The Collective Genius Podcast

Brandon McCurdy: Why 80 Percent of Contracts Come From Follow Up

In this CG Live episode recorded at the Collective Genius Select and Elevate event at the JW Marriott in Clearwater Beach, Florida, Brandon McCurdy of Sharper Business Solutions sits down after leading back-to-back masterclasses on KPIs alongside Amanda Dean and David Richter. Brandon does fractional CMO work for large real estate teams spending $150,000 plus per month on marketing, and he has helped ten teams hire marketing directors in the last 12 months. This conversation breaks down the marketing KPIs that separate investors stuck at $500K to $2 million from the operators who scale past them, including the GNACC framework, customer acquisition cost, speed to lead, and why follow-up wins 75 to 85% of contracts. If you're a full time real estate investor doing 1 to 2 deals a month and you keep "trying" marketing channels instead of committing to them, this one is required listening. Timeline Summary [0:22] – Live from the CG Select and Elevate event at the JW Marriott in Clearwater Beach, Florida [0:44] – Brandon McCurdy of Sharper Business Solutions joins after teaching KPI masterclasses for Select and Elevate members [1:31] – Inside the stacked masterclass with Amanda Dean and David Richter covering purpose, profit, and performance indicators [3:02] – Who Select and Elevate members are: investors doing 1 to 2 deals a month and businesses between $500K and $2 million [3:46] – The cold calling burnout trap and why investors quit direct mail before it has a chance to work [4:47] – The GNACC framework: tracking gross, net, appointment, contract, and close on every channel weekly [5:37] – Why cold calling creates vanity metrics at the top of the funnel and when it still makes sense [6:01] – Stop trying, commit: why marketing spend is always relative to the size of your business [7:09] – CJ Moss grew from 14 deals to $11 million in six years by committing to one consistent marketing channel [7:48] – Seth Godin's Purple Cow and why ripping off someone else's playbook leaves you as just another piece of mail [9:19] – The Revolutionary War analogy: beating six figure spenders with guerrilla marketing tactics [10:19] – 500 premium mailers at $10 beats 5,000 cheap postcards, plus the $1,000 sword in a box that closes every time [11:18] – Speed is the small operator's only advantage, and the golf cart giveaway producing 4 to 5x ROI [14:18] – It costs $1,200 to $1,600 to get into a seller's living room, and answering faster drops that number [15:23] – 75 to 85% of contracts come from follow-up, not the first appointment [16:36] – Same-day appointments are 4 to 5 times more likely to close, and 20 to 30% of calls come in after hours [19:08] – Why every Elevate level investor needs a real internal marketing department before chasing new lead channels [20:17] – The self-limiting belief around marketing and why winners zig when everyone else zags 5 Key Takeaways 1. Track Every Channel With GNACC — Gross, net, appointment, contract, close. Review those five numbers weekly for each lead channel so the ones making you the most money get the most attention, instead of trusting vanity metrics. 2. Stop Trying, Start Committing — Direct mail won't perform on day one, and everyone says it takes six months. Commit fully, watch the data religiously every week, and stop pulling the plug before the channel has a chance to work. 3. Differentiation Beats a Bigger Budget — You can't outspend teams putting six or seven figures a month into your market. Win by being different: 500 premium mailers at $10 a piece will outperform 5,000 forgettable postcards. 4. Speed to Lead Lowers Acquisition Cost — It costs roughly $1,200 to $1,600 to put yourself in a seller's living room, and same-day appointments are 4 to 5 times more likely to close. Pick up the phone faster than everyone else and that cost drops. 5. Follow-Up Wins the Contract — 75 to 85% of signed contracts come after the first appointment. Treat every lead like gold and build a real follow-up funnel before you scale your spend. Links & Resources * Sharper Business Solutions — sharperbusiness.com * The Purple Cow by Seth Godin * Collective Genius Community — explorecg.com If you've ever said "I tried direct mail and it didn't work," this episode is your wake-up call. Brandon's challenge to stop trying and start committing, paired with the GNACC framework for tracking every channel, gives you a clear playbook for finally making your marketing dollars accountable. Share this one with an investor who keeps channel-hopping every 90 days. These are the conversations happening inside the room at Collective Genius events. If you're a full time real estate investor ready to scale with people who have already done it, head to ExploreCG.com to learn more and apply.

