Nuance: Being Faithful in the Public Square

Leading Worship for Workers with Dr. Matthew Kaemingk & Kathryn Roelofs

Why do Christians often gather in the sanctuary on Sunday morning and hear almost nothing about the work that consumes their entire week? Public theologian Dr. Matthew Kaemingk and Katie Roelofs join host Case Thorpe to discuss bridging the gap between Sunday liturgy and Monday labor. Dr. Kaemingk and Rev. Roelofs outline the practical steps of vocationally conversant worship found in their new book, Leading Worship for Workers: How to Design Liturgies for All of Life. They explain that genuine worship is not about leaving daily stress at the church door. Instead, it requires bringing the realities of your job directly to God, which includes the joys, the laments, and the hard questions. The discussion covers: 🎓 Why the traditional training of pastors and worship leaders often leaves them unequipped to engage with the complex working lives of their congregations. 🗣️ The crucial difference between treating worship as an individualistic performance and viewing it as a genuine dialogue between God and His people. 📋 How to perform a "vocational audit" of your congregation to better understand the faces and daily realities of the workers in your pews. 🛠️ Practical tools for integrating work into worship. This involves worker testimonies, specific industry prayers, and navigating the awkwardness of unpolished speakers. 🧟 The "zombie ritual" of the modern offering plate and creative ways to revive it. Suggestions include offering "trumpets, ashes, and tears" or practicing vocational silence. 🏺 Real-world examples of successful integration. One church in Manitoba crafted communion chalices from native soil etched with congregational vocations. This is a conversation for pastors, worship leaders, and every Christian who wants to navigate their daily vocation as an act of worship and let the sanctuary shape how they live their daily lives. 📚 Episode Resources * Leading Worship for Workers: How to Design Liturgies for All of Life by Matthew Kaemingk and Kathryn Roelofs - https://www.amazon.com/dp/1540969843 * Work and Worship: Reconnecting Our Labor and Liturgy by Matthew Kaemingk and Cory Willson - https://www.amazon.com/dp/1540961982 * Worship for Workers Initiative - worshipforworkers.com * The Porter's Gate - portersgateworship.com #faithandwork #publictheology #publicsquare Nuance is a podcast of The Collaborative where we wrestle together about living our Christian faith in the public square. Nuance invites Christians to pursue the cultural and economic renewal by living out faith through work every facet of public life, including work, political engagement, the arts, philanthropy, and more.  Each episode, Dr. Case Thorp hosts conversations with Christian thinkers and leaders at the forefront of some of today's most pressing issues around living a public faith. Learn more at wecolabor.com Timestamps 0:00 Bringing Your Daily Work to God 0:26 Introducing Dr. Matthew Kaemingk & Rev. Katie Roelofs 3:17 The Origin of the Worship for Workers Initiative 4:02 Why We Should Bring Workplace Stress into Sunday Worship 5:25 Designing Liturgy for Federal Employees in Washington D.C. 7:44 Turning Theology of Work into Practical Church Resources 11:00 Why Pastors Avoid Talking About Work During Church Services 14:02 How to Perform a Vocational Audit of Your Congregation 15:08 Incorporating Worker Testimonies and Industry Prayers 17:42 Denominational Approaches: Calvinism, Pentecostalism, and Vocation 22:18 Individualism, Forced Positivity, and the Church's "Allergy to Honesty" 25:17 A Biblical Theology of Vocation: From Adam and Eve to Modern Workers 28:13 Using Sunday Liturgy for Daily Personal Devotions 30:04 Redefining Liturgy as the "Work of the People" 34:04 Real-World Integration: Native Soil Chalices in Manitoba 35:08 Reviving the "Zombie Ritual" of the Modern Offering Plate 37:04 Offering Trumpets, Ashes, and Tears in a Digital Age 39:03 Concluding Thoughts

Faith in the Administrative State? Why Bureaucracy Diminishes the Shared Good with GianCarlo Canaparo

