What I Wish They'd Told Me

The Mess

In our third episode, Stephen Baker and Aaron Prelock sit down to talk about the part of ministry that many traditional seminary programs simply cannot simulate: the mess. Theological mess. Historical mess. The mess of sinners and the mess we ourselves bring to the work. Aaron and Stephen talk about why so many young men set out to be the pastor whose church will not have these problems, why preaching and pastoral care cannot be split apart, and why the "clean machine" expectation — that Christians do not sin and good pastors do not either — quietly shuts down the work of sanctification it claims to protect. An old line surfaces near the end: a pastor should smell like his sheep. 0:00 — Introduction 1:30 — What do we mean by "the mess"? 4:15 — Church history is not historical reenactment 7:00 — The young pastor with stars in his eyes 10:45 — Theoretical theology vs. practical theology 13:30 — Leviticus 16 and the linen robe 17:00 — Hospital waiting rooms and Job's counselors 22:00 — Preaching is pastoral care 27:30 — Over-correcting and damned with faint praise 33:00 — Where do you go when you realize you need to grow? 37:00 — Owen, self-knowledge, and the wounded healer 41:30 — The expectation that Christians do not sin 46:00 — Sexual sin, abuse, and the "clean machine" church 51:00 — The hazmat suit: justification before sanctification 56:00 — A pastor should smell like his sheep 1:00:00 — Hospitality, marriage, and the witness of small mercies

Meet Stephen Baker

In our second episode, Aaron Prelock turns the tables on Stephen Baker, Dean of New Geneva Academy and associate pastor at Trinity Reformed Church in Bloomington, Indiana. Stephen shares how he went from a small-town Indiana home to a dramatic high school conversion, from a teepee in the woods to a pastors college in Bloomington. Along the way: marriage, ministry under Ted Tripp, a failed church plant in Milwaukee, a closed door to the mission field, and what led him to Trinity Reformed Church. This conversation covers how he got here, what shaped him, and what he wishes someone had told him before he ever stepped into pastoring. 0:00 — Introduction 1:24 — Growing up in Indiana 4:24 — Conversion in high school 11:26 — Becoming Reformed 14:53 — Bible college 16:55 — Meeting Sebra 18:49 — Pennsylvania and Ted Tripp 24:36 — Marriage and early family life 28:15 — Seminary 30:47 — The Milwaukee church plant 36:54 — A closed door to the mission field 39:13 — The move to Bloomington 43:48 — New Geneva Academy is born 46:33 — Reconciliation 54:35 — On being Dean 1:01:27 — What I wish they'd told me

Meet Aaron Prelock

In our first episode, Stephen Baker sits down with Aaron Prelock, pastor of Bloomington Bible Church and the new president of New Geneva Academy.  Aaron shares how he went from a big dispensational Baptist church to studying John Owen under a Norwegian Lutheran, from a Subaru factory floor to ten years of pastoral ministry in central London, and back to Bloomington, Indiana.   This conversation covers how he got here, what shaped him, and what he wishes someone had told him before he ever stepped into a pastorate — especially about what it means for a pastor to be a shepherd and not just a counselor. https://www.newgenevaacademy.com/ 0:00 — Introduction 2:30 — Growing up in Lafayette, early faith 5:45 — The biblical counseling world: Adams, Powlison, Tripp 10:00 — Bible college and the church in Cedar Rapids 14:30 — Seminary and the shift toward Reformed theology 18:00 — The factory year 22:00 — Discovering John Owen 25:00 — Westminster London, PhD in Norway 30:00 — Ten years pastoring in London 35:00 — Coming back to Indiana, his father's death 38:00 — Becoming senior pastor at Bloomington Bible Church 42:00 — What brings joy in pastoral ministry 48:00 — What I wish they'd told me: shepherding vs. crisis counseling 55:00 — Getting involved with New Geneva Academy