Measuring the Invisible: The Economics of Patriarchy

Measuring the Invisible: The Economics of Patriarchy

The episode features a conversation between Dr. Marcella Corsi and Dr. Mikolaj Szoltysek on how to measure patriarchy, rather, how to measure something long considered to be impossible to measure. The scholars discuss how they have wrestled with historical and regional available data to make these hidden structures visible, measurable, and comparable across time and place. They approach the discussion from different disciplines and methodologies, as Dr. Szoltysek is a historian and Dr. Corsi is a feminist economists. Their discussion focuses on how they approach measuring patriarchy differently, how their measures and work help and expand on the other���s, and why it is so important to tackle these questions alongside other disciplines. IAFFE brings together a global community of scholars, activists, and practitioners, and this podcast reflects that diversity of thought. The views shared by our guests and hosts are their own, and do not necessarily represent the views of IAFFE. Organization Links: IAFFE website: https://www.iaffe.org/ [https://www.iaffe.org/] Minerva Laboratory on Diversity and Gender Inequality: https://labminerva.web.uniroma1.it/en [https://labminerva.web.uniroma1.it/en] Dr. Marcella Corsi���s Papers: The Gendered Nature of Poverty in the EU: Individualized versus Collective Poverty Measures (Corsi, Botti, & D���Ippoliti): https://doi.org/10.1080/13545701.2016.1146408 [https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdoi.org%2F10.1080%2F13545701.2016.1146408&data=05%7C02%7C%7Cf6ad6a38c2a342e64bb508decb9a50b3%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C639172061564773796%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGkiOnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyfQ%3D%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=IvRrkKgiwxjMLW5deCHCJKstWdNfrQiuHsGGAjzMlo4%3D&reserved=0] Measuring Patriarchy in Italy (Alo��, Corsi, & Zacchia): https://doi.org/10.1080/09538259.2024.2360503 [https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdoi.org%2F10.1080%2F09538259.2024.2360503&data=05%7C02%7C%7Cf6ad6a38c2a342e64bb508decb9a50b3%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C639172061564796488%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGkiOnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyfQ%3D%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=5bxg%2BYlXLQ%2FnYq%2FhKQf1I%2FLnq0EUEtxp4as%2FleyCbOI%3D&reserved=0] Dr. Corsi���s Recommendations: Padre padrone (by Fratelli Taviani) trailer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P8z-iv2URAc [https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DP8z-iv2URAc&data=05%7C02%7C%7Cf6ad6a38c2a342e64bb508decb9a50b3%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C639172061564721770%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGkiOnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyfQ%3D%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=6LkYo79Z%2Fiv1ixcwCGf6sQiNNG0pNa%2FAqhQkIsxtftw%3D&reserved=0] C'�� ancora domani (by Paola Cortellesi) trailer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpMdbJlSFGc [https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DmpMdbJlSFGc&data=05%7C02%7C%7Cf6ad6a38c2a342e64bb508decb9a50b3%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C639172061564752331%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGkiOnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyfQ%3D%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=VUU6vRHDa78LOHmZgj%2FvmKTZSNb1Hr8SPiaDkBhEvs4%3D&reserved=0] Dr. Mikolaj Szoltysek���s Papers: The patriarchy index: a comparative study of power relations across historical Europe (Gruber & Szoltysek): https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/1081602X.2014.1001769 [https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/1081602X.2014.1001769] The Patriarchy Index for Asia: A new tool for subnational analysis of gender inequalities (Szoltysek et al.): https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0339587 [https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0339587] Historical Europe in the Asian ���mirror���: challenges and prospects of comparing the Patriarchy Index across space and time (Szoltysek et al): https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11698-025-00317-7 [https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11698-025-00317-7] European Family Patriarchy in Past and Contemporary Developmental Inequalities (Szoltysek & Poniat): https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/10693971241246584 [https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/10693971241246584]