How does the administrative state impact our ability to govern ourselves? The founders built a constitutional system designed to limit concentrated power. Today, federal agencies and unelected bureaucrats govern much of our daily lives. Constitutional expert GianCarlo Canaparo returns to Nuance to explain the complexities of federal agencies, regulatory crimes, and the recent overturning of Chevron deference. Case and GianCarlo discuss how massive government bureaucracies can stifle local ministry, limit our ability to practice virtue, and rob citizens of the shared good that comes from participating in self-governance. 🔑 Key Topics Covered in This Episode: 🏛️ How Executive Agencies Make Laws. Federal agencies often create and enforce rules outside the traditional legislative process envisioned by the founders. ⚖️ What the End of Chevron Deference Means. The Supreme Court recently shifted precedent so that judges, not agencies, decide what ambiguous laws actually mean. 🤝 Why Participating in Local Government Matters. The founders believed that getting involved in local civic institutions makes us better people and multiplies the shared good. 🛑 How Government Regulations Hurt Local Charities. Extreme federal regulations can shut down small ministries and prevent Christians from personally caring for their neighbors. 🎂 Can the Government Force You to Violate Your Faith? The Masterpiece Cakeshop case shows how believers can navigate a complicated legal landscape to protect their religious freedom. 📚 Episode Resources GianCarlo Canaparo's Publications at the Heritage Foundation: heritage.org/staff/giancarlo-canaparo  GianCarlo Canaparo's Legal Scholarship: ssrn.com Timestamps 0:00 Why True Freedom Requires the Choice to Do Wrong  0:25 The Purpose of Constitutional Checks and Balances  3:05 Introducing Constitutional Expert GianCarlo Canaparo  4:18 Counting the Unknown Number of Federal Crimes  6:55 Defining the Administrative State  8:01 How the Administrative State Bypasses the US Constitution  10:54 How a Single Wheat Farmer Radically Expanded Federal Power  14:26 Inside the Hidden Courts Run by Executive Branch Agencies  15:47 The Best Argument in Favor of the Administrative State  17:46 Chevron Deference and Who Actually Decides the Law  21:44 Why Participating in Local Government is Good for Your Soul  26:47 Practical Ways to Safely Downsize the Administrative State  28:32 Why Christians Should Care About the Size of the Government  31:02 How Excessive Government Regulations Hurt Local Ministries  33:14 Why True Virtue Requires Freedom from the Administrative State  36:23 How Christians Can Protect Their Faith in the Public Square  37:12 Masterpiece Cakeshop and the Fight for Religious Freedom  42:02 Using Prudence to Restructure the Power of Federal Agencies  44:14 Why the President Shouldn't Have the Power to Make Laws  46:37 A Christian Framework for Justice and Civic Duty

Created Equal: Recovering the Founders' Vision for America with GianCarlo Canaparo

What did the founders mean by "all men are created equal" in the Declaration of Independence? Many Americans recognize a few famous lines from 1776, but few understand the deep Christian worldview that shaped our nation's founding document. In this episode of Nuance, host Case Thorp sits down with constitutional expert and Department of Justice Deputy Assistant Attorney General GianCarlo Canaparo. They explore the enduring meaning of the Declaration of Independence. They discuss why human rights come from a Creator rather than a government. Giancarlo also unpacks the lost virtue of prudence and explains why the founders were willing to sacrifice everything for the sake of self-government. 🔑 Key Topics Covered in This Episode: 📜 Why the Declaration is an Apple of Gold: Abraham Lincoln viewed the Declaration as the moral vision and the Constitution as the operational frame. ⚖️ What "Created Equal" Actually Means: The founders believed human equality meant no one has a special right to rule over another person without consent. 🧠 Why We Need the Virtue of Prudence Today: Prudence is the ability to navigate complex circumstances toward noble goals, a virtue modern society has largely forgotten. 🏛️ Was the American Founding a Theocracy? The founders did not want a theocracy. They relied on biblical and classical roots to design a system for a moral and religious people. 📚 Episode Resources GianCarlo Canaparo's Publications at the Heritage Foundation: heritage.org/staff/giancarlo-canaparo  GianCarlo Canaparo's Legal Scholarship: ssrn.com Timestamps 0:00 The Enduring Meaning of the Declaration of Independence  1:26 Meet Constitutional Expert GianCarlo Canaparo 3:52 GianCarlo's Inspiration for Studying the US Constitution 5:22 The Crucial Difference Between Patriotism and Christian Nationalism 6:44 Understanding What "Created Equal" Actually Meant in 1776 10:00 How the Supreme Court Views the Declaration of Independence 13:56 Rights Given by God vs. Rights Given by Government 16:22 The True Meaning of Human Equality in the American Founding 18:50 Self-Government as a Fundamental Human Right 20:54 What the Founding Fathers Would Think of America Today 23:57 Why the Declaration of Independence Matters to Christians 25:16 Debunking the Myth of a Christian Theocracy at the Founding 29:01 The Lost Virtue of Prudence Explained 31:34 How the Modern Obsession with Comfort Ruins Civic Virtue 34:02 The Need for a Revival of American Self-Government 36:14 The Incredible Sacrifices Made by the Signers of 1776

