Design Can't Rely on Logic: Troy Leinster on Type Design and Human Perception

Beyond the Text Field: Louise Macfadyen, Author of Designing AI Interfaces

This episode, I got to sit down with my friend, podcast cohost on Away from Keyboard [https://pod.link/awayfrompod], and former coworker Louise Macfadyen [https://lmacfadyen.com/] as she prepares to launch her new book Designing AI Interfaces with Oreilly this Spring. We had a lot to talk about, from managing the conceptual distance between what AI actually does and what people imagine it can do, to the new skills designers, engineers, and PMs need to work with models, the potential harms of new technology, and some of the patterns designers can use to keep ethics and safety in the loop. Designing AI Interfaces is available from O'Reilly Media [https://www.amazon.com/Designing-AI-Interfaces-Principles-Autonomous/dp/B0FYC7XRP7] April 21st, 2026.

The Era of the Generalist: Rachel Been, SVP of Design for Expedia Group

In this episode, Liam speaks with Rachel Been, SVP of Design for Expedia Group, about her journey from photography to design leadership and why she believes this is "the era of the generalist." The conversation unpacks the recent launch of Expedia's new app on ChatGPT and what it means to design for "non-deterministic flows" and "infinite inputs." Rachel explains how AI is breaking old, linear design paradigms and why, in an age of potential "design slop," deep curiosity and human-centered craft are more important than ever. Read a transcript and check out more from me at interfacecafe.com [https://interfacecafe.com] Episode Chapters: 00:00 Introduction 01:34 The Generalist Designer 11:22 Launching the Expedia App for ChatGPT 16:00 Beyond the Search Bar 25:44 Designing for Infinity 34:03 The Sandwich Theory 39:41 Avoiding Design Slop: Advice on Craft

Other Than Expected: Fabian Bircher on Combining Art, Architecture, and Code

In this episode, Liam speaks with Zürich-based architect and artist Fabian Bircher, whose work spans buildings, custom lighting, and interactive installations. Fabian discusses his unique creative process, where inspiration flows from both artistic concepts and the discovery of new technological possibilities. The conversation explores the materiality of light through his Buoy lamps and dichroic foil installations, the process of revealing hidden digital systems with his "Reporting Device," and the unexpected role of randomness in creating kinetic art. Find a full transcript and more at interfacecafe.com [https://interfacecafe.com], and subscribe so you don't miss an episode. Episode Chapters: 01:16 Intro and Background 03:52 The Exchange Between Tech and Creativity 06:04 Breaking Into the Unknown 07:52 Buoy Lamps and the Vermicelleria 12:58 The Materiality of Light 16:12 Bringing Light to a Brutalist Schoolhouse 19:15 The Reporting Device 24:02 Revealing the Unseen 25:49 Anthropomorphic Architecture 29:54 The Role of Randomness 31:54 Does it All Make Sense? 34:34 What Should We Be Focused On? 37:40 Outro

Design Can't Rely on Logic: Troy Leinster on Type Design and Human Perception

In this episode, I reconnect with my former instructor, type designer and design coach Troy Leinster. Troy shares his journey from graphic design to type design, and explains why learning to make letters makes you a better designer. We also dig into the importance of trusting the human eye over geometry, the productive friction of sketching by hand, and how understanding calligraphy builds a stronger perspective on type design. Troy discusses why, in the age of AI, the most important thing a designer can do is put their personal touch on the work.

The User Brings the Confetti: Rob Giampietro on Scaling a Human-Centered Brand

Rob Giampietro, Head of Creative at Notion and former Design Director at MoMA, returns to the show to unpack the story behind Notion Faces, the popular tool that allows users to create their own illustrated avatar. Rob details the project's journey from a beloved internal tradition to a major public launch, including the pivotal decision to scale with human illustrators instead of AI to maintain the brand's unique, handcrafted quality. The conversation explores how the team shifted its focus from "likeness" to "expression," the power of modularity in design systems, and the research process that made the project a success. 📋 Read a transcript [https://interfacecafe.com/notion-faces-rob-giampietro-on-scaling-a-human-centered-brand] 📡 Subscribe [https://design-notes.show]