“Us vs Them” Has Taken Over American Politics

David French: How America Will Recover

Why are modern political movements suddenly reviving ideas that the world discredited decades ago? In this episode, we sit down with New York Times columnist and constitutional lawyer David French to discuss the deep psychological and cultural shifts breaking our societal guardrails. David shares his unique journey from growing up in the conservative South to serving as an JAG officer in the Army Reserve in Iraq, providing a grounded framework for why our current public discourse feels so dangerous. We focus on David's striking concept to answer the question: why we are in the great forgetting. We look at how the passing of the generations who personally survived world wars, fascism, and communism has left a vacuum in our collective memory. We talk about the terrifying ways history is currently being weaponized as a tool for ideological victory rather than studied as a pursuit of wisdom and truth. We also pull back the curtain on the dangerous rise of transactional politics on both the left and the right. Using the controversial candidacies of Graham Platner and Ken Paxton, we examine how the angriest wings of the major parties capture the primary system, leaving the "exhausted majority" to passively follow. David issues a profound warning to voters on how supporting a corrupt or cruel politician ultimately corrupts the character of the voter more than it changes the leader. Finally, we look at the vital difference between ideological moderation and temperamental moderation. We talk about why the ability to hold robust convictions while maintaining cross-political friendships is the single most important skill Americans must relearn. CHAPTER MARKERS: 00:00 Intro. 00:26 Introduction of columnist David French. 01:08 From Southern fundamentalism to constitutional law. 04:39 Serving as an Army Reserve JAG officer. 05:29 Choosing a journalism career over law. 08:52 Unpacking the Great Forgetting concept. 13:19 How educational gaps fuel historical amnesia. 14:42 Weaponizing history in the culture wars. 18:06 Losing our direct contact with history. 19:29 Ideological moderation versus temperamental moderation. 23:40 The reality of the exhausted majority. 27:44 Primary turnouts shaping general election options. 31:55 Facing decade-long pushback as Never-Trump. 33:42 How corrupt leaders change their voters. 35:37 The thermostatic nature of American politics. 37:31 Finding electoral hope in independent behavior. 45:39 Pastor Tim Keller on broken friendships. 49:33 Will MAGA survive without Donald Trump? 52:05 The cultural obsession with fake authenticity. RESOURCES MENTIONED: David’s Podcast: https://thedispatch.com/podcast/advisoryopinions/ [https://thedispatch.com/podcast/advisoryopinions/] More In Common: https://moreincommonus.com/ [https://moreincommonus.com/] Brad Porteus: https://www.bridgegrades.org/ [https://www.bridgegrades.org/] David’s Good For The Soul: The Return of the King by J.R.R. Tolkien https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/61215384-the-return-of-the-king [https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/61215384-the-return-of-the-king] Our Website: * https://www.wevegottotalk.com/ [https://www.wevegottotalk.com/] LINKS: On Instagram https://www.instagram.com/wevegottotalk/ [https://www.instagram.com/wevegottotalk/] On YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@WeveGotToTalk [https://www.youtube.com/@WeveGotToTalk] On Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/weve-got-to-talk/id1797423701 [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/weve-got-to-talk/id1797423701] On Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/0qJVgTvjciUffRmoUienx2 [https://open.spotify.com/show/0qJVgTvjciUffRmoUienx2] How to find Nicole https://nicolefonarow.com/ [https://nicolefonarow.com/] How to find Jolene https://dibledough.com/ [https://dibledough.com/]

Who actually votes for Donald Trump?

