Startups For the Rest of Us

Episode 807 | The "Core Four" SaaS Skills and Knowing When You Should Find a Co-founder (A Rob Solo Adventure)

Is hiring a sales and marketing co-founder the secret sauce for technical SaaS founders? In this solo episode, Rob Walling tackles a fresh batch of listener questions, starting with one of the most common dilemmas for technical founders: should you hire a sales and marketing co-founder or go it alone? He introduces his “Core Four” mental model, the essential skills every SaaS team needs early on, and shares insights on dealing with enterprise clients who keep moving the goalposts, handling a flood of non-ICP users, and a heartfelt message from a listener who just exited their startup. Want to get your question answered? Drop it here. [https://www.startupsfortherestofus.com/contact] Episode Sponsor: Are you looking to hire world-class engineering talent without the headache? You should check out today’s sponsor, G2i [https://www.g2i.co/microconf]. They give you access to over 8,000 pre-vetted developers, no AI-generated resumes, no time wasters, just experienced engineers with at least five years of proven results. G2i handles the vetting for you, including customized live technical interviews so you can see how a candidate would actually work with your team. Trusted by companies like Meta, Microsoft, and Shopmonkey, and especially helpful for first-time founders who need to get hiring right the first time. As a listener, you’ll get a 7-day free trial plus $1,500 off your first invoice when you mention this podcast. Head over to https://www.g2i.co/microconf [https://www.g2i.co/microconf]  to get started. TOPICS WE COVER:  * (3:11) – Should you find a co-founder for sales and marketing? * (5:29) – What are the Core Four SaaS Skills? * (11:41) – Can you succeed without mastering all four, or should you outsource? * (16:39) – Why sales-led growth might outperform self-serve SaaS * (21:48) – Dealing with big companies who change your contract terms * (27:06) – What to do with thousands of unqualified signups LINKS FROM THE SHOW:  * Discretion Capital – M&A for B2B SaaS [https://discretioncapital.com] * Exit Strategy [https://exitstrategybook.com]by Sherry & Rob Walling  * MicroConf [https://microconf.com/connect]- SaaS Community * TinySeed [https://tinyseed.com/] - SaaS Institute If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question [https://www.startupsfortherestofus.com/contact] for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/startups-for-the-rest-of-us/id366931951] | Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/2Ww2e4JNO2cfxWC2ImR7DJ]

Episode 806 | Bootstrapping Missive to $8M ARR Over 10 Years

Can a small team really bootstrap to $8M ARR in a crowded SaaS market? In this episode, Rob Walling chats with Philippe Lehoux about how he and his co-founders bootstrapped Missive, a collaborative email and team inbox tool. They deep dive into landing early customers, unique horizontal positioning, content-driven growth, enterprise sales, and how to compete with VC-backed competition.  Episode Sponsor: Are you a non-technical founder with solid revenue and real traction, but your technology is holding you back? You should check out today's sponsor, Designli [https://designli.co/fortherestofus]. They specialize in helping founders like you who are stuck with messy code, unclear roadmaps, or a dev team that just doesn’t get it. And for listeners of the pod, Designli is offering their Impact Week completely free. That’s a one-week, no-obligation audit where their team dives into your code, your design system, and your product roadmap to show you exactly what’s working, what’s broken, and what needs to happen next. If it’s a fit, you can move on to SolutionLab, a three-week sprint where Designli takes over your codebase and architects a real roadmap for growth, led by a full-time, cross-functional team. If your tech is the bottleneck to your next stage of growth, check them out at https://designli.co/fortherestofus [https://designli.co/fortherestofus].  TOPICS WE COVER:  * (2:05) – Missive’s $8M ARR journey and email pivot * (6:02) – Early idea and first customers * (11:16) – Unique positioning: horizontal vs. vertical * (13:41) – How they prioritize features * (15:39) – Why they stayed bootstrapped and decline funding * (20:25) – Content strategy and “vs” pages * (21:39) – Affiliate program driving 30% of growth * (25:24) – Challenges and benefits of being horizontal * (30:28) – Enterprise sales and pricing * (32:06) – Scaling with SOC 2 compliance LINKS FROM THE SHOW:  * SaaS Institute  [https://tinyseed.com/institute] * MicroConf YouTube channel [https://www.youtube.com/microconf] * Missive [https://missiveapp.com/] * Philippe Lehoux | LinkedIn [https://www.linkedin.com/in/plehoux/] * Philippe Lehoux (@plehoux) | X [https://x.com/plehoux] If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question [https://www.startupsfortherestofus.com/contact] for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/startups-for-the-rest-of-us/id366931951] | Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/2Ww2e4JNO2cfxWC2ImR7DJ]

