Decoder with Nilay Patel

A few days ago, I hosted a panel with FTC commissioners Rebecca Slaughter and Alvaro Bedoya at the IAPP Global Privacy Summit in Washington, DC. We recorded the discussion, and we’re bringing it to you today. Normal Decoder stuff, but these are anything but normal times. Becca and Alvaro were FTC commissioners until very recently, when President Donald Trump fired them — but he doesn't have that legal authority. They’re suing to get their jobs back, and they’re prepared to go all the way to SCOTUS if they have to. Links:  * * Trump fires Democratic FTC commissioners | The Verge [https://www.theverge.com/news/632267/democratic-ftc-commissioners-alvaro-bedoya-rebecca-kelly-slaughter-illegally-fired-trump] * * Fired FTC commissioners sue Trump | The Verge [https://www.theverge.com/news/637602/fired-democratic-ftc-commissioners-sue-trump] * * The case for breaking up Google has never been stronger | The Verge [https://www.theverge.com/decoder-podcast-with-nilay-patel/654243/jonathan-kanter-antitrust-google-ad-tech-monopoly-doj] * * The government doesn’t understand Meta | The Verge [https://www.theverge.com/command-line-newsletter/652191/ftc-meta-antitrust-trial-instagram-whatsapp-network-effects] * * FTC v Meta live: updates from the battle for Instagram, WhatsApp | The Verge [https://www.theverge.com/news/646809/ftc-v-meta-antitrust-monopoly-trial-instagram-whatsapp] * * DOGE has arrived at the FTC | The Verge [https://www.theverge.com/news/643674/doge-members-spotted-ftc-elon-musk] * * Inside Mark Zuckerberg’s failed negotiations with the FTC | Wall Street Journal [https://www.wsj.com/us-news/law/mark-zuckerberg-meta-antitrust-ftc-negotiations-a53b3382] * * FTC chair says he’d drop Meta case if lawfully ordered to | The Verge [https://www.theverge.com/news/642068/ftc-chair-andrew-ferguson-trump-drop-meta-lawsuit-hypothetical] * * Bedoya warns of “corrupting influence of billionaires”| The Verge [https://www.theverge.com/news/632944/democratic-ftc-commissioner-alvaro-bedoya-tech-billionaires-trump] * * The FTC has enough staff to sue Amazon, after all | The Verge [https://www.theverge.com/news/628981/ftc-amazon-prime-delay-resource-constraints] Transcript: ⁠https://www.theverge.com/e/657115⁠ [https://www.theverge.com/e/657115] Credits: Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Our producers are Kate Cox and Nick Statt. Our editor is Ursa Wright.  The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices [https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices]

Today we’re talking about the very real possibility that Google might be broken up by the United States government. And to do that, I’m talking to Jonathan Kanter, the former assistant attorney general for antitrust under the Biden administration. Kanter left the DOJ after Trump was elected, but he was the architect of the major antitrust cases the Trump administration continues to pursue against Google. That means he’s much more free to share his thoughts on what it took to build and win both of these cases and what should happen next. Links:  * Google loses ad tech monopoly case | Verge [https://www.theverge.com/news/650665/google-loses-ad-tech-antitrust-monopoly-lawsuit] * Google is in more danger than ever of being broken up | Verge [https://www.theverge.com/policy/652170/google-search-ad-tech-remedies-antitrust-chrome-breakup] * OpenAI tells judge it would buy Chrome from Google | Verge [https://www.theverge.com/news/653882/openai-chrome-google-us-judge] * The high stakes of Google’s monopoly trial | Verge [https://www.theverge.com/policy/652708/google-search-antitrust-remedies-trial-opening] * DOJ says Google must sell Chrome to crack open search monopoly | Verge [https://www.theverge.com/2024/11/20/24300617/doj-google-search-antitrust-chrome-breakup] * Google makes history with rapid-fire antitrust losses | NYT [https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/18/technology/google-antitrust-losses-history.html] * Read the antitrust ruling against Google | NYT [https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2025/04/17/technology/google-ads-antitrust-ruling.html] * Google ad monopoly ruling's surprise winner: OpenAI | Axios [https://www.axios.com/2025/04/18/google-monopoly-openai-antitrust-platforms] * DOJ antitrust chief is ‘overjoyed’ after Google monopoly verdict | Decoder [https://www.theverge.com/24215684/doj-jonathan-kanter-antitrust-google-monopoly-verdict-win-decoder-podcast-interview] * DOJ’s Kanter says the antitrust fight against Big Tech is just beginning | Decoder [https://www.theverge.com/24067873/jonathan-kanter-doj-antitrust-google-policy-monopoly-big-tech] Credits: Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Our producers are Kate Cox and Nick Statt. Our editor is Ursa Wright.  The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices [https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices]

