Content and Conversation: Organic Growth Insights from Siege Media

Building a Media-First Content Marketing Strategy w/ Devin Bramhall

In this episode of Content and Conversation, Ross Hudgens sits down with Devin Bramhall to unpack what’s broken in modern B2B marketing and what actually works when metrics get messy and attribution falls apart. They talk through Devin’s experience writing B2B Content Marketing Strategy, why “media-first” is now table stakes, and how community is often misunderstood, mis-scoped, or forced into the wrong formats. Devin shares real examples from her work at Help Scout and beyond, showing how strong communities are built by paying attention to people, not playbooks. Show Notes: 00:00 – Intro/Marketing can’t be measured with numbers alone   05:30 – Writing a book when you already know the answer   10:20 – Media-first content marketing explained   15:00 – What community actually means (and what it doesn’t)   20:30 – Real-world community examples that worked   28:30 – Outcomes vs activities in marketing reporting   35:00 – Telling a story your CEO will understand   44:30 – When community is the wrong strategy   Show Links: * B2B Content Marketing Strategy Book [https://www.amazon.com/B2B-Content-Marketing-Strategy-Media-First/dp/1398622516] by Devin Bramhall * Follow Ross on X: https://x.com/RossHudgens [https://www.youtube.com/redirect?event=video_description&redir_token=QUFFLUhqbHlUWFQyVnpldFB3YVFTUlBrZXhCQ1JELXJmUXxBQ3Jtc0tsbEhUaUp6VXJBOEtWb2tJeVRoTUtrU0FLdm5YUHhPSmZjOUduNndKNFVrcDFyd0Y3bklqSkt3TkIwMElzRFBjUk1PMHVsaVg2Qi1lX0k5OTJ4UGxpSHJzWE9SMUdobTJTVW9ZcVh0Ui0wbW9tZWFsVQ&q=https%3A%2F%2Fx.com%2FRossHudgens&v=4KyYqe1s_XY] Subscribe today for weekly tips: https://bit.ly/3dBM61f Listen on iTunes: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/content-and-conversation-seo-tips-from-siege-media/id1289467174 Listen on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1kiaFGXO5UcT2qXVRuXjsM Listen on Google: https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5zaW1wbGVjYXN0LmNvbS9jT3NjUkdLeA Follow Siege on Twitter: http://twitter.com/siegemedia Follow Ross on Twitter: http://twitter.com/rosshudgens Directed by Cara Brown: https://twitter.com/cararbrown Email Ross: ross@siegemedia.com #seo | #contentmarketing

How GEO Actually Works w/ Bernard Huang

Bernard Huang returns to break down GEO (Generative Engine Optimization) and the big question: is GEO actually different from SEO, or just SEO evolving?   We talk about how AI Mode/AI Overviews are changing search behavior, why top-funnel traffic is getting squeezed, and what “good SEO is good GEO” really means in practice.   Show Notes: 00:00 – Welcome back & why GEO is everywhere 03:05 – Is GEO actually different from SEO? 07:10 – How AI agents think vs keyword-based SEO 12:45 – The traffic apocalypse & AI Mode becoming default 18:00 – Mentions vs backlinks in an LLM world 24:30 – What people are getting wrong about GEO 30:45 – Measuring success: impressions, citations & brand search 42:55 – The “long, long tail” and the future of content strategy   Show Links: Follow Bernard on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bernardjhuang/   Visit Clearscope: https://www.clearscope.io/   Follow Ross on X: https://x.com/RossHudgens     Subscribe today for weekly tips: https://bit.ly/3dBM61f Listen on iTunes: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/content-and-conversation-seo-tips-from-siege-media/id1289467174 Listen on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1kiaFGXO5UcT2qXVRuXjsM Listen on Google: https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5zaW1wbGVjYXN0LmNvbS9jT3NjUkdLeA Follow Siege on Twitter: http://twitter.com/siegemedia Follow Ross on Twitter: http://twitter.com/rosshudgens Directed by Cara Brown: https://twitter.com/cararbrown Email Ross: ross@siegemedia.com #seo | #contentmarketing

Tough Questions CEOs are Asking About AI SEO (and How To Answer Them) w/ Gaetano DiNardi

Ross welcomes Gaetano DiNardi, growth advisor and B2B SaaS strategist, to unpack the brutal questions CEOs are suddenly firing at their SEO teams in the AI era: traffic is flat or down, attribution is messy, LLM dashboards look scary, and everyone wants to know if SEO is still “working.”   They dig into why traffic is no longer the primary health metric, how AI Overviews and LLMs are breaking the old “rank → CTR → traffic → leads → revenue” equation, and why CMOs should obsess less over sessions and more over demo requests, pipeline, deal size, and overall organic channel performance.   Gaetano shares how he’s reframing SEO for mid-market B2B SaaS: shifting from decaying top-of-funnel content to bottom-of-funnel “money pages,” optimizing for LLM citations and “money prompts,” and using concepts like “crash-the-party” comparison pages to win high-intent demand across both Google and AI platforms.   They also break down why LLM prompt tracking is the new rank tracking (with all the same pitfalls), how AI platform traffic actually converts compared to Google, what “dark funnel SEO” looks like in practice, and why Gaetano thinks classic TOFU SEO might effectively go to zero while brand, data studies, and opinionated thought leadership pick up the slack.   Show Notes 0:08 – Gaetano returns & why last year’s SEO playbook no longer works 1:17 – CEOs’ top question: “Traffic is down… is SEO still working?” 2:17 – Why B2B SaaS is feeling the decline hardest 3:16 – The old rank → CTR → traffic → revenue model is broken 5:46 – Top-of-funnel content is collapsing (and why TOFU is “dead-ish”) 6:13 – The shift to bottom-funnel: BOFU keywords, low volume, high intent 7:11 – Flat traffic + rising revenue: the new SEO success story 8:01 – What LLMs cite: comparisons, “best X” lists, crash-the-party pages 8:38 – Crash-the-party SEO explained in 15 seconds 13:21 – LLM prompt dashboards are misleading your executives 15:53 – Branded vs. non-branded LLM prompts: why you MUST separate them 18:06 – Build a tight list of “money prompts,” not 500 random ones 20:06 – Why AI platforms show higher conversion rates than Google 22:10 – Dark-funnel behavior: LLM → Google → homepage → convert 24:08 – Google leads have FAR larger deal sizes than AI leads 27:35 – SEO attribution is officially “cooked” in the AI era 29:27 – Traffic flat, pipeline up 3×: examples from real clients 31:25 – Use top-10 stability to prove AI Overviews stole your clicks 34:47 – Search is becoming BOFU-first — what that means 35:34 – LLM citations as the new leading indicator for SEO 39:00 – Exploding topics = more LLM citations due to low consensus 41:22 – Engagement validates information gain (why POV content wins) 47:20 – What happens to TOFU SEO? (Short answer: it shrinks massively) 48:49 – Why TOFU may survive only for authority, clustering, and links     Gaetano on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/officialg/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/officialg/]   Tough Questions CEOs Are Asking About AI SEO: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1T_IQXUCXBQtFcLekVFwqv23y8ViuRFJKBIRtn4wcImQ/edit?usp=sharing   Does traffic from AI platforms convert “better” than Google search traffic?: https://marketingadvice.substack.com/p/869517ce-4629-429f-addd-518d9342cdff   CMOs are frantically asking “what’s our Reddit strategy?: https://marketingadvice.substack.com/p/cmos-are-frantically-asking-whats   LLM prompt tracking is the new rank tracking: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/officialg_llm-prompt-monitoring-is-quickly-becoming-activity-737 7069814458097664-KLyi/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=member_desktop&rcm=ACoAAAj OemoBsmGgXOOcFpcwGVG1B7IlDCvf8io Subscribe today for weekly tips: https://bit.ly/3dBM61f Listen on iTunes: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/content-and-conversation-seo-tips-from-siege-media/id1289467174 Listen on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1kiaFGXO5UcT2qXVRuXjsM Listen on Google: https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5zaW1wbGVjYXN0LmNvbS9jT3NjUkdLeA Follow Siege on Twitter: http://twitter.com/siegemedia Follow Ross on Twitter: http://twitter.com/rosshudgens Directed by Cara Brown: https://twitter.com/cararbrown Email Ross: ross@siegemedia.com #seo | #contentmarketing