Sourcing Off-Market Commercial Deals Without a Big Marketing Budget featuring Dan Underwood

Dan Underwood is a Georgia-based real estate investor and CG member who has spent the last decade methodically transitioning from high-volume single family wholesaling to a commercial portfolio spanning apartments, self-storage, mobile home parks, and an RV park. What started with a $17,000 down payment on a rough first flip has compounded into a multi-million dollar commercial portfolio built entirely through 1031 exchanges and disciplined tranche rolling. In this episode, Dan shares the full arc of his investing journey and how he thinks about long-term wealth building vs. active income. From burning out in a wholesaling partnership to sourcing off-market commercial deals through relationship-driven outreach, this episode is required listening for any investor ready to stop starting over at zero every month and start building something that stacks. Timeline Summary [1:30] – Host introduces Dan Underwood, a CG member based just south of Savannah, Georgia [2:11] – Dan reveals this is his very first podcast interview despite years of investing experience [3:51] – Dan explains his current business: flipping 2 to 3 houses a month to fund commercial acquisitions [7:37] – Dan's origin story: flipping washers and dryers out of his living room before ever touching real estate [10:15] – The 80-to-90 hour week working as an entrepreneurial apprentice for an Ohio business owner [13:01] – His brutal first house flip: three contractors, a stop work order, three months of putting a tenant up in a hotel, and still netting $50,000 on a 900-square-foot house [16:34] – The spreadsheet moment that flipped his mindset and convinced him to go all in on real estate [18:51] – How Dan quit his job: drove 8.5 hours to Troy, Ohio to hand his resignation letter to his old boss in person [21:19] – The day a $10,000 consulting session led Dan to end his wholesaling partnership instead of setting up ROBs [23:29] – What he was holding when he made that pivot: 35 apartments, a mobile home park, and a $400,000 commercial wholesale closing [27:33] – The tranche system explained: how Dan rolls smaller assets into larger ones using 1031 exchanges with no additional capital out of pocket [34:08] – Why compounding growth only works if you start, and how Dan learned self-storage from Scott Myers before buying his first facility [39:12] – How Dan sources commercial deals today: direct mail, relationship-driven cold calling, and driving 50,000 to 60,000 miles a year to meet sellers in person [43:04] – What Dan is most excited about for the rest of 2026: multiple tranches ready to roll into the $3 to $5 million range [47:29] – What CG has meant to him: the Roger Bannister effect of seeing peers do what you thought was out of reach 5 Key Takeaways 1. Single Family Funds the Long Game — Using active income from flipping to fund commercial acquisitions is not a step backward. Nearly every successful commercial investor Dan knows kept single family in the mix specifically to create the cash flow that makes long-term deals possible. 2. The Tranche System Builds Real Wealth — Rolling proceeds from smaller assets into larger ones through 1031 exchanges, without pulling capital out, is how Dan turned a single $17,000 flip into a commercial portfolio now worth over $3 million in equity. The compounding effect only works if you stop spending what you make. 3. Commercial Deals Are Won in the Relationship, Not the Marketing — Sellers who have owned a commercial asset for 20 or 30 years are not responding to a mailer the same way a distressed homeowner might. Dan drives 50,000 to 60,000 miles a year building relationships because trust is what gets you first dibs and a seller willing to negotiate. 4. Start the Next Thing Before You're Ready — Dan learned self-storage from a course before he ever bought a facility. He started working on the commercial side while still wholesaling full time. If you wait until the current business is perfect, the compounding clock on your next asset never starts. 5. Diversifying Asset Classes Is a Feature, Not a Flaw — Pigeonholing into one asset class means going dry when deals in that space dry up. Dan holds apartments, storage, mobile home parks, and an RV park not because he couldn't focus but because the market doesn't always cooperate with a rigid strategy. Links & Resources * Contact Dan Underwood — dan@lockwoodig.com [dan@lockwoodig.com] * Scott Myers (Self-Storage Education) — scottmyers.com * Collective Genius Community — explorecg.com If you've been grinding through single family wondering when the wealth-building part actually kicks in, Dan's story is the blueprint. Share this episode with an investor in your circle who's thinking about making the jump to commercial but doesn't know where to start. If you found value here, please take a moment to follow, rate, and review the Collective Genius Podcast wherever you listen. Ready to be in the room with operators like Dan? Head to ExploreCG.com to learn more and apply.