Beyond GDP: Naila Kabeer in Conversation with M��de Griffin

In our second episode, we are excited to bring together two IAFFE members, Naila Kabeer and M��de Griffin, for an engaging conversation on Naila���s influential career, gender justice frameworks, and the well-being economy. Dr. Naila Kabeer, Professor Emeritus at LSE, has been a pioneer in integrating gender justice frameworks in development policy and international debates. In the episode, she gives insight into her intellectual curiosities and questions that led to her remarkable career focusing on gender, poverty, labor markets, and social protection. Interviewing Dr. Kabeer is M��de Griffin, a PhD student in Economics at Trinity College Dublin. Having met in an IAFFE mentorship group, the two engage in conversation on connecting research with the ���real��� world, why Naila got her PhD in Population Studies after studying economics for her undergraduate and master���s degrees, and Naila���s opinion on the term ���scholarly activism���. They discuss the importance of mentoring, the limitations of studying economics, and how evidence can help feminist economics stand firm in the face of gender backlash and misinformation. A through line in the episode is imagining an economy where individuals have the right to dignified lives and where care work is recognized. The hopeful outlook on what is possible radiates from both of them, and we hope, inspires listeners. Disclaimer: IAFFE brings together a global community of scholars, activists, and practitioners, and this podcast reflects that diversity of thought. The views shared by our guests and hosts are their own, and do not necessarily represent the views of IAFFE. Quick Resources: IAFFE website: https://www.iaffe.org/ [https://www.iaffe.org/] Naila Kabeer���s website: https://nailakabeer.net/ [https://nailakabeer.net/] Renegotiating Patriarchy: Gender, Agency, and The Bangladesh Paradox (free book access): https://press.lse.ac.uk/books/m/10.31389/lsepress.rpg [https://press.lse.ac.uk/books/m/10.31389/lsepress.rpg] YouTube - IAFFE presents Fireside Chat with Naila Kabeer: Reflections on Renegotiating Patriarchy, Gender Agency, and the Bangladesh Paradox: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jcJxgukh4_s&list=PL0Ybpe_B_cEHCs9LK6g81bNBQsrOcO-KP&index=12 [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jcJxgukh4_s&list=PL0Ybpe_B_cEHCs9LK6g81bNBQsrOcO-KP&index=12] Learn more about M��de���s research here: https://www.tcd.ie/economics/research/research-snapshots/mide-griffin/ [https://www.tcd.ie/economics/research/research-snapshots/mide-griffin/ ] Irish Society for Women in Economics: https://iswe.ie/ [https://iswe.ie/]

