The Charlene Gisele Show

How Storytelling Can Boost Your Career, Confidence & Leader

What does it really take to walk away from everything you know and build something entirely new? In this conversation, Preethi Nair, bestselling author and founder of storytelling consultancy Kiss the Frog, shares how rejection, redundancy, and eight months of pretending to go to work led her to self-publish, reinvent herself, and build a career through story. We talk about the alter ego she created to promote her first book, the risks she took to get her work noticed, and how that journey eventually led to literary success. Preethi also shares the story behind Unravelling, why she turned down a traditional publishing deal, and how the project grew into a one-woman West End show where she performed 22 characters despite never acting before. This episode is about reinvention, courage, identity, and why storytelling matters not just in books, but in leadership, business, and the way we shape our own lives. Timestamps 00:00 Eight months in a suit: pretending to go to work after redundancy 01:49 Why Preethi became a management consultant instead of a writer 04:22 The day her leaving came and what happened next 06:17 Creating Prue: designing a fearless alter ego from scratch 08:39 Pitching journalists as Prue and stacking eight months of press coverage 17:28 The petrol crisis, a stranger's cottage in Yorkshire, and starting again 24:49 Turning down a publisher deal to self-publish on her own terms 28:24 Rehearsing 22 characters for 18 months to perform in London's West End 36:18 How storytelling became a strategic tool for leaders in banking and law 44:29 Why story is 22 times more memorable than data 49:01 How to find your theme and structure a story that lands 58:36 The one misconception about storytelling Preethi wants to correct What We Cover * Preethi’s journey from rejection and redundancy to self-publishing success * The alter ego she created to promote her book and build confidence * What it looked like to keep going while pretending everything was fine * How she turned creative vision into strategy and action * Why she chose to walk away from a traditional publishing deal * What the Meisner technique taught her about honest communication and presence * How storytelling became a strategic business tool for senior leaders in banking and law * What performing 22 characters taught her about presence and identity * The connection between storytelling, self-belief, and reinvention * Why storytelling matters in leadership, teams, and organizational culture * How leaders can use story to make data more human and memorable Key Takeaways * The story you tell yourself can either keep you stuck or move you forward. * Reinvention often begins before you feel ready or have outside validation. * Confidence can be built through action, even if it starts out borrowed. * Creativity works best when it is paired with strategy and persistence. * Success means more when it reflects your values, not just external approval. * Sometimes the right path means walking away from what once felt like the goal. * Stretching beyond your comfort zone can help you discover your real voice. * Storytelling is not only for authors or performers. It is a powerful leadership skill. * People connect more deeply with meaning and narrative than facts alone. * Great storytelling starts with clarity about the message you want people to remember. Guest Resources * Preethi Nair’s website: https://preethinair.com/ [https://preethinair.com/] * Read Preethi's latest novel Unravelling: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Unravelling-Preethi-Nair/dp/1998997294/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8 [https://www.amazon.co.uk/Unravelling-Preethi-Nair/dp/1998997294/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8] * Connect with Preethi on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/preethi-nair-29471a4/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/preethi-nair-29471a4/] * Connect with Preethi on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/writerwala/ [https://www.instagram.com/writerwala/] Connect With Me 🌍 Website: https://charlenegisele.com [https://charlenegisele.com] 📸 Instagram: https://instagram.com/charlenegisele [https://instagram.com/charlenegisele] 💼 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/charlène-gisèle-bourliout/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/charl%C3%A8ne-gis%C3%A8le-bourliout/] ✉️ Subscribe to my Life Less Burnt Out Newsletter: https://charlenegisele.com/newsletter/ [https://charlenegisele.com/newsletter/]

Staying Calm Amid Uncertainty: Sustain Performance & Reduce Anxiety in a VUCA World

