into Chapter 3 of How to Get a Return on Failure by John Maxwell: "Get Over Failure by Getting Over Yourself." Because sometimes the hardest thing to recover from isn't the failure itself. It's the story you tell yourself about it. 🎧 What We Cover in This Episode: * Why ego makes failure more damaging than it needs to be * The subtle difference between "I failed" and "I am a failure" and why it matters * Jonathan's simple prayer before speaking that changed everything * Five filtering questions for deciding whose criticism is actually worth listening to * Why defensiveness is where growth ends * How to become comfortable with rejection (even if you hate it) * Why most "rejections" aren't actually about you at all * The role of humor in recovering from mistakes and what it reveals about security * Why ministry leaders are exhausted from protecting an image that may not even exist * Progress over perfection: why your 40s, 50s, and 60s may be your best years yet 📖 We're Reading: How to Get a Return on Failure by John Maxwell Follow along chapter by chapter with us! 💬 Key Quotes from This Episode: "When you're 20, you care about what everyone thinks. When you're 60, you realize no one was ever thinking about you in the first place." "The sooner you stop fearing rejection, the sooner you can become unstoppable." "You can't be a leader and focus on yourself." 🔗 Connect & Subscribe: Follow us on social media and join the conversation Subscribe so you never miss a chapter Grab How to Get a Return on Failure by John Maxwell and read along with us

Success Can Actually Hurt Your Future

We talk a lot about learning from failure. But what about success? It might be quietly doing more damage than you think. In this episode of the Church Staff Book Club, Jonathan Malm and Jason Young dig into Chapter 2 of How to Get a Return on Failure by John Maxwell. The big idea: success and failure don't belong in isolation, and when we treat them that way, both become dangerous. 🎧 What We Cover in This Episode: * Why success can deceive you just as much as failure can discourage you * The danger of "I am a success" vs. "I am a failure" and why both are wrong * Why the most successful people are sometimes the worst ones to write the book * How repeated success quietly causes you to misalign your values and your why * Why churches struggle to define success and how failure helps realign it * The importance of doing an autopsy on your wins, not just your losses * Jonathan's story: the tuxedo skit that nobody learned anything from * Jason's honest confession: falling into the identity trap with book reviews * Two practical tools to evaluate success and failure: Five Whys and Kaizen * The quarterly journal idea for tracking your team's progress like a scoreboard 📖 We're Reading: How to Get a Return on Failure by John Maxwell Follow along chapter by chapter with us! 💬 Key Quotes from This Episode: "I am a success is just as dangerous as I am a failure." "Success can inflate your ego. Failure attacks it. How do you live inside both?" A bad day doesn't make you a bad leader." 🛠 Free Tools Coming: Jonathan and Jason are building individual and team debriefing tools based on this conversation. Download them at churchstaffbookclub.com [http://churchstaffbookclub.com] 🔗 Connect & Subscribe: Follow us on social media and join the conversation Subscribe so you never miss a chapter Grab How to Get a Return on Failure by John Maxwell and read along with us