The Unhappy Marriage of Marxism and Feminism

In our first episode, we begin with one of the thinkers who helped shape the field itself: Heidi Hartmann. Best known for her groundbreaking article The Unhappy Marriage of Marxism and Feminism, Hartmann���s work has consistently returned to questions mainstream economics has often treated as secondary, or ignored altogether: questions about care, power, and how economies actually sustain people���s lives. In this conversation, Hartmann reflects on how those questions first emerged in her own work, from studying women���s labour in economic history to challenging the sidelining of gender in both Marxist and mainstream economic thought. She revisits the origins of The Unhappy Marriage, not as abstract theory but as a response to exclusion, to intellectual spaces in which gender was treated as secondary to class. But this episode is not only about theory. Hartmann also traces how those ideas moved beyond academia, into policy, advocacy, and institution-building through the Institute for Women���s Policy Research. She speaks candidly about what it takes to make research matter: working with advocacy groups, translating findings into usable evidence, and understanding that impact often depends on timing, clarity, and how ideas travel. Across the conversation, one thread remains constant: feminist economics is not just about adding women into existing models, but about changing the questions those models are built around in the first place. Disclaimer: IAFFE brings together a global community of scholars, activists, and practitioners, and this podcast reflects that diversity of thought. The views shared by our guests and hosts are their own, and do not necessarily represent the views of IAFFE. Quick Resources: IAFFE website: https://www.iaffe.org/ [https://www.iaffe.org/] IWPR: https://iwpr.org/ [https://iwpr.org/] Heidi Hartmann���s Profile: https://www.american.edu/cas/faculty/hartm.cfm [https://www.american.edu/cas/faculty/hartm.cfm ] Accessible Version of the Unhappy Marriage of Marxism and Feminism: https://web.ics.purdue.edu/~hoganr/SOC%20602/Hartmann_1979 [https://web.ics.purdue.edu/~hoganr/SOC%20602/Hartmann_1979] Dr. Hartmann on ���25 Years after FMLA: Research Finds that Paid Leave is a Great Investment���: https://iwpr.org/25-years-after-fmla-research-finds-that-paid-leave-is-a-great-investment/ [https://iwpr.org/25-years-after-fmla-research-finds-that-paid-leave-is-a-great-investment/] Marilyn Power���s Social Provisioning as a Starting Point for Feminist Economics: https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/1354570042000267608 [https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/1354570042000267608] You can read more about one of our interviewers, Dr. Ozge Ozay, here: https://www.fitchburgstate.edu/about/directory/ozge-ozay [https://www.fitchburgstate.edu/about/directory/ozge-ozay] Music: Bossy Boots by Shane Ivers - https://www.silvermansound.com [https://www.silvermansound.com/] Additional Resources mentioned in today���s episode: ���Do you Qualify for Social Security Benefits through your Spouse or Ex?��� (with Ann Hern��ndez Kent). [https://www.stlouisfed.org/open-vault/2024/april/social-security-benefits-through-your-spouse-or-ex]Open Vault Blog [https://www.stlouisfed.org/open-vault/2024/april/social-security-benefits-through-your-spouse-or-ex], Federal Reserve Bank of St. Louis. April 24, 2024 [https://www.stlouisfed.org/open-vault/2024/april/social-security-benefits-through-your-spouse-or-ex] Still a Man���s Labor Market: The Slowly Narrowing Gender Pay Gap (with Stephen J. Rose) Washington, DC: Institute for Women���s Policy Research, 2018. [https://iwpr.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/C474_IWPR-Still-a-Mans-Labor-Market-update-2018-2.pdf] Toward Our Children���s Keeper: A Data-Driven Analysis of the Interim Report of the My Brother���s Keeper Initiative Shows the Shared Fate of Boys and Girls of Color [https://iwpr.org/toward-our-childrens-keeper-a-data-driven-analysis-of-the-interim-report-of-the-my-brothers-keeper-initiative-shows-the-shared-fate-of-boys-and-girls-of-color/](with Chandra Childers and Elyse Shaw). Produced with Kimberl�� Crenshaw, African American Policy Forum. Washington, DC: Institute for Women���s Policy Research, 2015. [https://iwpr.org/toward-our-childrens-keeper-a-data-driven-analysis-of-the-interim-report-of-the-my-brothers-keeper-initiative-shows-the-shared-fate-of-boys-and-girls-of-color/] ���Feminist Political Economy��� (with Jennifer Cohen). Pp. 96-109 in the [https://www.elgaronline.com/edcollchap/book/9781789909067/book-part-9781789909067-13.xml]Handbook of Alternative Theories of Political Economy [https://www.elgaronline.com/edcollchap/book/9781789909067/book-part-9781789909067-13.xml] ed. by Frank Stillwell, David Primrose, and Tim Thorton. Edward Elgar Publishing. 2022. [https://www.elgaronline.com/edcollchap/book/9781789909067/book-part-9781789909067-13.xml] ���Estimating Benefits: Proposed National Paid Family and Medical Leave Programs��� (with Jeffrey A. Hayes). Contemporary Economic Policy 39:3, pp. 537-556. 2021. Unnecessary Losses: Costs to Americans of the Lack of Family and Medical Leave [https://iwpr.org/unnecessary-lossescosts-to-americans-for-the-lack-of-family-and-medical-leave/] (with Roberta Spalter-Roth). Washington, DC: Institute for Women���s Policy Research, May 1989. [https://iwpr.org/unnecessary-lossescosts-to-americans-for-the-lack-of-family-and-medical-leave/] Women, Work and Wages: Equal Pay for Jobs of Equal Value (Editor with Donald J. Treiman). Final Report of the Committee on Occupational Classification and Analysis, National Academy of Sciences/National Research Council. Washington, DC: National Academy Press, 1981. ���Contemporary Marxist Theory and Practice: A Feminist Critique��� (with Ann R. Markusen). [https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/048661348001200210] Review [https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/048661348001200210] https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/048661348001200210of Radical Political Economics [https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/048661348001200210] 12:2, pp. 87-94. 1980. [https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/048661348001200210] ���Capitalism, Patriarchy, and Job Segregation by Sex.��� Signs 1:2 Supplement (Spring 1976). Appears in Women and the Workplace: The Implications of Occupational Segregation, eds. Martha Blaxall and Barbara Reagan. (University of Chicago Press, 1976)