Into The Machine with Tobias Rose-Stockwell

Episode 5: What happens when all the good people leave social media?

What happens when the good people leave social media? Chloé Valdary [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chlo%C3%A9_Valdary] walked away from 110,000 followers on social media. Not a quiet, lurking exit — but a hard delete.Chloé was a force of nature on Twitter. She built a huge following helping people navigate some of the platform’s thorniest issues with grace and empathy. While many cancelled and called out, Chloé dove headfirst into the hardest conversations offering deep reflection and a dose of savvy humanizing. From George Floyd to Gaza, she was there, helping to deescalate. Then she left. In this episode, we unpack what it means when moderates like Chloé leave the platforms that dominate our public conversation. Who is left? Usually it’s the most polarized and extreme users, who actively own the discourse after that point. We talk a lot about social media as an Outrage Machine (and my book [https://tobias.cc/book] — of the same title), the hidden incentives shaping our behavior on these platforms, and the mental health cost of constant moral performance. * If a social platform is a toxic place, what are the obligations we have to the public commons in staying there? * Are big digital spaces like social media structurally incapable of supporting prosocial conversations? * Can we protect our mental health while still participating in online political debate? This conversation explores the trade-offs. Chloé’s Substack: Musings with Chloé [https://chloevaldary.substack.com/] Chloé’s work: Theory of Enchantment [https://www.theoryofenchantment.com/] A small ask: The irony is not lost on me in trying to critique the algorithms while still being dependent upon them to reach the right audience. If you do enjoy the show, please share this episode with a friend or drop us a rating [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/into-the-machine-with-tobias-rose-stockwell/id1824137015] Into The Machine is a listener & reader supported project. If you enjoy these conversations, please consider becoming a paid subscriber. [https://intothemachine.com/] It allows for me to spend more time and effort researching new guests and making this a real thing. You can follow us here: * Apple Podcasts [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/into-the-machine-with-tobias-rose-stockwell/id1824137015] * YouTube [https://www.youtube.com/@IntoTheMachineShow] * Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/0S0TxNnI4uYTaPWdD1VnDT] * Instagram [https://www.instagram.com/intothemachineshow/] Get full access to Into The Machine at tobias.substack.com/subscribe [https://tobias.substack.com/subscribe?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_4]

Episode 4: Your kid will probably date an AI, and other terrifying thoughts – A conversation with the founder of Hinge

Will people stop dating humans? Over a decade ago, the movie Her portrayed a world where by where large numbers of people opted out of dating, and instead turned to AI for their emotional needs. Justin McLeod is the founder and CEO of Hinge. He has spent more than a decade thinking about how algorithms shape dating, choice, and human connection. In this conversation, we look at the rise of AI companionship, how business incentives affect these systems, and where AI-driven intimacy may be heading. I press Justin on the risks of people turning to AI instead of human relationships, how much autonomy we give to algorithms, and what responsible design might look like. This episode maps out the key questions we should be asking as we lean further into machine-mediated love. I hope you enjoy. A small ask: The irony is not lost on me in trying to critique the algorithms while still being dependent upon them to reach the right audience. If you do enjoy the show, please share this episode with a friend and rate us on apple podcasts. [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/into-the-machine-with-tobias-rose-stockwell/id1824137015] You can follow us here: * Apple Podcasts [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/into-the-machine-with-tobias-rose-stockwell/id1824137015] * YouTube [https://www.youtube.com/@IntoTheMachineShow] * Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/0S0TxNnI4uYTaPWdD1VnDT] * Instagram [https://www.instagram.com/tobiased/] Get full access to Into The Machine at tobias.substack.com/subscribe [https://tobias.substack.com/subscribe?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_4]

Episode 3: Tristan Harris on how to safely build artificial minds

Today I’m releasing a conversation with Tristan Harris. Tristan is the founder of the Center for Humane Technology [https://www.humanetech.com/] and one of the leading voices warning about how runaway AI might destabilize society. He starred in (and co-produced) the Netflix documentary The Social Dilemma. [https://thesocialdilemma.com/] I’ve known Tristan for a long time, and this is one of the best conversations we’ve ever had—public or private. I press him on major risk scenarios, what we can expect AI labs and legislators to do in the face of AGI, and what he thinks can actually be done right now to ensure these systems stay maximally beneficial to humanity. I left this conversation a bit more hopeful understanding what kinds of solutions are available. I hope you do too. In this episode we talk about: * Creepy new AI capabilities: new models using unwitting humans to send encoded messages to other AIs. * How it might all go down: a real-world near-term disaster scenario with runaway self-replicating AIs. * How to bypass race dynamics with China and other powers accelerating AI capabilities. * Designing systems for wisdom: alternative paths for designing and training Socratic AIs. A small ask: The irony is not lost on me in trying to critique the algorithms while still being dependent upon them to reach the right audience. If you do enjoy the show, please share this episode with a friend and drop us a rating. [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/into-the-machine-with-tobias-rose-stockwell/id1824137015] You can follow us here: * Apple Podcasts [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/into-the-machine-with-tobias-rose-stockwell/id1824137015] * YouTube [https://www.youtube.com/@IntoTheMachineShow] * Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/0S0TxNnI4uYTaPWdD1VnDT] * Instagram [https://www.instagram.com/intothemachineshow/] Thanks for listening, and please do subscribe. -Tobias Into The Machine is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber. Get full access to Into The Machine at tobias.substack.com/subscribe [https://tobias.substack.com/subscribe?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_4]

