The Marketing B-Sides

Track #22: Dr. Mansur Khamitov – The Bubble of Optimism: Why Consumers Care Less About Your Brand Than You Think

We love to treat our own brands like they are the center of the universe. But according to Dr. Mansur Khamitov, Assistant Professor of Marketing at the Indiana University Kelley School of Business, that exact bias is a major blind spot for modern executives. Mansur joins Tom to deliver a blunt reality check on corporate optimism, drawing from his research on consumer psychology and his years managing household brands at Procter and Gamble and in big pharma. Mansur breaks down the staggering reality of the modern marketplace, where the average consumer is bombarded by up to 5,000 brand messages a day and could care less if 80 percent of those brands suddenly vanished overnight. We discuss how to break out of the C-suite echo chamber, the value of letting customers be wrong, and the mathematical reality of regression to the mean when navigating the natural highs and lows of agency life. We also take a close look at the next generation of marketers entering the workforce. Mansur explains why Gen Z is fiercely values driven, often prioritizing an organization's core mission over a higher paycheck, and why brands need to look past automated HR algorithms to find the real grit and perseverance that defines top tier talent.

Track #21: Brant Moriarity – Why "Button-Pushing" is Dead: Training the Next Generation of Decision Makers

Every business student who has marched through Indiana University since 1967 knows K201, the legendary Computers in Business course. But the era of simple software shortcuts is officially over. Brant Moriarity, Director of the course at the Kelley School of Business, joins Tom to break down the massive, structural evolution of higher ed technology and analytics education. Brant shares the reality of teaching a course to 2,300 freshmen every semester in a world completely altered by the shift to AI. We explore Kelley's new pedagogical framework called Build, Adapt, Defend. This system is designed to force entry-level students out of passive button-pushing and into live-fire problem solving. Brant also dismantles common misconceptions about Gen Z tech literacy, noting that while they are born with mobile devices in hand, basic enterprise file organization and system troubleshooting remain an active learning curve. From navigating administrative red tape across nine separate college campuses to a hilariously diverse musical history that spans Marilyn Manson and underground West Coast hip-hop, this episode offers a direct window into how the next generation of business leaders is being trained to handle data, disruption, and data-backed human judgment.

Track #20: Renia Carsillo – Why "No" is a Growth Strategy

In an industry obsessed with the "business of yes," Renia Carsillo has spent 20 years building a firm based on the power of the right fit. A former Assistant VP in banking with a degree in Iranian Politics, Renia brings a pragmatism to Realign Consulting that most agencies lack. She joins Tom to discuss her "Three Bright Lines" for vetting clients: believing in their mission, trusting their team, and ensuring they have at least a six-month financial runway to allow for foundational work. Beyond the mechanics of agency growth, Renia dives into a staggering statistic: while 48% of new businesses are started by women, only 6% ever gross more than $250,000. We discuss the systemic and "soft" hurdles, from credit access to the lack of domestic support structures, that keep those numbers low, and Renia’s new mission to profile the women who have broken through that barrier. We also tackle the AI hype cycle. Renia explains why she’s skeptical of anyone calling themselves an "AI Expert" and why she forbids her team from using "God Mode" commands. From her color-coded quarterly planning to the 2-day offsite strategy retreats she mandates for every client, this episode is a guide for leaders who want to stop reacting and start building.

Track #19: Dagan Thogerson – Why Being a "Good Hang" is Just As Important As Your Chops

Dagan Thogerson has played over 2,000 shows in his career, including 15 years behind the kit for the legendary indie-rock band Murder by Death. He joins Tom to peel back the curtain on the "Road Dog" lifestyle and the transition from a 16-year-old playing biker bars to a professional session musician. We dive into the "B-Side" of the music industry: the part that involves spreadsheets, ticket counts, and boundaries. Dagan explains why the most important skill for a touring professional isn't how fast you can shred, but whether you're a "good hang" who is reliable and accountable when things get messy - a truth that translates directly from the tour van to the office.

Track #18: Lindsay McGuire – Why "I've Worked Too Hard for This" Is the Wrong Reason to Stay

Lindsay McGuire was a SaaS powerhouse, a director-level "titan" in the Indianapolis tech scene. But deep down, she felt a calling back to her community. She joins Tom to discuss the psychological hurdle of walking away from the "golden handcuffs" of software and the pivotal advice from her mother that changed everything. Now the Assistant Director of Advancement, Branding and Outreach at The Milk Bank, Lindsay discusses the "revolutionary" shift from marketing software to saving infants' lives in the NICU. We dive into: * The Fear of the Jump: Overcoming the internal monologue that says leaving a high-level role is "stupid." * Public Health vs. MarTech: Moving from the "fight or flight" of software trends to the thoughtful, high-stakes pace of community health. * Junior League & Capacity: How to give back without burning out. * The Metaphysical B-Side: A hilarious and brilliant story about how selling Thor’s hammers and "potions" at a jewelry store became a jumping off point for her content marketing career.