[BONUS EPISODE] Christian Nationalism vs. The Kingdom of God: Part 2

[BONUS EPISODE] Christian Nationalism vs. The Kingdom of God: Part 2

This is a special, unplanned bonus episode. The hosts realized there was simply too much to talk about on the subject of Christian Nationalism to fit into a single regular episode, forcing them to drop this extra conversation after waiting for John's "raging bile duct" to calm down from the overwhelming influx of daily political news. In This Episode: * The Albanian Exit Strategy: Eric opens the episode by catching John off guard as he clicks record while putting away paperwork for his final stages of securing dual Albanian citizenship. Having lived there for most of 2024, John explains his long-game strategy: tracing his grandfather's 1904 Ottoman-era birth records from Shkodër and his 10-year stint as a political prisoner under the communist regime. John explains that holding a second passport serves as a personal "exit strategy" that ironically helps him stay in America longer without getting antsy. * Authoritarian Creep & Highway Nazis: Leaning directly into why this country feels less welcoming, John and Eric track the visible gutting of the Voting Rights Act and the immediate, aggressive redistricting pushing back Southern elections. Meanwhile, John describes how Christian Nationalism and extremism are actively creeping up into northern New England. * The Activist Priest Temptation: John and Eric revisit the geographic disparity of modern politics, comparing conservative Texas to the ultra-progressive Bay Area. John confesses that while it would be incredibly easy to use his structural authority to put his thumb on the scale as an "activist priest," he chooses to keep politics entirely out of his weekly sermons. He believes his primary pastoral duty is to give people one hour a week to simply tend to their souls. * The Humility of "The Way": Unpacking the upcoming Sunday gospel text from John 14 ("I am the way, the truth, and the life"), John challenges the weaponization of the verse. He argues that the "way" of Christ is exclusively a path of deep humility and radical, reckless love for the outsider—not a tool for institutional exclusion, White House tongue-speaking spectacles, or creating government offices to handle imagined Christian persecution. * Defining the Wild Illusion: The guys explicitly define Nationalism as the wild theological claim that one specific nation is uniquely favored or chosen by God. Eric highlights how this entirely contradicts the New Testament—citing Galatians 3:28's declaration of no Jew or Gentile—and points out the ultimate flaw of American Christianity: believing that God possesses a political party or somehow strictly "needs" America. * Reading Other People's Mail: John completely dismantles the framework of Christian Zionism, calling out the evangelical obsession with taking Old Testament promises meant for historical Israel and copying-and-pasting them onto modern America. He drops a blunt reality check: there are zero white people and zero mentions of America in the entire Bible, meaning modern nationalistic Christians are essentially "reading other people's mail" and pretending it belongs to them. If today’s raw conversation sparked something in your own journey, we would love for you to join our growing community. Hit follow on Apple Podcasts and Spotify so you never miss a weekly drop, and follow us on TikTok and Instagram to keep the conversation going!

Christian Nationalism vs. The Kingdom of God

In this heavy hitting and deeply transparent episode, Eric and Johnny step right into the crosshairs of modern religious politics to unpack the anxiety, history, and internal contradictions defining Christian Nationalism in America. In This Episode: * The Best Day of the Year: Eric kicks off the show with a beautiful celebration of the "best day of the year"—his wife Rebecca's birthday. This leads the guys to reflect on the "No Kings" democratic overreach protests that recently took place. Eric shares a moving account of attending a local gathering in Conroe with Rebecca, describing how overwhelmingly moved they were to see elderly citizens standing arm-in-arm with young people across all walks of life. John ties the day to the feast of theologian Dietrich Bonhoeffer, dropping a powerful truth about waiting for people to organically turn toward grace rather than forcing conversions. * Fluffing the Tangled Skein: Transitioning to the core of the episode, Eric confesses to navigating intense personal anxiety surrounding the current political landscape and the state of the union. John compares tackling Christian Nationalism to trying to untangle a knotted ball of yarn—a process of slowly "fluffing the tangled skein" to look at its separate parts. They dissect "American Zionism," the flawed theological idea that America is the literal fulfillment of Old Testament promises. * Capitalism and Idolatry: As a biracial man, Eric openly challenges the exclusionary, protective demographic nature of Christian Nationalistic language. The hosts question how a movement can claim Christ while practicing unbridled capitalism. While both hosts identify as business-minded capitalists, John shares a profound rabbinic story about a rabbi whose focus on studying the law made him deaf to his own crying child. John notes that money becomes an idol the exact moment it makes someone deaf to the cries of human suffering. * Fences, Flight, and the Canaanite Woman: Addressing immigration and political borders, John uses a brilliant analogy: humans spend all their time building backyard fences, but God is the bird flying high above them, completely paying no attention to the lines we draw. John walks through a difficult passage in Matthew 15 involving Jesus and a Canaanite woman, arguing that Jesus temporarily mirrored the disciples' own cultural prejudices back to them to brilliantly expose the foolishness of their exclusion. If today’s raw conversation sparked something in your own journey, we would love for you to join our growing community. Hit follow on Apple Podcasts and Spotify so you never miss a weekly drop, and follow us on TikTok and Instagram to keep the conversation going!