Phil Vaughan: From 14 Convictions to a Couple Hundred Deals a Year

In this CG Live episode recorded at the Q1 2026 Collective Genius Premier and CEO event in Dallas, Texas, Phil Vaughan joins host Leon to share how he built a South Jersey wholesaling operation doing a couple hundred deals a year and now pushing toward $5–6 million in revenue. Phil has been a Collective Genius member for nearly five years and brings to the table one of the most remarkable origin stories in the entire CG community. What makes this conversation different is that Phil doesn't talk much about lead gen funnels or conversion metrics. He talks about where he actually came from: a teenage dad, 14 criminal convictions, kicked out of ninth grade, facing a two-year state prison sentence at 24 before a pastor's story changed everything. From that moment to supplying steel for New York City high-rises to closing wholesale deals at scale, Phil's story is about what happens when faith, drive, and the right room collide. If you're a real estate investor who believes your background disqualifies you from real success, this one is required listening. Timeline Summary [0:22] – Host introduces Phil Vaughan, a South Jersey wholesaler doing a couple hundred deals a year and a CG member going on five years [1:24] – Why Phil runs 80% wholesale and why he believes most flippers are making less than their wholesale fee while chasing social media clout [2:28] – Phil's current pain point: a comping and underwriting bottleneck that's costing him higher spreads and better exit strategies on every deal [4:38] – How two new closers coming online at the same time created an unexpected operational crunch and what solving it is actually worth [5:50] – Phil's revenue trajectory: from $500–600K his first year to $5 million today with a $50 million long-term goal [7:22] – Why Phil set a less aggressive revenue goal this year and how his team of captains and mavericks talks him down from the ceiling when the numbers don't yet support the dream [9:15] – Leon reflects on how many CG members Phil has name-dropped and why Phil's personal story is one of the best in the group [10:05] – How the CG public speaking belt was the original reason Phil joined and what he thought he could possibly offer a room full of high-level operators [11:34] – The South Jersey neighborhood where Phil grew up: parents split, wrong crowd, and how he went from street hockey to breaking into cars at 13 [13:48] – Locked up, on probation from 14 to 18, kicked out of ninth grade, two kids by 17, and facing two years at Jamesburg for Boys [16:17] – The courtroom moment that changed everything: a judge who let Phil walk and told him exactly what his life would look like if he didn't stop [19:56] – A pastor named Brother Sam who visited Phil in jail for years and delivered the story that finally broke him down and turned him around [21:08] – Phil voluntarily checks into Faith Farm for nine months, comes out transformed, and within a year is supplying steel for New York City high-rises making $330,000 a year [24:34] – What Phil shared at his first CG public speaking contest, why he felt naked telling it, and the relationships that came from showing up that vulnerable 5 Key Takeaways 1. Comping Speed Kills Margins — Moving too fast through disposition creates a hidden tax on every deal. Phil's team is leaving money on the table by defaulting to wholesale when a creative exit might deliver 2.5x the profit, simply because nobody has time to slow down and underwrite it right. 2. Your Environment Is Your Destiny — Phil joined Collective Genius for the same reason he ended up in trouble as a kid: you become whoever you're around. Surrounding yourself with people operating at a higher level isn't a luxury — it's the mechanism of growth, in both directions. 3. Vision Has to Outlast Obstacles — Phil has carried a $50 million real estate goal from the time he was grinding through his first $500,000 year. The goal felt insane at the time, but having it on the wall kept him moving through years when most people would have settled or stopped. 4. The People Who Believe in You Before You Believe in Yourself Matter More Than Any Strategy — A judge who saw something in Phil, a pastor who kept showing up to his jail cell, a coach named Cody who eventually helped him leave his W-2 — these weren't tactics. They were the turning points. 5. Vulnerability in the Room Builds What Logic Can't — Phil almost didn't tell his story at CG because he didn't think a room full of high-level operators would connect with it. The relationships that came out of that speech proved the opposite. The most powerful thing you can bring to a mastermind is often the truth about where you came from. Links & Resources * Connect with Phil Vaughan on social media — search "Phil by source" on all platforms * Collective Genius Community — explorecg.com Phil's story is a reminder that what you're building right now has almost nothing to do with where you started. From a courtroom at 20 years old to a couple hundred wholesale deals a year, the common thread has been getting into better rooms and refusing to stop growing. If Phil's story hit home for you, share this episode with someone who needs to hear it. And if you're a full-time real estate investor ready to get into a room like the one Phil's been in for five years, head to explorecg.com to learn more and apply.

