Why Your Company Story Needs More Conflict and Vulnerability with Rob Biesenbach

Why Your Company Story Needs More Conflict and Vulnerability with Rob Biesenbach

Rob Biesenbach, corporate communications veteran and Second City-trained actor, joins the show to share how trust and emotional resonance are the real engines of powerful storytelling, even in the boardroom. In this episode, we delve into why trust and reassurance consistently trump raw information, and how getting real about conflict and emotion makes your message land. Rob D. Willis and Rob Biesenbach dissect the pitfalls of overly polished corporate case studies, the hidden power of vulnerability, and the value of admitting what went wrong in business stories. Rob Biesenbach reveals his five-step method for crafting stories that stick, drawing on decades in corporate communications and the lessons learnt on stage as a Second City-trained actor. He unpacks how internal storytelling transformed a struggling truck manufacturer, the art of mapping audience wants, and the unexpected parallels between executive speeches and improv performance. You’ll discover how to ladder up audience insights, spot the clutter in your own narrative, and ask the one question that surfaces the “why” behind every story. By the end, you’ll know precisely how to rally teams, rebuild trust, and make your stories unforgettable. GUEST BIO & LINKS Rob Biesenbach is a corporate communications consultant, keynote speaker, author, and Second City-trained actor. With decades spent inside the PR world and nearly 200 stage and commercial performances to his credit, he helps leaders craft stories that win trust, rally teams, and make big messages genuinely land. Rob is the author of Unleash the Power of Storytelling and works with executives and organisations to cut through clutter, reveal relatable character, and turn even tough moments into memorable, strategic narratives. Connect with Rob Biesenbach: Website: https://robbiesenbach.com/https://robbiesenbach.com/ [https://robbiesenbach.com/] LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/robbiesenbach/https://www.linkedin.com/in/robbiesenbach/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/robbiesenbach/] * Unleash the Power of Storytelling — Rob Biesenbach * 11 Deadly Presentation Sins — Rob Biesenbach * Act Like You Mean Business — Rob Biesenbach * 10 Steps to Better Business Storytelling — Rob Biesenbach * robbiesenbach.com/insights [http://robbiesenbach.com/insights] — his blog and articles Free Storytelling Toolkit TELL YOUR STORY, CHANGE YOUR WORLD Ready to get started right away on becoming a more effective storyteller so you can enjoy more success in your career, your business and your life? Sign up now to get your free storytelling toolkit. It includes the book chapter, “How to Tell Your Own Story,” a set of worksheets to walk you through the process, and real-life examples that bring the structures to life. Download it here: https://robbiesenbach.com/storytelling-toolkit/https://robbiesenbach.com/storytelling-toolkit/ [https://robbiesenbach.com/storytelling-toolkit/] ABOUT THE SHOW Chief Story Officer is a podcast about how stories drive strategy, not just communication. Host Rob D. Willis talks with executives and thought leaders about the moments where the right message changed everything. Real stories. Real impact. Every two weeks. CONNECT WITH ROB Want frameworks for strategic storytelling? Download the free guide: "5 Ways to Make People Care About Your Strategy" → http://subscribepage.io/robdwillissubscribepage.io/robdwillis [http://subscribepage.io/robdwillis] Connect with Rob: Website: http://robdwillis.com/robdwillis.com [http://robdwillis.com/] LinkedIn: http://linkedin.com/in/robdwillislinkedin.com/in/robdwillis [http://linkedin.com/in/robdwillis] Instagram: @robdwillis TikTok: @robdwillis Subscribe to Chief Story Officer wherever you listen to podcasts.

