First of Kind

Everett Katigbak: Indie Streak

What do Anthropic, Facebook, Pinterest and Stripe all have in common? Everett Katigbak has played a foundational creative role at some of the most iconic brands in technology. His film work documents the stories of seminal figures who have shaped culture, such as his documentary projects on Stewart Brand and Luis Valdez. In this in-depth conversation at his beautiful San Francisco home, Everett describes the “golden thread” that weaves through his non-linear career path, the importance of humanizing infrastructure, and why he believes your side hustle is actually your “true form.”  As of this recording, Everett has set out on his own to develop an independent creative practice. After years behind the camera, tech’s “brand guru” steps out in front of it. 00:00 Intro: “Your side hustle is your true form” 03:01 Making Facebook Feel Human 05:04 Getting Hired Because You Don’t Fit 08:10 Why San Francisco? Place Before Job 11:33 Analog Research Lab origins & mantras 13:35 Propaganda, Self-Talk, and Shaping Company Culture 16:32 Designing for Engagement vs. Meaning 17:18 Living in Contradictions: Anachronist Meets Futurist 19:27 How to Pick the Right Company (A Nose for What’s Next) 21:03 Expansion vs. Mastery: A Different Kind of Career Path 24:00 Going Independent 26:24 Inside Cursor as a “Cultural Sleuth” 28:49 Stories of Unseen Figures: Luis Valdez, Stewart Brand 32:00 Closing: Advice for Future Pioneers S2:E6 Everett Katigbak: Indie Streak Hosted by Soleio and produced by Room 3: room3nyc.com @room3nyc First of Kind is powered by our sponsors: Framer — framer.com Cursor — cursor.com Vercel — vercel.com Profound — tryprofound.com Website: firstofkind.com YouTube: youtube.com/@firstofkind 𝕏: x.com/firstofkind Threads: threads.com/firstofkind_ Instagram: instagram.com/firstofkind_ Hashtag: #FirstofKind

Joseph Cohen: Infinite Ride

What if you designed a new class of vehicle from the ground up? Joseph Cohen first cofounded Universe, the mobile-first website builder, before turning his attention to the physical world. He and his brother Eddie Cohen now run Infinite Machine, an automotive company reimagining how people move through cities — not with cars, but with something entirely new, starting with the electric motorcycle. We met at Infinite Machine's headquarters in New York City, where Joe walked us through the design philosophy behind “non-car” vehicles, why electrification unlocks radical new form factors, and what it means to bet on autonomous people over autonomous cars. 00:00 – Intro: Color Outside the Lines 01:50 – A New Symbol for Freedom 05:52 – The Stolen Vespa 09:49 – The P1 vs. The Vision Pro 12:52 – Hard Modernism 17:26 – Painters Who Paint Factories 19:42 – Ten Times the Trips 23:33 – The Vespa Has No Engine 27:51 – Ask New Questions 32:00 – The Company as Medium 34:11 – Outro: What Memories Will You Make S2:E5 Joseph Cohen: Infinite Ride Hosted by Soleio and produced by Room 3: room3nyc.com @room3nyc First of Kind is powered by our sponsors: Framer — framer.com Cursor — cursor.com Vercel — vercel.com Profound — tryprofound.com Website: firstofkind.com YouTube: youtube.com/@firstofkind 𝕏: x.com/firstofkind Threads: threads.com/firstofkind_ Instagram: instagram.com/firstofkind_ Hashtag: #FirstofKind

Koen & Jorn: Framer Reloaded

When do you know to pivot or surrender? Koen Bok and Jorn van Dijk co-founded Framer, the web design platform that helps designers ship beautiful sites fast. 55% of YC companies run on it. Designers love it. But Framer almost didn't make it. What began as a high-fidelity prototyping tool born inside Facebook's design culture became—after a near-death pivot five years in—the premier site builder for designers who ship.  Over drinks at the Lone Palm in San Francisco, Koen and Jorn recall what it took to step back from the brink of oblivion and chart a new course — for themselves and the field of digital design. 00:00 Intro: Lone Palm, Last Call 01:34 What is Framer Today? 02:39 Pick a Problem You Love 06:14 Three Interactions to Fifty 08:20 Rough Riding / Why VC is Good 11:38 Three Options Left 14:31 The Pivotal Lunch 20:46 Act III: Solving the Walkie-Talkie 29:08 Artistry meets Wall Street 32:20 Stay Weird, Keep Building Special thanks to Jane Seabrook and the Lone Palm team for permitting us to film the first ever video podcast at their storied bar. – Koen Bok & Jorn van Dijk: Framer Reloaded First of Kind, S2:E4 Hosted by Soleio and produced by Room 3: room3nyc.com First of Kind is powered by our sponsors: Framer — framer.com Cursor — cursor.com Vercel — vercel.com Profound — tryprofound.com Website: www.firstofkind.com 𝕏: x.com/firstofkind Threads: threads.com/firstofkind_ Instagram: instagram.com/firstofkind_ Hashtag: #FirstofKind

Katie Dill: Quality Control

What can flying teach us about software design? Katie Dill has built world-class teams at three iconic companies—Stripe, Lyft and Airbnb—proving that thoughtful design can shape quality at industrial scale. In this conversation with Soleio, Katie describes her winding path into technology and how fields as disparate as architecture and aviation shape her approach to leading design at Stripe. 00:00 – Intro: It's All About Mileage 02:18 – What Flying Teaches You About Design 07:01 – From History to Design School 10:30 – The IDEO Moment 18:01 – Saying Yes to the Scary Thing 19:46 – The Chair Pullback 21:16 – The Gray Room at Airbnb 25:47 – Breaking Down the Ivory Tower 30:05 – Put In the Mileage 33:35 – Beauty Builds Trust 36:53 – Steam Gauges and Simple Systems 38:53 – The Best Checkout in the World Katie Dill: Quality Control First of Kind, S2:E3 Hosted by Soleio and produced by Room 3: room3nyc.com First of Kind is powered by our sponsors: Framer — framer.com Cursor — cursor.com Vercel — vercel.com Profound — tryprofound.com Website: www.firstofkind.com 𝕏: x.com/firstofkind_ Threads: threads.com/firstofkind_ Instagram: instagram.com/firstofkind_ Hashtag: #FirstofKind

Ryo Lu: The Way

What is the future of design in a post-AI world? Ryo Lu pioneered new patterns for collaboration as founding designer at Notion. He now leads design at Cursor, shaping how software gets built through a fusion of design and engineering.  In this conversation with Soleio, he explains Cursor's approach to design and how the product will evolve to empower designers who build. 00:00 – Intro: The future of design 01:49 – What is design at Cursor? 02:50 – How the team actually works 04:46 – Generalists, Self-Starters, Ex-Founders 07:34 – Building Cursor inside Cursor 10:45 – The next level: Agents & Abstraction 13:48 – Pattern language 18:24 – A lingua franca for builders 20:34 – Baby Cursor 23:45 – The new shape of designer 26:10 – Does AI distribute or concentrate power? 29:43 – Why Cursor is the tool you should learn 30:54 – A new design philosophy 32:36 – Where the path leads S2:E2 Ryo Lu: The Way Hosted by Soleio and produced by Room 3 (www.room3nyc.com) First of Kind is powered by our sponsors: Framer: framer.com Cursor: cursor.com Vercel: vercel.com Profound: tryprofound.com Website: www.firstofkind.com Threads: threads.com/firstofkind_ Instagram: instagram.com/firstofkind_ X: x.com/firstofkind_ Hashtag: #FirstofKind