Episode 2: Tim Urban of Wait But Why on Algorithmic Viruses, Cultural Antibodies, and the Art of Audience Building

Something is wrong with society—we feel it before we name it. Is it the algorithms? The platforms? The culture we create in response to them? In this episode of Into the Machine, I sit down with Tim Urban—creator of Wait But Why, TED phenomenon, and author of What’s Our Problem?—to triangulate the crisis we’re living through: a moment where technology has outpaced our culture, and tribalism is turned into profit. We trace a long arc—from the chaos of Gutenberg’s printing press to the attention fracking of TikTok—to ask a deceptively simple question: How do we build cultural immune systems strong enough to withstand viral algorithms? We talk through the human capacity to evolve norms—to grow up as a species—when our informational environment breaks. We explore audience capture, the seduction of virality, the dangers of algorithmically misaligned incentives, and the hopeful possibility that cultural learning can catch up. You’ll hear Tim unpack his “ladder of thinking” model: a two-axis framework for moving beyond left vs right and toward high- vs low-rung reasoning—and we explore what happens when the primitive mind takes the wheel. We also talk candidly about how to build a large audience on the internet, the behind-the-scenes emotional machinery of posting in a way that doesn’t sap your soul, and the quiet courage required to be yourself when everyone online is asking you to be someone else If this episode resonates with you, please do rate us on Apple podcasts, and consider sharing it with a friend. Thank you. Special Thanks to Tycho for our intro music. Get full access to Into The Machine at tobias.substack.com/subscribe [https://tobias.substack.com/subscribe?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_4]

Episode 1: Is AI Making Us Stupid? A Conversation with Jonathan Haidt

Today I’m launching Into The Machine. My first episode is a conversation with my colleague, social psychologist and #1 NYT bestselling author Jonathan Haidt. Jon and I wrote a piece in The Atlantic called The Dark Psychology of Social Networks [https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2019/12/social-media-democracy/600763/] — hoping to add clarity to the debate around social media. AI has changed the conversation. We now find ourselves in a stranger moment with LLMs, asking deeper questions about what these tools are doing to our ability to think. In this episode we discuss: * Attention as civic infrastructure: the erosion of sustained focus undermines shared reality, and with it the preconditions for governance, compromise, and democratic legitimacy. * Engagement algorithms as centrifuges: rather than reflecting consensus, they pull discourse toward the edges, making fringe views appear as if they represent the center. * Democracies as uniquely fragile: unlike authoritarian systems that can integrate these technologies into centralized control, liberal democracies are structurally more vulnerable to their fragmenting effects. * Childhood as the front line: the breakdown of “serve-and-return” interactions, compounded by algorithmic feeds, represents not just a developmental crisis but a possible precursor to broader societal instability. * Human agency atrophied by delegation: when writing, thinking, and decision-making are outsourced to machines, individuals lose the cognitive muscle required for original judgment. A small ask The irony is not lost on us in trying to explain/critique the algorithms while we’re dependent upon them to reach the right audience. If you do enjoy the show, please add a rating to Apple Podcasts [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/into-the-machine-with-tobias-rose-stockwell/id1824137015]and share with a friend — it really helps. And pelase do follow: * Into The Machine on Apple Podcasts [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/into-the-machine-with-tobias-rose-stockwell/id1824137015] * Into The Machine on YouTube [https://www.youtube.com/@IntoTheMachineShow] * Into The Machine on Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/0S0TxNnI4uYTaPWdD1VnDT] * Into The Machine on Instagram [https://www.instagram.com/intothemachineshow/] Our next guest is Tim Urban, creator of Wait But Why. Thank you, as always, for the gift of your attention. -Tobias Get full access to Into The Machine at tobias.substack.com/subscribe [https://tobias.substack.com/subscribe?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_4]