17. Interview with Rich Froning

22. A Challenge of Gods

In Episode 22, “A Challenge of Gods,” the Philistine champion steps into the Valley of Elah and turns a military standoff into something far greater than a contest of strength. Cliff begins with the old tradition of trial by combat, where a champion carried the honor, reputation, and fate of those he represented. That same idea stands behind Goliath’s challenge. He is the living embodiment of Philistine power. This episode examines Goliath’s armor in vivid detail, the possible connection between Gath and the ancient giant clans, and the deeper reason the Philistine army waits for weeks instead of simply advancing. For forty days, Goliath stands in the valley, cursing Israel and demanding an answer. And somewhere on the road from Bethlehem, the answer is coming.

21. Interview With Justin Hughes

In this episode, Cliff sits down with Justin Hughes, a former Navy SEAL who is now a professional painter, for a conversation about the difficulty of making art in order to gain insight into how David the artist might have viewed his craft. As the narrative portion of the podcast approaches the Valley of Elah, David is about to demonstrate extreme faith and deadly proficiency with weapons. But David’s public courage was formed long before the battlefield, in the quiet isolation of the shepherd fields, where he learned to worship Yahweh with music, words, and wonder. David was the all-time warrior poet: a fighter, writer, musician, and composer whose artistic heart toward the Lord shaped the courage he carried into battle. Cliff and Justin explore the connection between martial discipline and artistic creation, the tension between violence and beauty, and why modern culture often misunderstands both warriors and artists. This is a different kind of conversation: two artists trying to articulate the vague and often painful process of creating something true. Before David faces Goliath, we consider the hidden formation of the man who wrote songs before he won battles, and whose worship may have been his most formidable weapon. Justin’s website:https://www.justinhughesart.com/ [https://www.justinhughesart.com/] Justin’s Instagram account: https://www.instagram.com/justin_hughes_art/ [https://www.instagram.com/justin_hughes_art/] Link to the Canon Press documentary about Justin:https://canonplus.com/tabs/discover/videos/68905 [https://canonplus.com/tabs/discover/videos/68905]

20. The Boundary of Blood

In Episode 20, we arrive at the beginning of one of the most famous stories in all of world history: David and Goliath. The Philistines have gathered for war at Ephes-dammim, “the Boundary of Blood,” a contested place between Israel and her most dangerous enemy. Saul’s army stands across the valley, frightened but present, knowing that failure could mean devastation for their homes, wives, and children. It is a desperate national crisis. Along the way, Cliff reflects on how certain people or places become symbols of national pride and resistance, such as Nolan Ryan and the Alamo (Texans will love this episode). The stage is set: two armies, one trembling king, a valley between them, and a monster emerging from the Philistine ranks. The Boundary of Blood has been drawn.

19. Music In The King’s House

We enter one of the darkest scenes in David’s early story: the moment when the Spirit of Yahweh has rushed upon David, the Spirit has departed from Saul, and a harmful spirit begins tormenting the rejected king. Before David ever faces Goliath, he is brought into Saul’s house as a musician. Cliff explores the difficult timeline questions surrounding 1 Samuel 16 and 17, the ancient textual issues behind David’s introduction to Saul, and the serious spiritual reality of Saul’s torment.  At the center of the episode is a striking providence: Saul receives relief from the young man Yahweh has chosen to replace him. David arrives from Bethlehem with a lyre in his hands, carrying gifts formed in obscurity, and the future psalmist of Israel plays worshipful music in the troubled house of the king.

18. An Old Man By The Fire

After David’s anointing in Bethlehem, the story seems ready to rush toward Goliath, but the biblical narrative takes a more complicated path. In this bridge episode, Cliff prepares listeners for the way David’s story unfolds through Samuel, Kings, and Chronicles: not as a modern biography arranged in strict chronological order, but as prophetic history told with theological purpose. The next passage, 1 Samuel 16:14–23, introduces David entering Saul’s service as a musician, yet the following chapter seems to reintroduce David at the Valley of Elah as though Saul hardly knows him. This apparent tension becomes the first major example of a recurring challenge in studying David’s story. Cliff explains his commitment to the inspired Word of God while also honestly acknowledging that faithful Bible study requires wrestling with difficult passages, narrative gaps, and ancient storytelling patterns. Using the image of an old man by the fire telling true stories from the old days, this episode invites listeners to receive the biblical text as Yahweh gave it: selective, purposeful, inspired, and true.