What does it really take to perform at a high level without running yourself into the ground? In this conversation, Steven MacGregor, CEO of the General Counsel Wellbeing Network and Senior Advisor at McKinsey & Company, shares practical insights on sustainable performance, recovery, stress management, and why well-being is not separate from success, but foundational to it. We explore the unique pressures facing senior legal professionals, especially in-house counsel, and discuss how leaders can work more rhythmically, recover more intentionally, and regulate stress before it turns into burnout. Steven also explains how lessons from elite sport can be translated into modern leadership, including what HRV can reveal about stress, the power of breathwork, and how short reset practices can improve decision-making under pressure. The conversation also goes deeper into what it means to stay steady in uncertain times. From intrusive thoughts and 3 a.m. anxiety to dopamine-driven coping habits, gratitude, journaling, and psychological distancing, this episode offers grounded tools for anyone navigating pressure in a demanding world. Timestamps 00:00 Why resetting your nervous system matters 02:36 Steven’s background and how he began working with the legal community 06:27 Why in-house lawyers and GCs face unique pressure 13:16 The biggest well-being challenges facing senior legal leaders 17:45 HRV, recovery, and what executives can learn from elite athletes 20:34 A practical three-minute reset for stress and decision-making 28:42 The physiological sigh and fast nervous system regulation 34:37 Control the controllables during uncertainty and crisis 42:11 What to do when anxiety spikes at 2 or 3 a.m. 48:27 Psychological distancing, gratitude, and reframing difficult experiences What We Cover 1. Sustainable performance and why recovery matters 2. The specific pressures facing GCs and in-house counsel 3. Leadership, workload, and the need for more rhythmic working 4. How athletic training shaped Steven’s approach to performance 5. HRV as a tool for stress awareness and recovery 6. Breathwork, body scans, and quick reset practices 7. The physiological sigh and how to use it in daily life 8. How to respond to uncertainty by focusing on what you can control 9. Coping with intrusive thoughts, rumination, and middle-of-the-night anxiety 10. Gratitude, reframing, and psychological distancing as resilience tools Key Takeaways - Recovery is not a luxury. It is part of sustainable high performance. - Small interventions can create meaningful shifts in stress and focus. - Leaders perform better when they work with rhythm rather than constant intensity. - HRV can help people better understand the relationship between stress and recovery. - Breathwork and short pauses can improve thinking during high-pressure moments. - You feel stronger in uncertainty when you focus on what you can control. - Poor sleep and chronic stress make reactive coping habits more tempting. - Writing worries down can reduce rumination and mental overload. - Support, perspective, and shared vulnerability matter during difficult periods. - Reframing hard experiences can create more resilience, perspective, and gratitude. Guest Resources General Counsel Wellbeing Network: https://www.gcwellbeing.org/ [https://www.gcwellbeing.org/]  Steven’s LinkedIn: https://es.linkedin.com/in/spmacg [https://es.linkedin.com/in/spmacg]  Connect With Me🌍 Website: https://charlenegisele.com [https://charlenegisele.com] 📸 Instagram: https://instagram.com/charlenegisele [https://instagram.com/charlenegisele] 💼 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/charlène-gisèle-bourliout/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/charl%C3%A8ne-gis%C3%A8le-bourliout/] ✉️ Subscribe to my Life Less Burnt Out Newsletter

Leadership Etiquette: How Modern Manners Shape Executive Presence

What does modern etiquette really mean in today’s high-pressure professional world? In this conversation, Alison shares how etiquette goes far beyond table manners and becomes a powerful tool for leadership, executive presence, networking, communication, and self-respect. We explore how to stay composed under pressure, recover after losing your temper, navigate swearing in professional settings, and exit conversations gracefully at networking events. Alison also shares thoughtful advice on appearance, grooming, makeup, professionalism, and how to show up as your most polished and authentic self. From big law to the White House, this episode is full of practical insights for ambitious professionals who want to lead with confidence, kindness, and composure. Timestamps 00:00 Why etiquette matters for leadership 01:29 What modern etiquette really means 02:03 Work etiquette and executive presence 04:01 Anger, composure, and leadership under pressure 08:20 Is swearing always bad etiquette? 13:56 Networking etiquette, cocktails, and canapés 22:47 How to politely exit a conversation 28:32 How to join a group when you’re alone at an event 30:18 Female leadership, femininity, and authenticity 45:33 Lessons from briefing the president and traveling on Air Force One What We Cover * The modern definition of etiquette * Executive presence and workplace perception * Leadership through composure, kindness, and respect * How to recover after losing your temper at work * Swearing and professionalism in office culture * Networking etiquette and how to mingle confidently * Graceful ways to exit or enter conversations * Etiquette around makeup, grooming, and personal style * Authenticity for women in high-powered careers * Lessons on calm, honesty, and perspective from high-stakes environments Key Takeaways * Etiquette is less about perfection and more about kindness, integrity, and respect. * Executive presence is shaped by how you carry yourself, communicate, and treat others. * Composure under pressure is a leadership advantage at every level of an organization. * Owning mistakes clearly and sincerely can strengthen trust and reputation. * Swearing may be common, but restraint often elevates how others perceive you. * Strong networking is built on presence, clarity, and genuine attention. * Authenticity matters more than performing a version of success that is not yours. * Most situations feel urgent, but very few are true emergencies. Perspective changes everything. Guest Resources Alison’s Book about Career: https://elevateetiquette.com/book [https://elevateetiquette.com/book]Alison’s Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/elevateetiquette/?hl=en [https://www.instagram.com/elevateetiquette/?hl=en]Alison’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alison-m-cheperdak-b0215141 [https://www.linkedin.com/in/alison-m-cheperdak-b0215141]Alison’s Website: https://elevateetiquette.com/about [https://elevateetiquette.com/about] Connect With Me🌍 Website: https://charlenegisele.com [https://charlenegisele.com]📸 Instagram: https://instagram.com/charlenegisele [https://instagram.com/charlenegisele]💼 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/charlène-gisèle-bourliout/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/charl%C3%A8ne-gis%C3%A8le-bourliout/]✉️ Subscribe to my Life Less Burnt Out Newsletter