The "Exvangelical" Grief & The Cost of Leaving

In this very special episode, Eric and Johnny step aside from their usual two-man banter to welcome their first-ever guest, John Hosmer. Longtime friend of the show's inner circle, Hosmer shares his gripping personal journey from the extreme heights of hyper-evangelicalism to a complete hairpin curve into a life completely outside of faith. In This Episode: * An Introduction to a Media Empire: Eric kicks things off with a primer on what exactly Hillsong is for those who might only know the music. He describes it as a global charismatic Christian megachurch and multi-million dollar media empire founded in Australia that radically redefined modern worship culture. If you've ever "shouted to the Lord" on a Sunday morning, you know Hillsong. * From Prosperity Gospel to the Outback: Guest John Hosmer details his upbringing in a rigid prosperity gospel environment dominated by Kenneth Copeland and Creflo Dollar, complete with endless demands for money and vacations to believers' conventions. Seeking an escape and a healthier expression of faith, he packed up his life at 25 and spent four and a half years down under at Hillsong College in Australia from 2010 to 2014. * Theology, Evolution, and Mind-Blowing Choices: Initially arriving as a bass player to study music, Hosmer recounts how his worldview shattered when he met Christians who actually believed in evolution. Driven to know more, he switched to the pastoral stream to study theology, introducing him to massive biblical scholars like N.T. Wright, Miroslav Volf, and Jürgen Moltmann. He details the liberating experience of learning to read the Bible in its historical context rather than taking it at absolute face value. * The Silent Tipping Point: While acknowledging that Hillsong's subsequent scandals are entirely well-deserved, Hosmer credits the college with initially opening his mind. However, after transitioning into a traditional ministry career, a devastating series of life events in 2019—including a painful divorce and a sudden, corporate-style firing from his dream church job—left him met with absolute divine silence. He opens up about the terrifying realization that, after giving the faith everything he had, he simply no longer believed any of it. * The Spectrum of Graduation: Eric, John, and Hosmer map out the vast spectrum of deconstruction. While Eric and John have constructed a new, evolved semblance of faith, Hosmer explains his choice to say "fuck it" and walk away entirely. He passionately shares his decision to protect his new 10-month-old son from the fundamentalist indoctrination and trauma that all three of the men experienced during their upbringings. * Life is the Tits: Despite the heavy grief of walking away from his entire identity, Hosmer delivers an inspiring message of hope. Now happily remarried, a new father, and a passionate gardener working stable hours in tech, he proudly declares that his life is "the tits". The guys close out by reflecting on poetry, the freedom to let your body love what it loves, and the beautiful reality that you can always hit the reset button when a path stops working for you. If today’s raw conversation sparked something in your own journey, we would love for you to join our growing community. Hit follow on Apple Podcasts and Spotify so you never miss a weekly drop, and follow us on TikTok and Instagram to keep the conversation going!

Spiritual Abuse & "High-Control" Culture

In this episode, Johnny and Eric wade through the bizarre landscape of modern political imagery before diving into a heavy, necessary conversation on clerical authority, spiritual gaslighting, and why the modern church has become so inherently terrified of questions. In This Episode: * Temu Twitter & The Wrinkle Factory: The guys open with a wild current-events breakdown of a bizarre, AI-generated image posted by the president. This sparks a larger, bipartisan critique of a political landscape run by an absolute "wrinkle factory" of aging leaders who are entirely too old for office. * The Politics of the Pulpit: Eric asks John a direct question: how does he avoid turning his sermons into a political commentary loop? John reveals his strict policy of keeping politics entirely out of the pulpit. He explains that because people are completely inundated by constant political noise all week long, he views it as a pastoral duty to give his parish one hour a week to tend to their souls and find rest around a shared table. * Punching In & Leading From the Rear: John shares a peek behind the curtain of clerical titles, explaining that when his parishioners call him "Father," he doesn't view it as a marker of authority, but rather a "responsibility cloak" signaling that he is officially "punched in" to do a job. He reframes the pastoral calling using the Middle Eastern style of shepherding, where shepherds don't lead from the front, but rather guide from the rear to catch the stragglers pushing forward. * Megaphones & The Bully Pulpit: They address the hidden brokenness and power moves that frequently taint church leadership. John shares a story from his seminary days about a peer who sought ordination merely because the collar gave him a cultural cachet and a "bully pulpit" megaphone he never had before. They confront how leaders often use boisterous bloviating as a shield against accountability so people won't examine their clay feet. * Confusing an Idea of God with Reality: Why is the institutional church so afraid of scrutiny? John uncovers a profound truth: people frequently confuse their personal idea of God with the actual reality of God. Consequently, when a genuine question is asked, leaders feel like God's very existence is being threatened. John contrasts this with a beautiful memory of his own father, who progressively told him that if he ever found a path that was "more truth" for his soul, he had to pursue it. * Every David Needs a Samuel: To wrap up, John recounts the biblical story of King David, Bathsheba, and the prophet Samuel's clever confrontation. Invoking Thomas Beckett's famous warning that it is highly dangerous for men in power to have no one to tell them they are wrong, John and Eric reflect on the vital importance of having true friends who aren't afraid to look you in the eye and tell you when you are messing up. If today’s raw conversation sparked something in your own journey, we would love for you to join our growing community. Hit follow on Apple Podcasts and Spotify so you never miss a weekly drop, and follow us on TikTok and Instagram to keep the conversation going!

Purity Culture & The 90s Hangover

In this episode, Eric and Johnny clear out the clutter with some nostalgic appreciation for the show's theme music before jumping headfirst into the heavy, deeply institutional, and often traumatic history of evangelical purity culture. In This Episode: * Nostalgia and Whoopie Pies: The guys open the show with a heartfelt shoutout to David Hiester, a brilliant musician and old camp co-counselor who graciously composed the theme music for Oh, You Too. This trip down memory lane sparks a hilarious conversation about their old camp director, David's father, and David's mom's legendary, unmatched Pennsylvania whoopie pies. * The Rise of the "Trad Wife": Transitioning into current events, Eric highlights a recent niche subculture finding that nearly 47% of Gen Z women view traditional marriage and staying at home as ideal, actively stepping away from "girl boss" expectations. John and Eric debate the psychology behind this shift, exploring whether it stems from third-wave feminist autonomy or a trauma-informed desire for absolute certainty—letting someone else make the hard decisions so you never have to face the consequences. * The Only Thing Jesus Never Said: The hosts unpack how Christian nationalism pushes the stay-at-home housewife archetype as a core spiritual discipline. Eric notes the wild irony of elder millennials claiming "I'm not a feminist" despite driving cars, renting houses, and holding credit cards. John hits them with a theological reality check: despite what fundamentalism preaches, Jesus never once explicitly told women that popping out babies and staying at home was their only design. * The History of the Obsession with Purity: Eric asks John a foundational question: why did the 90s and early 2000s evangelical church choose fear and shame for sexual education instead of grace and wisdom? John traces this structural fixation back to the 1950s, revealing a sobering historical timeline: the exact year Eisenhower integrated public schools was the very same year massive religious private schools cropped up across the nation so white families could remain privately segregated. John argues that the obsession with "racial purity" effortlessly slid right into the obsession with "sexual purity" as a tool for institutional control. * Object Lessons & Purity Balls: The guys confront the deep spiritual trauma inflicted on teenagers by toxic youth group object lessons—from peeling tape off shirts to passing around pre-chewed gum to symbolize "lost worth". They call out the deeply unsettling, overtly sexualized world of "Purity Balls," where young girls are forced to symbolically date their sword-wielding fathers and commit their physical bodies to them until marriage. * Peter, Good Will Hunting, and Grace: To wrap up, John shares a beautiful pastoral perspective on forgiveness by linking the biblical restoration of Peter to the iconic "it’s not your fault" scene from Good Will Hunting. They reflect on how true love dismantles institutional coercion and finally allows people to heal from the shame of their past. If today’s raw conversation sparked something in your own journey, we would love for you to join our growing community. Hit follow on Apple Podcasts and Spotify so you never miss a weekly drop, and follow us on TikTok and Instagram to keep the conversation going!