Do You Need a Content Engineer? w/ AirOps’ Josh Spilker

Ross sits down with Josh Spilker, Content Marketing & SEO Lead at AirOps, to unpack the rise of the content engineer — what it means, why it matters, and how it’s reshaping SEO and content operations. They dive into Ryan Law’s critique, hybrid-AI workflows, org-chart ownership, automation opportunities, and why Josh believes AI doesn’t kill content — it rewires strategy. Plus: the “context librarian” concept, content refresh automation, spotting slipping queries, using multiple models together, and avoiding low-quality AI traps. Show Notes: 0:08 – What is a “content engineer” and why the role is emerging 1:17 – How content engineering evolved from early UX concepts 2:13 – Who fits best in this role: writers, SEOs, or automation pros? 3:39 – Ryan Law’s critique: “I wouldn’t hire a content engineer” 4:51 – Internal linking as a powerful semi-automated workflow 5:56 – From manual outlines to AI-assisted research and briefs 6:48 – Balancing AI workflows and human-led quality control 7:24 – Why “Director of Automation” might better describe the role 8:35 – Who should lead content automation inside organizations 9:15 – AI text generation vs. hybrid workflows: what’s really working 10:38 – The limits of pure AI content and why oversight matters 11:19 – How AirOps customers use hybrid models for scale 12:01 – Using multiple models (ChatGPT, Claude, Perplexity) together 13:02 – The “7% of AI pages” debate and Patrick Stox’s counter-data 14:19 – How editorial standards and compliance shape AI adoption 15:23 – “AI doesn’t kill content — it rewires strategy” 16:15 – Refresh workflows: detecting pages and queries that slip 17:18 – Where content engineers fit in the org chart today 18:16 – The rise of the “context librarian” for brand knowledge bases 19:19 – Combining brand governance with AI-driven workflows 20:21 – How automation can unify voice and style across teams 21:32 – Why AI helps close the creative gap faster, not replace writers 22:29 – Teaching non-engineers to think like product builders 23:19 – Breaking down creative processes into repeatable systems 24:07 – Turning everyday editorial routines into structured workflows 25:08 – Automating meeting summaries and reporting emails 26:12 – Using AI to surface key quotes and podcast clip highlights 27:17 – “Transformation content”: repurposing, summarizing, clipping 28:13 – AirOps’ content strategy: optimization, refresh, iteration 29:04 – Refresh workflows tied to GSC data and ranking drops 30:33 – Risks of shallow “freshness updates” and engagement metrics 31:47 – How informed SEOs make the best use of AirOps workflows 32:07 – Why fundamentals matter before scaling with AI tools 33:02 – Barry Bonds analogy: AI only helps pros with solid foundations 34:15 – Automating backlink outreach with contextual relevance 35:34 – Why personalization still wins over high-volume outreach 36:17 – The balance between automation and editorial craft 37:11 – Where to find Josh’s webinars, reports, and AirOps resources Josh Spilker on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/joshspilker AirOps: https://www.airops.com AirOps Webinars: https://www.airops.com/categories/events Ahrefs Post (Ryan Law): https://ahrefs.com/blog/i-wouldnt-hire-a-content-engineer Patrick Stox Response: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/patrickstox_im-sure-youre-all-seeing-the-study-saying-activity-7385017156213788672-5srr Subscribe today for weekly tips: https://bit.ly/3dBM61f Listen on iTunes: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/content-and-conversation-seo-tips-from-siege-media/id1289467174 Listen on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1kiaFGXO5UcT2qXVRuXjsM Listen on Google: https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5zaW1wbGVjYXN0LmNvbS9jT3NjUkdLeA Follow Siege on Twitter: http://twitter.com/siegemedia Follow Ross on Twitter: http://twitter.com/rosshudgens Directed by Cara Brown: https://twitter.com/cararbrown Email Ross: ross@siegemedia.com #seo | #contentmarketing

How Angi Uses AI to Power Better Content w/ Caroline Gilbert

Caroline Gilbert — Director of Content & Editorial at Angi — joins Ross Hudgens to explore how one of the largest home-services brands is using AI to scale, transform, and optimize content operations. They discuss how Caroline’s team doubled Angi’s content library to 12,000+ articles, how AI helps maintain top-funnel visibility amid shifting search behaviors, and the nuanced balance between human expertise and generative automation. Caroline breaks down the three pillars of Angi’s AI framework — generation, transformation, and operations — and how they’ve automated everything from brief creation to CMS ingestion while keeping a strong editorial voice. Plus: lessons learned from early AI missteps, real examples of disclosure testing, and how AI is reshaping both content creation and search behavior itself. Show Notes 0:08 – From cost guides to “everything home”: expanding Angi’s library 1:00 – Moving up-funnel: education, troubleshooting, light DIY, and when to hire 2:14 – Top-funnel ROI drops as AI overviews change search behavior 2:56 – Why Angi adopts gen-AI: maintain helpful content without heavy human lift 3:27 – Staying visible where intent is early but brand value matters 4:45 – Content becomes commodity: deciding where humans add unique value 5:55 – Evergreen “how-to” steps vs. human nuance (risks, gotchas, pro POV) 7:18 – How AI is used: full refreshes, component injections, data-driven sizing 9:01 – The real trade-off: human time vs. technology time 9:26 – Scale context: 5k → 12k pages (growth mostly human-led) 9:41 – Three pillars: generation, transformation, operations 10:38 – Ops wins: briefs, automated edits/QA, CMS ingestion, minutes → hours 12:21 – Designers focus on UX polish when ingestion is 98% done 12:58 – Where AI struggled: risky DIY (HVAC/roofing), brand POV, nuance 15:02 – Licensing content is messy (state/county rules): tighter human review 17:19 – Design: generate/transform/streamline + “vibe coding” prototypes 20:18 – Pilot first: small cohorts, guardrails, measure engagement/conversions 21:22 – Disclosure tests: placement/tone matter; users split ~50/50 on trust 25:53 – “Tools, time, or talent”: when to push pro hire messaging 27:39 – Differentiators: pro interviews + Angi’s original homeowner cost data 28:07 – AI helps editors analyze like analysts; humans shape the story 29:19 – Looking ahead: AI shifting search from answers to utilities/experiences Show Links Caroline Gilbert on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/caroline-gilbert-41463518/ Angi: https://www.angi.com/ Subscribe today for weekly tips: https://bit.ly/3dBM61f Listen on iTunes: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/content-and-conversation-seo-tips-from-siege-media/id1289467174 Listen on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1kiaFGXO5UcT2qXVRuXjsM Listen on Google: https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5zaW1wbGVjYXN0LmNvbS9jT3NjUkdLeA Follow Siege on Twitter: http://twitter.com/siegemedia Follow Ross on Twitter: http://twitter.com/rosshudgens Directed by Cara Brown: https://twitter.com/cararbrown Email Ross: ross@siegemedia.com #seo | #contentmarketing