From Brand Clarity to Team Buy-In: Park Howell on Narrative Leadership

Park Howell, EMMY Award-winning storyteller and host of the Business of Story podcast, joins the show to share why simplifying your message isn’t just good storytelling, it’s good leadership. In this episode, we explore the ABT (“And, But, Therefore”) framework and why the most compelling brand stories never start with you. Rob and Park delve into how the right narrative can shift team alignment, boost engagement, and transform even the most complex strategies into messages that stick. Park shares the origins of the ABT method, real-world results from rebranding a Canadian car dealership, and how enterprise leaders can turn a wandering vision statement into a rallying cry that inspires action. He reveals why it’s not about what you make, but what you make happen in your audience’s world. You'll walk away with practical ways to reframe your website, roll out storytelling rituals across your team, and test your own brand’s narrative, all before your next meeting. Plus, hear how AI-powered tools can give your story an instant edge that your competitors will envy. KEY TOPICS 1. The ABT framework: how "and, but, therefore" forms the DNA of compelling storytelling [01:52] 2. Turning complex leadership visions into clear, emotionally resonant messages with narrative structure [07:17] 3. Building a story-driven culture where teams create and share ABTs for alignment and buy-in [21:08] 4. The Pret Auto Partez case: using a focused ABT to drive brand growth and team engagement [24:15] 5. StoryCycle Genie: an AI tool for instantly grading and sharpening your brand story [32:06] GUEST BIO & LINKS Park Howell is an EMMY Award-winning storyteller, brand strategy consultant, podcast host, and creator of the Storey Cycle System. With 40 years’ experience building brands including giants like Dell, Hilton and the United States Air Force, he now helps leaders sharpen their narratives and rally teams behind a common vision. Park hosts the Business of Story podcast (top 10% globally) and recently launched StoryCycle Genie, an AI-powered tool for brand storytelling. Connect with Park Howell: Website: https://businessofstory.com/storycycle-genie/https://businessofstory.com/storycycle-genie/ [https://businessofstory.com/storycycle-genie/] LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/parkhowell/https://www.linkedin.com/in/parkhowell/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/parkhowell/] Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/businessofstory/https://www.instagram.com/businessofstory/ [https://www.instagram.com/businessofstory/] Podcast: https://businessofstory.com/podcast/https://businessofstory.com/podcast/ [https://businessofstory.com/podcast/] ABOUT THE SHOW Chief Story Officer is a podcast about how stories drive strategy, not just communication. Host Rob D. Willis talks with executives and thought leaders about the moments where the right message changed everything. Real stories. Real impact. Every two weeks. CONNECT WITH ROB Want frameworks for strategic storytelling? Download the free guide: "5 Ways to Make People Care About Your Strategy" → http://subscribepage.io/robdwillissubscribepage.io/robdwillis [http://subscribepage.io/robdwillis] Connect with Rob: Website: http://robdwillis.com/robdwillis.com [http://robdwillis.com/] LinkedIn: http://linkedin.com/in/robdwillislinkedin.com/in/robdwillis [http://linkedin.com/in/robdwillis] Instagram: @robdwillis TikTok: @robdwillis Subscribe to Chief Story Officer wherever you listen to podcasts.