Struggling to Sleep? A Sleep Doctor Explains Burnout, Anxiety & Insomnia

To mark World Sleep Day, we’re diving into one of the most important, and misunderstood, pillars of wellbeing: sleep. Sleep is something we all need, yet for many high-performing professionals it becomes one of the hardest things to achieve. In this episode, I’m joined by sleep physician Dr. Joshua Kovoor to explore the science of insomnia, why high achievers often struggle with sleep, and what actually helps restore a healthy relationship with rest. Drawing from both clinical experience and personal stories of burnout and chronic insomnia, we unpack the hidden mechanisms behind sleepless nights, including sleep anxiety, cortisol dysregulation, sleep erosion, and the pressure to “try harder” to fall asleep. Dr. Kovoor explains why sleep doesn’t respond to effort the way productivity does, and how the very traits that make someone successful can sometimes make sleep harder to access. We also dive into the biology of sleep, including circadian rhythm, sleep pressure, cortisol patterns, REM sleep, and the common habits that quietly sabotage recovery, such as alcohol, late-night work, binge-watching, and digital overstimulation. Most importantly, we explore practical ways to rebuild a healthier relationship with sleep, from wind-down routines and behavioral changes to relaxation techniques and lifestyle adjustments that support the body’s natural sleep systems. If you’ve ever struggled with insomnia, burnout, or racing thoughts at night, this conversation will help you understand what’s really happening in your body, and how to start repairing your sleep in a sustainable way. ⚠️ Disclaimer: The information shared in this episode is for educational purposes only and should not be considered medical advice. Please consult a qualified healthcare professional for personalized medical guidance. Timestamps 0:00 – Introduction 3:15 – Charlene’s personal journey with chronic insomnia and burnout 7:40 – What clinically defines insomnia vs temporary sleep issues 12:20 – Why high performers and lawyers often struggle with sleep 18:30 – The concept of “sleep erosion” and modern productivity culture 26:10 – Circadian rhythm explained: light, cortisol, and biological clocks 36:45 – The “sleep pressure balloon”: how the body builds sleep drive 46:20 – Evening habits that sabotage sleep (alcohol, screens, work stress) 57:50 – Wind-down routines, relaxation techniques, and better sleep habits 1:10:30 – Final insights and how to work with Dr. Joshua Kovoor What we cover, • The difference between acute insomnia and chronic insomnia • Why high achievers often develop sleep problems • How sleep anxiety and effort can worsen insomnia • The science of circadian rhythm and melatonin • What “sleep pressure” is and how it builds throughout the day • Why alcohol and binge-watching disrupt sleep architecture • Practical strategies to rebuild a healthy relationship with sleep Key Takeaway • Sleep cannot be forced, it emerges when effort is reduced. • Chronic insomnia often develops after prolonged sleep deprivation. • Circadian rhythm and sleep pressure work together to regulate sleep. • Anxiety and stress hormones like cortisol can disrupt sleep onset. • Alcohol may sedate initially but fragments REM sleep. • Consistent wind-down routines help the brain transition into sleep. • Small behavioral changes can dramatically improve sleep quality. • Understanding sleep biology empowers better recovery and performance. Dr. Joshua Kovoor Website: joshuakovoor.com [http://joshuakovoor.com] LinkedIn: https://au.linkedin.com/in/joshua-kovoor-166942225 [https://au.linkedin.com/in/joshua-kovoor-166942225] 🌍 Website: https://charlenegisele.com [https://charlenegisele.com] 📸 Instagram: https://instagram.com/charlenegisele [https://instagram.com/charlenegisele] 💼 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/charlène-gisèle-bourliout/ [https://www.linkedin.com/in/charl%C3%A8ne-gis%C3%A8le-bourliout/] ✉️ Subscribe to my Life Less Burnt Out Newsletter [https://charlenegisele.com/newsletter/] Struggling to fall asleep? 🌙Listen to Guided Sleep Meditation and gently drift into deep sleep. [https://charlenegisele.com/podcast/guided-sleep-meditation-a-relaxing-walk-through-meadows-and-moonlight/] If this episode resonated with you, share it with someone navigating burnout, insomnia, or high-pressure careers.