As CEO of Verizon's consumer division, Sowmyanarayan Sampath oversees the biggest part of the company, which does business with roughly a third of the entire country. He's a longtime Verge reader, so we  talked very directly about whether the huge 5G investment had actually paid off, and whether – whether the “race” we were supposedly in with China was actually worth it, and what kinds of new apps and services actually come to light. And while Verizon fought tooth and nail against regulations like net neutrality, the current Trump administration isn’t nearly as hands-off when it comes to things like  holding up deals because of DEI policies — something that’s happening to Verizon right now. So I had to ask Sampath if he was going to push back on that kind of government overreach as hard as Verizon has in the past. Links:  * The US government makes a $42 million bet on OpenRAN | The Verge [https://www.theverge.com/2024/2/12/24070550/open-ran-standard-us-funding-5g-huawei] * FCC scrutinizes Verizon’s $9.6 billion Frontier deal over DEI | USA Today [https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/business/2025/02/27/verizon-fcc-probe-diversity-practices/80750883007/] * Verizon offers a three-year price lock — but there’s a catch | The Verge [https://www.theverge.com/news/642325/verizon-myplan-price-lock-three-years] * T-Mobile updates its DEI policy to get Lumos deal approved | Fierce Network [https://www.fierce-network.com/broadband/t-mobile-aims-high-fiber-now-lumos-bag] * We don’t need net neutrality; we need competition (2014) | Ars Technica [https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2014/06/we-dont-need-net-neutrality-we-need-competition/] * Wireless and cable industries sue to kill net neutrality (2015) | The Verge [https://www.theverge.com/2015/4/14/8411033/ctia-wireless-cable-sue-lawsuit-fcc-net-neutrality] * Everything Verizon says in this terrible video against net neutrality (2017) | The Verge [https://www.theverge.com/2017/5/2/15520818/verizon-net-neutrality-craig-silliman-truth] * Report: Most Americans have no real choice in internet providers | ILSR [https://ilsr.org/articles/report-most-americans-have-no-real-choice-in-internet-providers/] * T-Mobile’s merger promises couldn’t make a carrier out of Dish | The Verge [https://www.theverge.com/2021/7/22/22587790/t-mobile-sprint-acquisition-dish-promises] Credits: Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Our producers are Kate Cox and Nick Statt. Our editor is Ursa Wright.  The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices [https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices]

One of the ways I’ve been trying to sort out the chaos of tariffs and trade wars is by talking to the people behind the software that makes the global trade system go. So today I wanted to bring back one of my favorite Decoder guests: Flexport CEO Ryan Petersen, whose software manages the logistics of moving things around the world, from factory to doorstep.  We didn’t get too much into the numbers — those tariff percentages keep changing — so instead Ryan and I really focused on how this system works, how it’s supposed to work, and how it’s working now, if it’s working at all.  Links:  * Flexport Tariff Live Blog | Flexport [https://www.flexport.com/blog/what-president-trumps-2024-u-s-election-win-means-for-global-trade-and/] * US tariffs: how Trump’s tax is hitting Big Tech and beyond | Verge [https://www.theverge.com/604742/trump-tariffs-canada-mexico-china-updates] * How much will Trump’s tariffs cost U.S. importers? | NYT [https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2025/04/03/business/economy/trump-tariffs-us-imports.html] * How much are tariffs on Chinese goods? It’s tricky | NYT [https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2025/04/12/business/economy/china-tariff-product-costs.html] * How Trump’s tariff chaos is already changing global trade | Decoder [https://www.theverge.com/decoder-podcast-with-nilay-patel/631082/trump-tariffs-iphone-altana-ceo-evan-smith-interview] * Can software simplify the supply chain? Ryan Petersen thinks so | Decoder [https://www.theverge.com/2022/9/20/23362021/flexport-supply-chain-crisis-logistics-software-tech] * Why Flexport CEO Ryan Petersen took his company back | Decoder [https://www.theverge.com/24006936/flexport-ceo-ryan-petersen-logistics-fired-dave-clark-return-decoder] * The U.S.-China decoupling arrives | Axios [https://www.axios.com/2025/04/16/trump-tariffs-china-bilateral-trade] Credits: Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Our producers are Kate Cox and Nick Statt. Our editor is Ursa Wright.  The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices [https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices]

Today, I’m talking with Vlad Tenev, the co-founder and CEO of Robinhood, which started as a way to open up stock trading. But the company’s ambitions have grown over time – and they’re getting bigger. Just a day before Vlad and I talked, Robinhood announced it would soon be offering bank accounts and wealth management services, which would really allow Robinhood to be involved with your money at every possible level.  So I was very interested to sit down with Vlad and really hash out where Robinhood is going, and why he’s so adamant that certain big ideas, like prediction markets based around everything from sports games to presidential elections, are going to play a pivotal role in the future of finance. Links:  * Robinhood CEO Vlad Tenev on markets for everything | Hard Fork [https://www.nytimes.com/2025/02/21/podcasts/hardfork-grok-robinhood.html] * Robinhood is launching bank accounts | Verge [https://www.theverge.com/news/636733/robinhood-banking-launch-cash-deliveries] * Kalshi sues Nevada and New Jersey regulators | Esports Insider [https://esportsinsider.com/2025/04/kalshi-sues-nevada-new-jersey-regulators-cease-and-desist] * Kalshi CEO: ‘State law doesn’t really apply’ to us | TechCrunch [https://techcrunch.com/2025/04/09/kalshi-ceo-state-law-doesnt-really-apply-to-us/] * Robinhood debuts a sports gambling hub | Verge [https://www.theverge.com/news/631414/robinhood-is-getting-into] * The SEC has ended its investigation into Robinhood crypto | Verge [https://www.theverge.com/cryptocurrency/618286/robinhood-announces-the-sec-has-ended-its-investigation-into-robinhood-crypto] * Robinhood admits it’s just a gambling app | Verge [https://www.theverge.com/2024/10/28/24281883/robinhood-presidential-betting] * Massachusetts regulator subpoenas Robinhood over sports betting | CNN [https://www.cnn.com/2025/03/24/business/regulators-probe-robinhood-prediction-markets-march-madness/index.html] Verge Transcript [https://www.theverge.com/decoder-podcast-with-nilay-patel/645822/robinhood-ceo-vlad-tenev] Credits: Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Our producers are Kate Cox and Nick Statt. Our editor is Ursa Wright.  The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices [https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices]