Hard Fork

This week, iPhone users started to feel the impact of a stern court order against Apple that requires the company to stop collecting a commission on some app sales. We break down what this means for apps like Kindle and Spotify and why the judge suggested that Apple and a top executive should be investigated for criminal contempt. Then, Karen Hao joins us to discuss her new book about OpenAI and explain why she believes the benefits of using the company’s tools do not outweigh the moral costs. And finally, Casey introduces Kevin to a strange new universe of A.I. slop that’s racking up millions of likes on TikTok. Guest: * Karen Hao [https://karendhao.com/], Author of “Empire of AI” Additional Reading: * Judge Rebukes Apple and Orders It to Loosen Grip on App Store [https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/30/technology/apple-epic-app-store-ruling.html] * Brain Rot Comes for Italy [https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/30/style/italian-brain-rot-ballerina-cappuccina.html]   We want to hear from you. Email us at hardfork@nytimes.com [hardfork@nytimes.com]. Find “Hard Fork” on YouTube [https://www.youtube.com/hardfork] and TikTok [https://www.tiktok.com/@hardfork]. Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts [http://nytimes.com/podcasts] or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

This week we dig into the ways chatbots are starting to manipulate us, including ChatGPT’s sycophantic update, Meta’s digital companionship turn and a secret experiment run on Reddit users. Then Kevin reports back from the unveiling of a new eye-scanning orb. And finally, we’re joined by PJ Vogt for a brand-new segment called Group Chat Chat. Tickets to “Hard Fork Live” on June 24 are sold out. You can join the wait list here [https://www.nytimes.com/events/hardforklive] to be alerted if additional tickets become available. Guest: * PJ Vogt, host of the podcast “Search Engine [https://www.searchengine.show/]” Additional Reading: * Meta’s ‘Digital Companions’ Will Talk Sex With Users — Even Children [https://www.wsj.com/tech/ai/meta-ai-chatbots-sex-a25311bf] * Reddit Issuing ‘Formal Legal Demands’ Against Researchers Who Conducted Secret A.I. Experiment on Users [https://www.404media.co/reddit-issuing-formal-legal-demands-against-researchers-who-conducted-secret-ai-experiment-on-users/] * The Group Chats That Changed America [https://www.semafor.com/article/04/27/2025/the-group-chats-that-changed-america] * The Ice Bucket Challenge Worked. Why Not Try It Again? [https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/22/style/ice-bucket-challenge-mental-health.html] We want to hear from you. Email us at hardfork@nytimes.com [hardfork@nytimes.com]. Find “Hard Fork” on YouTube [https://www.youtube.com/hardfork]and TikTok. [https://www.tiktok.com/@hardfork] Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts [http://nytimes.com/podcasts] or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

This week, with big developments in two antitrust cases against Google, we discuss how the company may be forced to change its business. Then we’re joined by the journalist Mark Yarm to discuss his recent visit to an underwater home for his article about techno-utopians who want to colonize the ocean. And finally, it’s tool time! We’ll tell you about our latest experiments with ChatGPT’s o3, Casey’s newest journaling practice and Kevin’s continued battle to get to inbox zero. Tickets to Hard Fork live [https://www.nytimes.com/events/hardforklive] are on sale! See us June 24 at SFJAZZ. Guest: * Mark Yarm [https://markyarm.journoportfolio.com/about-me/], an executive editor at PCMag and the author of “Everybody Loves Our Town: An Oral History of Grunge.” Additional Reading: * Google May Be on the Brink of a Breakup [https://www.platformer.news/google-antitrust-search-advertising-remedies/] * Google Is Illegally Monopolizing Online Advertising Tech, Judge Rules [https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/17/technology/google-ad-tech-antitrust-ruling.html] * The Techno-Utopians Who Want to Colonize the Sea [https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/15/magazine/seasteading-libertarian-ocean-living.html]   We want to hear from you. Email us at hardfork@nytimes.com [hardfork@nytimes.com]. Find “Hard Fork” on YouTube [https://www.youtube.com/hardfork] and TikTok [https://www.tiktok.com/@hardfork]. Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts [http://nytimes.com/podcasts] or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

This week Meta is on trial, in a landmark case over whether it illegally snuffed out competition when it acquired Instagram and WhatsApp. We discuss some of the most surprising revelations from old email messages made public as evidence in the case, and explain why we think the F.T.C.’s argument has gotten weaker in the years since the lawsuit was filed. Then we hear from Princeton computer scientist Arvind Narayanan on why he believes it will take decades, not years, for A.I. to transform society in the ways the big A.I. labs predict. And finally, what do dolphins, Katy Perry and A1 steak sauce have in common? They’re all important characters in our latest round of HatGPT.   Tickets to Hard Fork live [https://www.nytimes.com/events/hardforklive] are on sale now! See us June 24 at SFJAZZ.   Guest: * Arvind Narayanan [https://www.cs.princeton.edu/~arvindn/], director of the Center for Information Technology at Princeton and co-author of “AI Snake Oil: What Artificial Intelligence Can Do, What it Can’t, and How to Tell the Difference.”   Additional Reading: * What if Mark Zuckerberg Had Not Bought Instagram and WhatsApp? [https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/14/technology/mark-zuckerberg-facebook-instagram-whatsapp.html] * AI as Normal Technology [https://knightcolumbia.org/content/ai-as-normal-technology] * One Giant Stunt for Womankind [https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/14/arts/blue-origin-lauren-sanchez-katy-perry.html]   We want to hear from you. Email us at hardfork@nytimes.com [hardfork@nytimes.com]. Find “Hard Fork” on YouTube [https://www.youtube.com/hardfork] and TikTok [https://www.tiktok.com/@hardfork]. Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts [http://nytimes.com/podcasts] or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

This week, with the tech world in chaos over President Trump’s tariffs, we look at how four specific companies are navigating the new day-to-day reality. Then, the A.I. researcher Daniel Kokotajlo returns to the show to discuss a new set of predictions for how artificial intelligence could transform the world in just the next few years and how we avoid the most dystopian outcomes. Finally, we explore whether Meta cheated on an important A.I. benchmark with its new Llama model.   Guest: * Daniel Kokotajlo, executive director of the AI Futures Project   Additional Reading:  * Inside Trump’s Reversal on Tariffs: From ‘Be Cool!’ to ‘Getting Yippy’ [https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/09/us/politics/trump-tariff-pause-be-cool.html] * A.I. 2027 [https://ai-2027.com/] * Meta Gets Rebuked Over Benchmark Gaming [https://www.platformer.news/meta-lmarena-benchmark-gaming-rebuke/]   We want to hear from you. Email us at hardfork@nytimes.com [hardfork@nytimes.com]. Find “Hard Fork” on YouTube [https://www.youtube.com/hardfork] and TikTok [https://www.tiktok.com/@hardfork]. Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts [http://nytimes.com/podcasts] or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.