Episode 805 | Gatekeeping vs. Paying Dues, Raw Material, and Surrounding Yourself with the Right People (A Rob Solo Adventure)

How much does your startup idea matter compared to your execution? In this solo episode, Rob Walling covers several founder-focused topics: the difference between gatekeeping and paying your dues, why raw material beats polish, and why successful people don't mind others winning. He also shares a listener's exit story, discusses optimism in founder communities, and talks about the mix of luck, skill, and hard work needed to build something that lasts. Episode Sponsor: AI is transforming how people discover brands and Ahrefs [https://ahrefs.com/] is helping SaaS companies stay ahead. They’ve just launched Brand Radar, a new tool that lets you track your visibility in AI platforms like ChatGPT, Perplexity, and Google’s AI Overviews. See how you stack up against competitors, monitor reputation, and build authority across search, social, and AI. No more cobbling together tools. Ahrefs brings it all into one powerful SaaS marketing platform, backed by 15+ years of real-world web data and marketing-savvy AI. Try it free at ahrefs.com/awt [http://ahrefs.com/awt].  TOPICS WE COVER:  * (2:00) – Gatekeeping vs. Paying dues as a new founder * (9:56) – How “raw material” transforms into high-value skills (and startups) * (16:36) – A bootstrapped listener shares a quiet, life-changing exit * (18:17) – People who are winning don’t mind if others win too * (20:09) – The critical importance of who you surround yourself with LINKS FROM THE SHOW:  * MicroConf Remote [https://microconf.com/remote] - Nov 5th, 2025 | Use promo code STARTUPS15 for $15 off your ticket. * The SaaS Playbook [https://saasplaybook.com/] * 1000-Gram Iron Bar Analogy [https://www.facebook.com/groups/210479471986214/posts/648168898217267/]  If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question [https://www.startupsfortherestofus.com/contact] for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/startups-for-the-rest-of-us/id366931951] | Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/2Ww2e4JNO2cfxWC2ImR7DJ]

Episode 804 | Positioning, Inventing a Category, Marketing Globally, and More Listener Questions (A Rob Solo Adventure)

Can bootstrapped founders really invent a new category with AI or is it a trap? In this solo episode, Rob Walling answers a fresh batch of listener questions covering SaaS marketing, global expansion, and strategic positioning. He shares advice on whether inventing a new product category is ever worth it and the nuances of updating your positioning after launch. Want to get your question answered? Drop it here. [https://www.startupsfortherestofus.com/contact]  TOPICS WE COVER:  * (2:53) – Vertical vs. horizontal vs. orthogonal positioning as a bootstrapper * (12:37) – Is AI making it easier to create a new category? * (21:19) – How to break through mental blocks and actually launch * (28:36) – Local vs. global marketing for SaaS * (33:01) – Self-driving cars: Rob’s past prediction and what reverse statistics can teach founders LINKS FROM THE SHOW:  * MicroConf Remote [https://microconf.com/remote] - Nov 5th, 2025 | Use promo code STARTUPS15 for 15% off your ticket. * TinySeed [https://tinyseed.com/program] - SaaS accelerator for ambitious B2B founders * Invest in TinySeed [https://tinyseed.com/invest]  * Episode 783 | Bootstrapping ScrapingBee to $5M ARR and an 8-Figure Exit [https://www.startupsfortherestofus.com/episodes/episode-783-bootstrapping-scrapingbee-to-5m-arr-and-an-8-figure-exit] * Episode 728 | Bootstrapping Gymdesk to a More Than $32.5M Exit [https://www.startupsfortherestofus.com/episodes/episode-728-bootstrapping-gymdesk-to-a-more-than-32-5m-exit] If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question [https://www.startupsfortherestofus.com/contact] for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/startups-for-the-rest-of-us/id366931951] | Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/2Ww2e4JNO2cfxWC2ImR7DJ]

Episode 803 | 8 Key Takeaways from MicroConf Europe 2025

What's it really like to attend MicroConf? In this episode, Rob Walling and Laura Sprinkle, founder of Rootabl, recap MicroConf Europe 2025 in Istanbul. They discuss the MicroConf vibe, standout talks on AI, affiliate marketing, and SaaS growth, as well as the value of networking and connecting while getting outside the conference room.   TOPICS WE COVER:  * (5:01) – The friendly, diverse MicroConf crowd * (8:06) – Impressions on Istanbul * (9:24) – Marc Thomas on lifecycle marketing * (11:34) – Michelle Hansen & John Knox on networking  * (13:04) – MicroConf Excursions * (16:45) – Einar Volset on SaaS Buyers * (20:27) – Rob’s AI talk * (23:27) – Laura’s talk about affiliate programs * (24:47) – Jesse Schoberg on ranking in ChatGPT and Google's AI * (26:31) – Attendee-Led Workshops * (27:58) – Kevin Sahin’s unfiltered lessons scaling to $2M * (31:12) – James Mooring’s journey to $2M ARR LINKS FROM THE SHOW:  * Get your Ticket for MicroConf [https://microconf.com/us-flagship] - Portland, Oregon, on April 12 -14, 2026 | Use promo code ROB50 for $50 off your ticket. * TinySeed [https://tinyseed.com/program] * Join MicroConf Connect [https://microconf.com/connect] * Deploy Empathy by Michelle Hansen [https://deployempathy.com/] * The Hard Thing About Hard Things by Ben Horowitz [https://www.amazon.com/-/es/Por-Horowitz-dif%C3%ADcil-cosas-duras/dp/0062273205/ref=sr_1_1?adgrpid=100750256294&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.0j4xaXwGlf6RMGEnZUYPn3_Zr64GsoeZZ4e1UdaSwDi8Sb7jOonqixrTDLtWFGBKICbZyzTaZL5xmY7cpn2FTdpKFGRGZGpzeVvog6fG5RWnk5uyVeNIMN724Pxurr31JEqhHecXZioxDGP9295Iaj-Nrsa2Ser-FvO4T6JCEWqqJhG6DTcZ7kW93gRoWeO6XssYrQc88757RcKN15_qQW1DFY_gqcZKLmvHBSc0pNo.DLHKBg3x_Sf9-iDjhqKY_im4DraW7d-Tk-Tuc7Y4zG4&dib_tag=se&hvadid=602463923227&hvdev=c&hvlocphy=9215196&hvnetw=g&hvqmt=e&hvrand=12999553132331658920&hvtargid=kwd-81611274449&hydadcr=456_1015033769&keywords=the+hard+thing+about+hard+things&mcid=67622a4530e032beacb38f3218bf8b2d&qid=1760455530&sr=8-1] * There’s ONLY 5 Ways to Use AI in SaaS (prove me wrong) [https://youtu.be/ABnIUv7G9IA] * Rob Walling (@robwalling) | X [https://x.com/robwalling] * Rootabl [https://rootabl.com/] * Laura Sprinkle | LinkedIn [https://www.linkedin.com/in/imlaurasprinkle/] * Laura Sprinkle (@imlaurasprinkle) | X [https://x.com/imlaurasprinkle] If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question [https://www.startupsfortherestofus.com/contact] for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes [https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/startups-for-the-rest-of-us/id366931951] | Spotify [https://open.spotify.com/show/2Ww2e4JNO2cfxWC2ImR7DJ]