Women in Law: Partnership & Motherhood: How to Succeed in Law & Life

In this International Women’s Day special, we’re celebrating leadership, resilience, and the realities of building a high-performing career while raising a family.In this episode, I’m joined by Olivia Ngan, partner at Sidley Austin in Hong Kong, to talk about navigating motherhood, ambition, and leadership in one of the world’s most demanding professions.Olivia’s story is remarkable. She had three pregnancies and three promotions, including a promotion to counsel after returning from maternity leave with four children under five. Throughout our conversation, she shares how resilience, strong support networks, and a positive mindset helped her navigate high-stakes deals, family responsibilities, and leadership at a global law firm.We talk about why work-life balance is often unrealistic, and why work-life integration or “fusion” is a more accurate way to think about modern leadership and family life. Olivia also shares her non-negotiables for wellbeing, how she maintains high performance under pressure, and the mindset shifts that help her reframe challenges rather than being overwhelmed by them.This conversation is a powerful reminder, especially on International Women’s Day, that leadership doesn’t have one path, and that ambition, family, and resilience can coexist.If you’re a lawyer, executive, founder, or working parent navigating career growth and family life, this episode offers a refreshing perspective on priorities, resilience, and redefining success on your own terms.Timestamps0:00 – Introduction2:01 – Olivia’s international career journey into law5:20 – Becoming a mother while building a demanding legal career10:02 – Four kids under five: navigating family and promotions15:30 – Why motherhood doesn’t have to limit career progression17:07 – Non-negotiables for wellbeing, parenting, and leadership22:28 – Leadership advice for women pursuing partnership29:08 – Work-life balance vs work-life integration36:12 – Cultural differences across global legal careers47:45 – Resilience: failing, standing up, and growing strongerWhat We Cover• How Olivia navigated three pregnancies and three promotions• Why support networks are essential for working parents• The concept of work-life integration instead of work-life balance• How resilience helps leaders navigate pressure and setbacks• Why building a career is a long game of trust and consistency• The mindset shift that helps high performers reframe challenges• Why leadership should be judged on merit, not gender• The importance of role modeling work ethic for the next generation• How fitness, routine, and discipline support long-term successKey Takeaways• Resilience is built through falling down and getting back up repeatedly.• Career growth and family life are not mutually exclusive.• A strong support network is essential to sustain high performance.• Work-life balance is often unrealistic; work-life integration is more practical.• Leadership should be measured by merit and contribution, not circumstance.• Showing children strong work ethic can be as powerful as being present.• Positive reframing helps leaders stay focused during difficult moments.• Success is a long-term game of consistency, trust, and dedication.Guest ResourcesOlivia Ngan – Sidley Austin Profile: https://www.sidley.com/en/people/n/ngan-oliviaOlivia Ngan on LinkedIn: https://hk.linkedin.com/in/olivia-ngan-b5281325Connect With Me🌍 Website: https://charlenegisele.com📸 Instagram: https://instagram.com/charlenegisele💼 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/charlène-gisèle-bourliout/✉️ Subscribe to my Life Less Burnt Out NewsletterIf this episode resonated with you, share it with someone navigating leadership, parenthood, and ambition at the same time.