Faith Under Pressure: Loving Others in an Angry World | Dr. Case Thorp

You believe faith belongs in the public square, and you've tried to be a faithful presence, but you are simply tired. What happens when your neighbors aren't interested in connecting, or your workplace treats your convictions as a liability?   Facing a culture that is increasingly hostile to faith can be exhausting, tempting many to adopt a posture of grievance or to withdraw into their comfortable homes.   In this episode of Nuance, regular host Case Thorp takes the hot seat as guest host Katie Shook asks the hard questions about faith under pressure. Case gets honest about the real cost of showing up in the public square, sharing a personal story about a neighborhood dispute over backyard chickens that tested his commitment to loving his neighbors. They unpack the difference between engaging culture with grace versus angrily fighting back, the temptation to make faith overly palatable, and why creating new things is a better response than endless critique.   From finding hope in the longevity of institutions to learning how to focus on the micro when national issues feel overwhelming, Case and Katie provide a practical roadmap for staying grounded and kind in an angry world.   🔑 Key Topics Covered in This Episode: 🐔 The Cost of Presence: A firsthand look at what it costs to stay engaged, featuring a story about zoning laws, backyard chickens, and maintaining a Christian witness when neighbors push back.   🎨 Creating vs. Critiquing: Why Christians should focus on creating art, beauty, and positive environments rather than just sitting back and complaining about cultural shifts.   🏛️ The Power of Institutions: Exploring why society has lost trust in organizations, and why investing in healthy, long-lasting institutions is still crucial for stability.   🔬 Focusing on the Micro: Practical encouragement to stop stressing over massive national headlines and start serving the people directly in front of you.  🚪 Knowing When to Step Back: How to exercise wisdom and discernment when someone isn't ready for a deeper conversation, and learning to trust God's timing.  For more resources, including ways to get involved with The Collaborative, visit wecolabor.com Timestamps 0:00 Do You Know Your Neighbors? 0:21 Case Thorp Takes the Hot Seat  2:54 Exploring Faith In The Public Square  3:17 The Real Cost Of Faithful Presence  4:06 Navigating Zoning Laws and Backyard Chickens  9:09 Maintaining Righteousness During Conflict  10:21 When Christians Should Withdraw From Culture  11:58 Staying Kind In A Tacky Culture  14:09 Assessing Cultural Hostility Toward Faith  16:47 Avoiding a Posture of Grievance  18:13 The Danger of Making Faith Too Palatable  19:50 Creating New Culture Instead of Critiquing  21:47 Escaping The Comfort of Netflix Homes  25:10 Handling People Who Reject You  28:58 Why Society Needs Long Term Institutions  32:25 Knowing When To Shut Down Failing Institutions  35:54 Finding Real Rest When You Feel Burned Out  38:26 Solving Overwhelm By Focusing on the Micro  40:30 The Powerful Lessons of Staying in One Place  43:21 The Biggest Fear for the Modern Church  44:43 Final Thoughts

Deconstruction, Spiritual Lament, & the Dark Night of the Soul with Catherine McNeil & Jason Hague

What happens when the foundational beliefs of your faith meet deep personal suffering? For many believers, major life wounds, like childhood church hurt or the loss of a close friend, make a good and powerful God feel distant. When the anchor meant to hold you steady seems to give way, the spiritual crisis makes all other suffering worse. In this episode of Nuance, host Case Thorp welcomes back Catherine McNiel and Jason Hague, co-authors of Mid-Faith Crisis, to discuss the personal origin stories behind their book. Catherine shares the difficult experience of being shunned by her church family at twelve years old. Jason discusses the grief of his children's severe health diagnoses and the loss of a close friend, leaving him preaching sermons he was not sure he believed. Case also shares about trusting God's providence during his wife's battle with cancer and a recent stroke. Catherine and Jason offer practical steps for surviving dark spiritual valleys, like practicing honest lament and using contemplative prayer to calm the nervous system. They explain how taking your anger directly to God and finding a safe community can lead to a mature faith. 🔑 Key Topics Covered in This Episode: * 🌪️ The Compounding Crisis: A faith crisis makes health or vocational struggles much harder. We discuss what it feels like when your spiritual anchor is lost. * 💔 The Broken Contract: The unique struggle of believing in a good and powerful God when circumstances are painful. * 🐑 The Seeking Shepherd: Catherine's experience of trusting God's slow providence and moving from decades of darkness into new spiritual life. * 🗣️ The Power of Lament: Hiding our anger creates distance from God. We look at why bringing your frustration to the Lord is a biblical practice. * 🧘 Contemplative Healing: Using the Prayer of Examen and breath prayers to soothe spiritual trauma and remember what we already believe. 📚 Episode Resources: * Mid-Faith Crisis: Finding a Path Through Doubt, Disillusionment, and Dead Ends by Catherine McNiel and Jason Hague: https://www.ivpress.com/mid-faith-crisis * Catherine McNiel's website: https://catherinemcniel.com/ * Jason Hague's website: https://jasonhague.com * InterVarsity Press: https://www.ivpress.com/ Timestamps: 0:00 The Challenge of a Good God  0:35 The Backstory of "Mid-Faith Crisis"  2:00 Catherine's Story: Enduring Church Hurt at Age 12  5:28 Jason's Story: Adulthood, Grief, and Unanswered Prayers  7:44 Why Faith Crises Compound All Other Suffering  12:00 Finding God as the Seeking Shepherd  14:48 Trusting God's Providence Through Severe Health Trials  17:09 Advice for Those Currently in a Faith Crisis  18:59 The Power of Honest Lament  23:05 Contemplative Practices and the Prayer of Examen  27:11 Advice for the Next Generation: Don't Walk Alone  28:54 Concluding Thoughts