Why does it feel like modern politics has shifted from simple disagreements to an all-out war for team loyalty? In this episode, we sit down with Stephen Hawkins, the director of research for More in Common, an international organization tracking the deep psychology, values, and hidden tribes behind our fractured global landscape. Stephen breaks down his journey from an evangelical College Republican to a cosmopolitan progressive activist, revealing why the simplistic categories used by the media fail to explain our real inner lives. We examine More in Common’s massive new study to answer the question: who actually votes for Donald Trump? We unpack the shocking data showing that the modern Republican voter base is the youngest and most racially diverse it has been in half a century. Jolene and Nicole share their own unexpected results from taking the coalition quiz, and we look at the real economic and border anxieties driving the "Reluctant Right" versus the deeply personal identity anchoring "MAGA Hardliners." We also pull back the curtain on the completely broken incentive structures keeping Washington D.C. locked in conflict. From social media algorithms that monetize rage to a political system that forces members of Congress to spend up to 70% of their time fundraising, we look at how combativeness has become a highly profitable business model. CHAPTER MARKERS: 00:00 Intro. 00:26 Meet research director Stephen Hawkins. 01:08 Stephen’s journey across both political tribes. 03:01 The tragic origins of More in Common. 07:08 Moving beyond simplistic demographics in polling. 11:46 Understanding America's exhausted majority. 12:42 Breaking down the modern Trump coalition. 14:21 Host results from the coalition quiz. 18:43 The myth of shy Trump voters. 20:23 MAGA hardliners and personal identity. 22:00 The Democratic perception gap on economics. 25:19 How media models monetize political rage. 27:55 The exhausting reality of congressional fundraising. 30:15 How D.C. camaraderie completely died. 34:42 Solidarity during major American crises. 38:00 Political lessons from the Gilded Age. 44:38 Why public institutional trust eroded. 47:09 Gen Z as political kingmakers. 50:56 AI as a shared societal threat. 53:52 Good for the soul book recommendation. 55:22 Would You Rather: Banning anonymous accounts. 57:32 Would You Rather: Hometown versus cruise. RESOURCES MENTIONED: Stephen Hawkins Organization: https://moreincommonus.com/ [https://moreincommonus.com/] Stephen Hawkins Report: https://beyondmaga.us/ [https://beyondmaga.us/] Brad Porteus: https://www.bridgegrades.org/ [https://www.bridgegrades.org/] Stephen's Good for the Soul: https://rutgerbregman.com/books/moral-ambition [https://rutgerbregman.com/books/moral-ambition] Our Website: * https://www.wevegottotalk.com/ [https://www.wevegottotalk.com/] LINKS: On Instagram https://www.instagram.com/wevegottotalk/ [https://www.instagram.com/wevegottotalk/] On YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@WeveGotToTalk [https://www.youtube.com/@WeveGotToTalk] On Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/weve-got-to-talk/id1797423701 [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/weve-got-to-talk/id1797423701] On Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/0qJVgTvjciUffRmoUienx2 [https://open.spotify.com/show/0qJVgTvjciUffRmoUienx2] How to find Nicole https://nicolefonarow.com/ [https://nicolefonarow.com/] How to find Jolene https://dibledough.com/ [https://dibledough.com/]

Is Minimum Wage the Real Problem with Tipping Culture?

Tipping culture in the USA is out of control right now. In this episode, we dig into the history of tipping in America, why it became normal for customers to subsidize wages, and how the USA minimum wage rules for tipped workers still shape what you pay every time you eat out. We talk about the tipped minimum wage, the “tip credit”, and why the $2.13 an hour figure still comes up when people search “why do we tip in America” and “why is tipping expected”. We also get into the real question people argue about online: should the US get rid of tipping and switch to a no tipping model like parts of Europe and Japan? Would raising the minimum wage for servers fix tipping culture, or would it just make restaurant prices even higher? We break down what “fair pay” could look like without turning every meal into a luxury, and why so many people feel stuck between wanting to tip well and feeling pressured to tip everywhere. Then we shift into the other thing that is quietly making everyone uncomfortable: ratings culture. From Yelp and Google reviews to the constant “rate your experience” texts, we talk about why rating everything has become normal, and how online reviews can hurt small businesses when people are angry, unfair, or just trying to get free stuff. If you have ever searched “are Google reviews reliable” or “fake reviews problem”, you are going to feel very seen. Finally, we talk about Uber and Lyft ratings and why they are so problematic. When both the driver and the passenger are rating each other, it can make people afraid to be honest, even when a ride feels unsafe. Here is where we land. $2.13 an hour is bananas. Tipping has become a wage subsidy, and customers are being guilted into carrying it. And if we are going to keep rating everything, we should at least remember there are real humans on the other side of that screen. Take a breath. Contact the owner first. Give people a chance to fix it before you light them up in public. CHAPTER MARKERS: 00:00 Intro. 00:00:53 Tipping and rating culture. Why this topic hits a nerve. 00:01:35 History of tipping culture in the USA. Where “tip” comes from. 00:02:32 Why tipping spread in America. Post slavery and the railways. 00:04:53 Tipped minimum wage. Why $2.13 an hour still exists. 00:05:28 Conservative view on tipping. Rewarding good service. 00:06:36 Tip pooling. Who gets tipped and who gets left out. 00:08:27 Point of sale tipping prompts. Why tip pressure feels gross. 00:11:32 No tipping restaurants. Higher prices and better experience. 00:12:31 Restaurant tipping percentages. What is normal now. 00:14:22 Tipping guide. Counter service, salons, Uber, hotels, delivery. 00:17:03 Hotel tipping debate. When to tip housekeeping. 00:18:16 Delivery tipping. Who gets blamed when food is late. 00:22:16 Minimum wage plus tips. Republican vs Democrat framing. 00:30:07 Ratings culture. Yelp, Google reviews, and why it is everywhere. 00:32:10 Uber and Lyft ratings. Unsafe rides and fear of honesty. 00:35:30 Why ratings matter. Trust, authenticity, and buying reviews. RESOURCES MENTIONED: Our Website: * https://www.wevegottotalk.com/ [https://www.wevegottotalk.com/] LINKS: On Instagram https://www.instagram.com/wevegottotalk/ [https://www.instagram.com/wevegottotalk/] On YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@WeveGotToTalk [https://www.youtube.com/@WeveGotToTalk] On Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/weve-got-to-talk/id1797423701 [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/weve-got-to-talk/id1797423701] On Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/0qJVgTvjciUffRmoUienx2 [https://open.spotify.com/show/0qJVgTvjciUffRmoUienx2] How to find Nicole https://nicolefonarow.com/ [https://nicolefonarow.com/] How to find Jolene https://dibledough.com/ [https://dibledough.com/]