From Football Champion to 2,500 Wholesale Deals in California featuring Dek Bake

Dek Bake brings an undrafted mentality to real estate wholesaling in Southern California. Since 2020, his team has completed over 2,500 wholesale deals across LA County, Orange County, Riverside County, and San Bernardino County, with years hitting 500+ transactions annually. This episode walks through how a former NFL defensive lineman built one of California's most competitive wholesaling operations in the state's toughest markets. Dek sits down to share his journey from junior college to Texas Tech to undrafted free agent, then to scaling a seven-figure acquisition company. If you're scaling a real estate operation in a competitive market, building and managing a lean team, or trying to think at the CEO level while staying grounded in operations, this one is required listening. Timeline Summary [0:00] – Host Leon Barnes welcomes guest Dek Bake, a member from California, to discuss his real estate wholesaling operation [2:35] – Dek shares his location in Irvine and primary markets across Southern California including LA County, Orange County, Riverside, and San Bernardino [3:31] – Over 2,500 deals completed since going full-time in 2020, all wholesale acquisitions in California [4:23] – Plans for expansion remain flexible; the Southern California market is large enough to build a multi-billion-dollar company [5:16] – Dek reveals his unique background as a former professional football player from Texas Tech, undrafted free agent who took the hard path to the NFL [6:39] – Journey to Texas Tech: junior college transfer from Fresno City College with no high school offers, recruited by Coach Leach [7:49] – Made it to the NFL despite being undrafted, played in multiple organizations and eventually shifted to real estate [14:30] – Turned his first real estate deal at age 31, which came from a failed wholesale assignment and pivoted to building acquisitions [17:45] – Built team from ground up over five years; now has systems in place with 30-40 employees handling acquisitions, marketing, and operations [22:15] – Marketing strategy focuses on direct mail, skip tracing, cold calling, and relationships; spending $30,000-40,000 monthly on acquisition [27:33] – Company hit 500+ deals in 2024; 2025 goal to return to 500+ deals after market slowdown in 2024 and 2025 [31:20] – Leadership philosophy: let talented people do their jobs without micromanaging; invest in training first, then measure results [36:45] – Model is scalable to other major markets, but expansion only happens with the right executive-level person aligned with company values [38:40] – As a defensive lineman, brought work ethic and preparation mindset to business; now able to think at 20,000-30,000 feet level without getting caught in minutia [41:22] – Excited about upcoming Collective Genius event in Oceanside, which he calls the best CG event of all 5 Key Takeaways 1. From Undrafted to Operations Leader — Dek's path to professional football—junior college, then Texas Tech, then the NFL—mirrors his real estate approach: embrace the hard path, focus on preparation and work ethic, and don't rely on backup plans. That same mentality built a 500+ deal-per-year wholesaling company. 2. Build Your Team First, Scale Later — After five years of grinding solo, Dek hired his first employees when he had the capital and systems to support them. He doesn't hire ahead of revenue; he hires to scale proven workflows with people aligned to company values. 3. Let Talented People Do Their Jobs — Micromanaging talented employees tanks productivity. Dek invests heavily in training, then trusts his team to execute without daily oversight. The result is a lean operation that handles 500+ deals a year without him touching every transaction. 4. Your Market Can Be Enough — California's competitive, high-tax environment pushed Dek to excellence. He has no urgent need to expand out of state; the market is deep enough to build a billion-dollar company. Expansion only happens with the right person, not just opportunity. 5. CEO Thinking Requires Distance from Daily Operations — Dek credits his ability to scale to operating at the 20,000-30,000 foot level instead of getting trapped in minutia. That requires hiring smart people, building systems, and trusting the team to execute so you can focus on direction, not tasks. Links & Resources * Dek Bake on LinkedIn — search "Dek Bake" or "Fair Trade Real Estate" * Collective Genius Community — explorecg.com Dek's calm, calculated approach to scaling a seven-figure wholesaling company stands in sharp contrast to the high-energy chaos many founders create. His willingness to invest in team first, scale systems second, and operate at a strategic level—rather than staying stuck in day-to-day grinding—is exactly the playbook that separates operators who hit 500 deals once from those who do it consistently. His story also proves that competitive markets like California don't hold you back; they push you to become sharper. Head to explorecg.com to learn more and apply.

Pat Martin: 650 Deals a Year in Secondary Markets and the System That Made It Possible

