The Persuasion Game

Rethinking how you measure demand, with Karl Miley, Co-Founder, Forge

"Most organisations don't need more data. What they need is a wider, more dynamic view of where demand is forming. And they need to be looking in the right places to find it." In this episode of The Persuasion Game podcast, we're joined by Karl Miley, co-founder of Forge and leader of its Dynamic Demand practice.  Karl has spent years helping some of the world's biggest brands understand where consumer demand is heading, and why so many of them are looking in the wrong direction. This episode is about why brand confidence in decision-making has never felt lower, how static demand frameworks are partly to blame, and why a new approach is needed. Karl takes us through four forces reshaping demand: cultural and behavioural shifts, the arrival of new entrants, technology-driven changes in discovery and behaviour, and macro shocks that rewrite consumer priorities overnight. If you work in identifying demand spaces, this episode isn’t to be missed. Follow us on LinkedIn [https://www.linkedin.com/newsletters/7264672830049472515/?displayConfirmation=true] for updates. Subscribe to The Persuasion Game Newsletter [https://www.linkedin.com/newsletters/the-persuasion-game-7264672830049472515/%20] on LinkedIn. Want to know more about us? Visit our website here [https://forgemsq.com/] This is an 18Sixty [https://18sixty.uk/] production for Forge. CHAPTERS: (00:00) Introduction (03:41) Signals Beyond Trackers (10:06) Stanley And Diet Coke (17:08) Spotting Early Signals (25:53) Olipop (39:50) Best Practice Dynamic System

Why brand transparency isn’t enough anymore, with David Cousino, Insight Expert

“Transparency builds credibility. Hyper-transparency builds trust.” As Gen Z continue their inevitable march towards being the dominant economic power, the way brands market themselves is going to have to shift dramatically. As David Cousino puts it, for them “ transparency directly influences where they're going to spend. If companies don't get their head around this cohort, they're going to be in for a really rough couple of decades.” In this episode, David explains what is meant by hyper-transparency, why honesty increasingly beats perfection, and the crucial role insights teams have to play as we move into this new era. David is Global Head of Business Intelligence and Insight at James Hardie, and has previously held senior roles at AB InBev and Unilever. This topic isn’t one that can be kicked into the long grass any longer, it’s forecast Gen Z will surpass millennials in terms of spending power in less than a decade. Follow us on LinkedIn [https://www.linkedin.com/newsletters/7264672830049472515/?displayConfirmation=true] for updates. Subscribe to The Persuasion Game Newsletter [https://www.linkedin.com/newsletters/the-persuasion-game-7264672830049472515/%20] on LinkedIn. Want to know more about us? Visit our website here [https://forgemsq.com/] This is an 18Sixty [https://18sixty.uk/] production for The Forge. CHAPTERS: (00:00) Introduction (03:23) Tech and Gen Z Shift (06:37) New Front Lines of Trust (13:38) Crisis Transparency Playbook (20:26) Insights Teams as Radar

How creators unlocked growth for Vaseline, with Nathalia Amadeu, Unilever

“Relevance builds brands. Control just increases the risk of irrelevance.” In this episode of The Persuasion Game, we’re joined by Nathalia Amadeu, Global Brand Director at Vaseline, to explore how the 150-year-old brand is reinventing itself in the social-first era. It centres on the hugely successful Vaseline Verified [https://www.unilever.com/news/news-search/2025/vaselines-socialfirst-marketing-beauty-hacks-consumer-insights-and-cultural-relevancy/] campaign (winner of nine awards at the Cannes International Festival of Creativity, including a Titanium Lion). A campaign which, as Nathalia puts it - “challenged decades of brand control thinking.” With millions of people already sharing their own ways of using the product, instead of leading the conversation, Vaseline chose to listen.  The result is a new model of brand building - one that validates, amplifies and co-creates with its community. That shift in approach is not just a campaign idea, it is also reshaping innovation, with new products, co-built with creators, in production.  This is an inspiring, must-listen for anyone looking to grow a brand in a completely new way.  Follow us on LinkedIn [https://www.linkedin.com/newsletters/7264672830049472515/?displayConfirmation=true] for updates. Subscribe to The Persuasion Game Newsletter [https://www.linkedin.com/build-relation/newsletter-follow?entityUrn=7264672830049472515] on LinkedIn. Want to know more about us? Visit our website here: forgemsq.com [https://forgemsq.com/] This is an 18Sixty [https://18sixty.uk/] production for Forge. CHAPTERS: (00:00) Introduction (04:46) Stewardship Over Ownership (08:12) From Campaign To Products (20:19) Faster Feedback Loops (26:27) Eyebrow Hack Becomes Product (37:21) Principles For Participation

What children can teach us about creativity and marketing, with Sarah Horowitz, Crayola

“The biggest thing that children show me is that there are no limits to what we can do.” In this episode of The Persuasion Game podcast, we’re taking inspiration from the creativity of children. Our guest is Sarah Horowitz, Marketing Director for the UK and Northern Europe at Crayola. Crayola is an incredibly well-established brand, and has been relevant in homes and schools for more than a century. We discuss how it’s maintaining and growing that position in a fast-changing world, how it puts creativity at the centre of everything it does, and the lessons all marketers can learn from the way children use its products. Episodes are released bi-weekly. Follow us on LinkedIn [https://www.linkedin.com/newsletters/7264672830049472515/?displayConfirmation=true] for updates. Subscribe to The Persuasion Game Newsletter [https://www.linkedin.com/build-relation/newsletter-follow?entityUrn=7264672830049472515] on LinkedIn. Want to know more about us? Visit our website here: https://forgemsq.com [https://forgemsq.com] This is an 18Sixty [https://18sixty.uk/] production for Forge and MSQ. CHAPTERS: (00:00) Introduction (03:21) The Role of Adults in Children's Creativity (10:42) Understanding Gen Z and Gen Alpha (16:51) Creativity Across All Ages (26:23) Embracing a Child's Perspective

The view from the C-Suite: inside PepsiCo’s insights revolution, with Stephan Gans

“You need an insights function that is really focused on being a catalyst for growth in an end-to-end way.” For many years, the insights industry has desired a ‘seat at the top table’, influencing decisions at the most senior levels of their organisations. There are few insights professionals as senior and influential to their businesses as our guest on this episode, Stephan Gans, Senior Vice President of Insights and Analytics at PepsiCo. Stephan shares the steps PepsiCo’s insights team has taken to move from order-taking to being a true catalyst for business growth, why our thirst for insights has never been greater, and the three critical roles he says insights teams must play in any future business.  We also talk about the skills that will be most valuable in the future as we enable our insights functions with AI. This is a must-listen for anyone working in insights. Episodes are released bi-weekly. Follow us on LinkedIn [https://www.linkedin.com/newsletters/7264672830049472515/?displayConfirmation=true] for updates. Subscribe to The Persuasion Game Newsletter [https://www.linkedin.com/build-relation/newsletter-follow?entityUrn=7264672830049472515] on LinkedIn. Want to know more about us? Visit our website here: thisistheforge.com [http://thisistheforge.com] This is an 18Sixty [https://18sixty.uk/] production for The Forge. CHAPTERS: (00:00) Introduction (04:13) A Unified Approach (07:55) Balancing Short-term and Long-term Goals (14:12) The Role of AI in Insights (19:42) Future Skills for Insights Professionals