Trump’s Tax Letter & The 1776 Fund: Republican vs Democrat

In this episode, we tackle the shocking details behind Donald Trump’s latest legal maneuver. Nicole and Jolene break down why Trump suddenly dropped his massive $10 billion lawsuit against the IRS and immediately replaced it with the "$1.776 Billion Anti-Weaponization Fund." We take a look past the patriotic branding to reveal why this massive proposal has absolutely no legal safeguards. We break down the glaring conflict of interest at the center of the fund, including a quiet provision drafted by Trump's personal attorney and acting Attorney General, Todd Blanche, that effectively excuses Trump and his family businesses from federal tax investigations. We look at the actual numbers, including the family’s massive, active trading in stocks and cryptocurrency and ask a question that should bother voters on both sides of the aisle: where is the accountability? We also get into a broader, heavy reality that goes way beyond the headlines: political exhaustion. We look at how low primary voter turnouts allow extreme voices to take control, and how the media keeps us distracted with petty arguments while regular people face massive global and economic whiplash from skyrocketed grocery bills to merchant marine sailors stranded without power in a war zone. Finally, we talk about escaping the constant tribalism, breaking out of the "bubble of shame," and what it actually takes to start talking to each other like grown-ups again. Questions Covered in This Episode: * What is the $1.776 Billion Anti-Weaponization Fund? * Why did Donald Trump drop his IRS lawsuit? * What does Todd Blanche's tax letter mean for the Trump family businesses? * Why are GOP Senators pushing back on Trump's new settlement announcement? * How does low primary voter turnout impact local elections? CHAPTER MARKERS: 00:00 - Introduction 00:39 - The $1.776 Billion Anti-Weaponization Fund explained 03:14 - Settling a $10B lawsuit: Typical Trump negotiations? 04:27 - 3,700 stocks, crypto millions, and the family tax exemption 05:15 - Todd Blanche and the total lack of independent accountability 05:40 - Nicole's theory: Is this a private army fund? 07:03 - GOP Senators say no mas: Ted Cruz’s podcast leak 08:13 - The 8% voter turnout reality in local primaries 11:35 - Legal perspective and dropping cases he can't win 14:00 - Decompiling immigration bills: Senate Republicans are furious 17:00 - Global whiplash: Iran war, high gas prices, and stranded sailors 18:39 - Are people just completely fed up with Trump? 21:37 - Why Democrats and Gen Z are also losing trust in government 24:02 - Fighting fire with fire: Nicole’s frustration with the Democrats 25:07 - Popping the "bubble of shame" and looking at Texas politics 26:24 - The State Fair turkey leg: Dissecting dumb political distraction tactics 29:26 - Would You Rather Join the Conversation: Are you feeling the same political exhaustion and whiplash from modern news cycles? Let us know your thoughts in the comments below and remember to pause and connect with the human on the other side of the screen. RESOURCES MENTIONED: Ted Cruz Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/chaos-in-dc-on-reconciliation-doj-judgment-fund-plus/id1495601614?i=1000769050505 [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/chaos-in-dc-on-reconciliation-doj-judgment-fund-plus/id1495601614?i=1000769050505] https://www.nytimes.com/2026/05/29/us/politics/federal-judge-trump-fund.html?unlocked_article_code=1.mlA.Nhlk.t-wPONIlelQi&smid=url-share [https://www.nytimes.com/2026/05/29/us/politics/federal-judge-trump-fund.html?unlocked_article_code=1.mlA.Nhlk.t-wPONIlelQi&smid=url-share] https://www.wsj.com/politics/policy/trump-republican-congress-control-98a13bd9?mod=article_inline Our Website: https://www.wevegottotalk.com/ [https://www.wevegottotalk.com/] LINKS: On Instagram https://www.instagram.com/wevegottotalk/ [https://www.instagram.com/wevegottotalk/] On YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@WeveGotToTalk [https://www.youtube.com/@WeveGotToTalk] On Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/weve-got-to-talk/id1797423701 [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/weve-got-to-talk/id1797423701] On Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/0qJVgTvjciUffRmoUienx2 [https://open.spotify.com/show/0qJVgTvjciUffRmoUienx2] How to find Nicole https://nicolefonarow.com/ [https://nicolefonarow.com/] How to find Jolene https://dibledough.com/ [https://dibledough.com/]