In this CG Live episode recorded at the Q1 event in Dallas, Texas, Pat Martin sits down with host Leon to break down how his company Pro Source Home Buyers went from a bruising 2022 to 650 closed transactions last year across Knoxville, Chattanooga, and the Tri-Cities, markets most investors would never expect to produce that kind of volume. Pat has been investing for 15 years and spent the years after 2022 tearing the business down to its foundation, rebuilding around the right people, the right accountability systems, and a marketing operation that tracks lead-to-contract ratios by individual channel on a rolling 12-month basis. The conversation covers how Pat identified that his best salesperson was never going to be his best sales manager, why hiring his CEO Coburn right out of college turned out to be the franchise quarterback moment that changed everything, and what it actually looks like to define winning for every role in the company before you expect people to perform at a high level. He also drops a sharp marketing insight near the end on why TV became his third-best channel after staying committed through six months of it not working at all. If you're a real estate investor trying to figure out how to double your business in secondary and tertiary markets without chasing new cities, this one is required listening. Timeline Summary [0:22] – Leon introduces Pat Martin, longtime CG member and first-time podcast guest, live from the Q1 Dallas event [0:49] – Pat's operating markets: Knoxville, Chattanooga, and the Tri-Cities, and why Chattanooga is wildly underrated [1:45] – Pat's background, moving from the Upper Peninsula of Michigan to Tennessee and building in markets most investors overlook [2:56] – The number that changes the conversation: 650 closed transactions last year, up from roughly 325, in markets with a combined MSA of about 1.5 million people [3:47] – The three things Pat credits for doubling the business: A-player team members, culture, and operational excellence [4:31] – What 2022 exposed about the business and the hard truth that the best salesperson is rarely going to be the best sales manager [6:28] – How Pat identified Coburn as the franchise quarterback hire, a finance-minded ops leader who came in straight out of college and set a new standard for accountability [7:29] – Why one strong ops hire creates a domino effect that pulls existing team members up to a higher level [9:07] – The role success statements play in creating clarity: every position has defined KPIs and a written description of what winning looks like each week [10:00] – How top-tier talent started competing for open positions once the culture and standards were clearly defined [11:08] – Why auditing every system and channel was the non-negotiable step before any growth was possible, and what the rebuild actually looked like [13:46] – What is working best right now: marketing accountability and tracking lead-to-contract ratios by individual channel, not just as an aggregate [14:32] – The actual numbers: four leads from radio and three and a half from TV to get a contract, versus 20 leads from Facebook to close the same deal [15:38] – Why all marketing audits at Pro Source run on a rolling 12-month basis to eliminate seasonal noise and knee-jerk reallocation decisions [17:01] – Pat's honest moment: realizing everyone on the team is now better than him at their specific jobs and what that means for where he goes next as a leader [18:22] – What the next chapter looks like: casting vision, developing middle managers into executives, and using that to fuel new ventures [19:41] – The TV marketing story: starting at $10–15K a month, watching it not work, committing for six months, scaling to $30K, and suddenly becoming the third-best lead channel in the business [20:30] – Why secondary and tertiary markets are ideal for TV saturation and why the same budget that gets ignored in Boston becomes dominant in Knoxville [22:27] – The Glengarry leads conversation: TV callers as inbound, motivated sellers who convert at one contract per three and a half leads 5 Key Takeaways 1. Your Best Salesperson Is Not Your Sales Manager — These are two completely different skill sets, and promoting the top performer into a leadership role is one of the most common ways growing businesses stall out. Pat learned this the hard way in 2022 and rebuilt his team structure around it. 2. One Franchise Quarterback Changes Everything — Hiring a strong ops leader who can build systems and hold people accountable creates a ripple effect across the entire team. Existing employees rise to meet the new standard, and the culture starts attracting talent that fits rather than whoever is available. 3. Define Winning Before You Demand It — Every role at Pro Source has success statements: a written description of what a great week looks like and the KPIs attached to it. Without that clarity, accountability is just a buzzword. With it, people know exactly what they are being measured against and top performers seek out those standards. 4. Track Marketing by Channel, Not by Average — Knowing that it takes 20 Facebook leads to close one deal versus three and a half TV leads fundamentally changes how you allocate budget. An aggregate lead-to-contract ratio hides the performance gap between your best and worst channels and causes you to underinvest where the returns are highest. 5. Give New Channels Six Months Before You Judge Them — Pat committed to TV for six full months before it started working, ramping from $15K to $30K a month before the channel turned on. A competitor in the same market tried it for two months, called it a failure, and walked away. Patience and spend are both required inputs, not optional ones. Links & Resources * Pro Source Home Buyers — Facebook and Instagram: search Pro Source Home Buyers * Collective Genius Community — explorecg.com If Pat's story resonates with you, especially the part about rebuilding off an honest audit rather than just pushing harder on a broken system, share this episode with an investor in your network who is grinding through that same wall. The gap between where Pat was in 2022 and 650 deals in secondary markets isn't luck or a bigger budget. It is clarity, culture, and the willingness to look at everything and fix what is actually broken. Head to explorecg.com to learn more about joining the Collective Genius community and applying for the level that fits where your business is right now.