How Great Leaders Inspire with Stories, Not Slides, Featuring Paul Smith

Paul Smith, bestselling author and business storytelling consultant, joins the show to share how surprise turns stories into unforgettable leadership tools and why the best business lessons don’t always fit on a slide. In this episode, we unpack why adrenaline-fuelled surprises make stories unforgettable, how dialogue trumps data in executive communications, and the simple shift from presenting slides to sharing moments that matter. We explore why even data-driven leaders can use storytelling to move teams, clarify strategy, and tackle scepticism head-on. Paul Smith reveals how a CEO's refusal to look at slides sparked his storytelling journey at Procter & Gamble, what over 300 CEO interviews taught him about memorable stories, and why structure matters less than authenticity. He shares the ten essential stories every leader should master, his effortless story collection method, and the science behind why surprise makes learning stick. Listeners will leave with tools to curate and organise their own stories, strategies to shift culture from “presenting” to “connecting”, and practical advice for nurturing a story-driven team. Plus, the one journaling habit that turns everyday events into your organisation’s most valuable assets. GUEST BIO & LINKS Paul Smith is a bestselling author, business storytelling consultant, and former head of consumer research for Procter & Gamble’s $6 billion global business. After 20 years in data-driven corporate roles, Paul shifted his focus to understanding what separates inspiring leaders from the rest and discovered storytelling as the missing skill. He has personally interviewed over 300 CEOs and executives across 25 countries, capturing more than 3,000 business stories and distilling them into three Amazon #1 bestsellers, including Lead with a Story and The 10 Stories Great Leaders Tell. Paul now helps leaders worldwide build trust, drive change, and clarify strategy through practical storytelling. Connect with Paul Smith: Website: https://leadwithastory.com/https://leadwithastory.com/ [https://leadwithastory.com/] LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/smithpa9/https://www.linkedin.com/in/smithpa9/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/smithpa9/] Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/leadwithastory/https://www.instagram.com/leadwithastory/ [https://www.instagram.com/leadwithastory/] YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/leadwithastoryhttps://www.youtube.com/user/leadwithastory [https://www.youtube.com/user/leadwithastory] ABOUT THE SHOW Chief Story Officer is a podcast about how stories drive strategy, not just communication. Host Rob D. Willis talks with executives and thought leaders about the moments where the right message changed everything. Real stories. Real impact. Every two weeks. CONNECT WITH ROB Want frameworks for strategic storytelling? Download the free guide: "5 Ways to Make People Care About Your Strategy" → http://subscribepage.io/robdwillissubscribepage.io/robdwillis [http://subscribepage.io/robdwillis] Connect with Rob: Website: http://robdwillis.com/robdwillis.com [http://robdwillis.com/] LinkedIn: http://linkedin.com/in/robdwillislinkedin.com/in/robdwillis [http://linkedin.com/in/robdwillis] Instagram: @robdwillis TikTok: @robdwillis Subscribe to Chief Story Officer wherever you listen to podcasts.

Why Every Leader Needs Story Discovery Not Just Storytelling with Esther Choy

Esther Choy, CEO and Chief Story Facilitator at Leadership Story Lab, joins the show to challenge the idea that the leader must always be the "sage on stage" and explains why real power lies in helping others uncover and share their own stories. In this episode, we dive into the art of story discovery and why the best leaders are both sage on the stage and guide on the side. Rob D. Willis and Esther Choy unpack how shifting from persuasion to genuine curiosity transforms the way leaders connect, influence, and unlock the hidden stories within their teams. Esther Choy reveals her process for surfacing untold stories, from asking crazy good questions to synthesising meaning without fixating on being “right.” She shares real-world examples, including a CEO who dissolved silos simply by introducing innocuous questions at meetings and a senior leader who learned the power of narrative over technical detail. You'll walk away with practical approaches for uncovering overlooked stories, rituals to foster team trust, and a mindset that champions wonder over certainty. Plus, learn to enter any conversation with a pocketful of questions and a readiness to see things differently. GUEST BIO & LINKS Esther Choy is CEO and Chief Story Facilitator at Leadership Story Lab, a top contributor to Forbes Leadership Strategy Channel, and the author of two leadership books published by HarperCollins, including the newly released Winning Without Persuading. With over 15 years coaching thousands of executives worldwide, Esther equips leaders to move beyond persuasion and unlock the stories that foster team trust and connection. She teaches at Northwestern’s Kellogg School of Management and the University of Zurich, drawing on decades of experience helping clients discover, synthesise, and tell the stories that make strategies stick. Connect with Esther Choy: Website: https://www.leadershipstorylab.com/https://www.leadershipstorylab.com/ [https://www.leadershipstorylab.com/] LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/estherchoy/https://www.linkedin.com/in/estherchoy/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/estherchoy/] Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/leadershipstorylab/https://www.instagram.com/leadershipstorylab/ [https://www.instagram.com/leadershipstorylab/] Podcast: https://www.leadershipstorylab.com/podcast/https://www.leadershipstorylab.com/podcast/ [https://www.leadershipstorylab.com/podcast/] ABOUT THE SHOW Chief Story Officer is a podcast about how stories drive strategy, not just communication. Host Rob D. Willis talks with executives and thought leaders about the moments where the right message changed everything. Real stories. Real impact. Every two weeks. CONNECT WITH ROB Want frameworks for strategic storytelling? Download the free guide: "5 Ways to Make People Care About Your Strategy" → http://subscribepage.io/robdwillissubscribepage.io/robdwillis [http://subscribepage.io/robdwillis] Connect with Rob: Website: http://robdwillis.com/robdwillis.com [http://robdwillis.com/] LinkedIn: http://linkedin.com/in/robdwillislinkedin.com/in/robdwillis [http://linkedin.com/in/robdwillis] Instagram: @robdwillis TikTok: @robdwillis Subscribe to Chief Story Officer wherever you listen to podcasts.