“Bashing Trump” vs “Sanewashing Trump”: An Interview with Issac Saul of Tangle News

What happens when you try to tell the truth in a world that only wants team loyalty? In this episode, we talk with Isaac Saul, founder of Tangle, the independent, non-partisan politics newsletter that summarises the best arguments from the left and the right. Isaac wrote a “plea for help” email after conservatives accused Tangle of bashing Trump while liberals accused it of sanewashing Trump, often in response to the exact same newsletter. We take a look at why the current political division feels different now, and how the media ecosystem rewards outrage, certainty, and tribalism. Isaac breaks down why “picking a side” is often the most profitable model in modern media, and what it costs the rest of us, our relationships, our mental health, and our ability to talk to family and friends who disagree with us. We also get into something surprisingly powerful: language. Isaac explains how tiny word choices can trigger instant assumptions of political bias, and how Tangle created its own editorial standards to keep readers from rage-quitting before they even reach the arguments. Finally, we talk about whether we’ve hit “peak indecency,” and what might actually bring a decency comeback in politics and culture. CHAPTER MARKERS: 00:00 Introduction 00:21 Meet Isaac Saul (Tangle News Founder) 02:15 Why Political Polarisation Feels Worse Right Now 05:21 Media Incentives: Why Outrage and “Pick a Side” Content Wins 07:09 Toxic Comment Sections and Cancel Culture 12:24 Did COVID Accelerate Division? Doomscrolling, Isolation, and Social Media 19:16 Neutral Language in Journalism: Tangle’s Editorial Standards Explained 22:39 Why Polls Skew Left: Conservatives Less Likely to Answer Surveys 24:02 NPR / Public Radio Surge 26:54 Writing With Integrity: Staying Honest Without Feeding Tribalism 30:57 AI, Misinformation, and the Hope for a “Decency Comeback” in Politics 36:02 Would You Rather RESOURCES MENTIONED: This American Life Tangle Episode: https://www.thisamericanlife.org/845/a-small-thing?ref=readtangle.com [https://www.thisamericanlife.org/845/a-small-thing?ref=readtangle.com] Issac Saul with David French: https://youtu.be/fxAKXuvMXcw?si=FpOYfAVa2IdIMkaA [https://youtu.be/fxAKXuvMXcw?si=FpOYfAVa2IdIMkaA] Issac Saul TED Talk: https://youtu.be/543mYKKh1EE?si=-wUgGLuSZ1LK5ygI [https://youtu.be/543mYKKh1EE?si=-wUgGLuSZ1LK5ygI] GOOD FOR THE SOUL: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/45031831-one-long-river-of-song [https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/45031831-one-long-river-of-song] Our Website: * https://www.wevegottotalk.com/ [https://www.wevegottotalk.com/] LINKS: On Instagram https://www.instagram.com/wevegottotalk/ [https://www.instagram.com/wevegottotalk/] On YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@WeveGotToTalk [https://www.youtube.com/@WeveGotToTalk] On Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/weve-got-to-talk/id1797423701 [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/weve-got-to-talk/id1797423701] On Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/0qJVgTvjciUffRmoUienx2 [https://open.spotify.com/show/0qJVgTvjciUffRmoUienx2] How to find Nicole https://nicolefonarow.com/ [https://nicolefonarow.com/] How to find Jolene https://dibledough.com/ [https://dibledough.com/]