Rethinking Storytelling: Folklore, Collaboration, and Decolonising the Business Narrative with Annette Simmons

Annette Simmons, author of The Story Factor and Whoever Tells the Best Story Wins, joins the show to challenge the idea that business storytelling is just about heroes and conflict. She reveals why real influence comes from sharing subjective, emotionally resonant stories, and how rituals of story-sharing can repair trust, build collaboration, and shape organisational culture. In this episode, we dive into the true role of storytelling in organisations, exploring why stories are more than just narratives with conflict and how they're evolution’s way of ensuring collaboration, trust, and survival at work. With business storytelling often reduced to formulas and templates, we challenge what’s been lost, and how leaders can reclaim storytelling’s real strategic power. Annette Simmons reveals her journey from advertising to storytelling, unpacks the difference between objective and story thinking, and introduces the vital but overlooked concept of repair after betrayal stories. She shares practical rituals to surface tacit knowledge, the six stories that every leader needs, and why rituals, not rules are the key to keeping ethics and values alive in business. You’ll leave with tangible prompts to spark more vulnerability and collaboration, a new appreciation for restoring trust after setbacks, and concrete steps to make stories a lived ritual in your team, not just a communication tool. GUEST BIO & LINKS Annette Simmons is a renowned author, keynote speaker, and storytelling expert whose books The Story Factor and Whoever Tells the Best Story Wins have influenced leaders worldwide. Over three decades, Annette has helped organisations like Microsoft, NASA, and the Brookings Institute use storytelling to resolve conflict, foster trust, and shift mindsets not merely through data, but through powerful shared experience. Drawing on early influences in psychology and marketing, Annette’s approach challenges the dominance of “objective” thinking in business. She advocates for bringing back the lost art of tacit, folk-inspired storytelling and establishing rituals that make subjective wisdom and values central to team culture. Her latest work, Drinking from a Different Well, explores how women’s stories redefine power in collaborative settings. Connect with Annette Simmons: Website: https://annettesimmons.com/https://annettesimmons.com/ [https://annettesimmons.com/] LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/annettesimmonsstory/https://www.linkedin.com/in/annettesimmonsstory/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/annettesimmonsstory/] Article: Evolution’s Lessons We've Left Behind [https://annettesimmons431852.substack.com/p/evolutions-lessons-weve-left-behind?r=av4f9&utm_medium=ios&triedRedirect=true] Email: annette@annettesimmons.com ABOUT THE SHOW Chief Story Officer is a podcast about how stories drive strategy, not just communication. Host Rob D. Willis talks with executives and thought leaders about the moments where the right message changed everything. Real stories. Real impact. Every two weeks. CONNECT WITH ROB Want frameworks for strategic storytelling? Download the free guide: "5 Ways to Make People Care About Your Strategy" → http://subscribepage.io/robdwillissubscribepage.io/robdwillis [http://subscribepage.io/robdwillis] Connect with Rob: Website: http://robdwillis.com/robdwillis.com [http://robdwillis.com/] LinkedIn: http://linkedin.com/in/robdwillislinkedin.com/in/robdwillis [http://linkedin.com/in/robdwillis] Instagram: @robdwillis TikTok: @robdwillis Subscribe to Chief Story Officer wherever you listen to podcasts.