Open Conversations with the Jesuit Forum

Open Conversations #2 (With Murray Pruden) February 6, 2026

Welcome to our second episode of ‘Open Conversations,’ a Jesuit Forum podcast series devoted to thought-and-prayer provoking reflections with people knowledgable and engaged upon the  social issues needing to be mindful of as faith rooted peoples.  In this episode, we will be speaking with Murray Pruden, Nehiyaw (Cree), from Treaty 6 Territory in northeastern central Alberta, from Goodfish Lake First Nations. Murray is the current director of Indigenous programming with Kairos Canada. It is through Kairos Canada that Murray and I met, through the Steering Committee, over 3 years ago now!  We will be in conversation on the important topic of allyship with Indigenous peoples and communities in the context of Rose LeMay’s well-regarded recent book, ‘Ally Is a Verb: A Guide to Reconciliation with Indigenous Peoples,’ published by Page Two Books. In a current review of ‘Ally Is a Verb,’ AnishinabekNews.ca [http://AnishinabekNews.ca]'s Karl Hele wrote:   “…being an ally is an action, one that requires educating oneself about Canada’s history and Indigenous history, it is about empathy,  it is about stepping forward and challenging racism, it is about showing up to support and walk behind Indigenous peoples, it is about living a life that seeks to create a better place in society for everyone, and so much more. Importantly, LeMay reminds people that being an ally involves actively supporting while stepping back.”   Through this both wise and practical resource of Rose LeMay’s Murray we will explore questions around Murray’s own personal experience with allyship as an Indigenous person in Canada, in the context of Truth and Reconciliation; how his relationships with allies in his life deepened in the aftermath of the news from Kamloops in the summer of 2020; the importance of personal and sustained relationship in being an ally, the capacity for vulnerability and risk as allys, the hope in young Indigenous people in entering into the truth and reconciliation process with allys in new and fresh ways, the importance of the Spirit and Creator in sustaining us in our allyship, and we even explore the idea of allyship in the context of the revelation of the writer Thomas King acknowledging he is not indigenous despite years of claiming to be.         Reflection Questions In the spirit of personal and communal discernment, as you listen to this conversation with Murray Pruden on the notion of ally is a verb, you may find it helpful to reflect upon the following questions, either personally, or in a group setting:  1. In this conversation with Murray, and/or in reading ‘Ally Is a Verb’ by Rose LaMay, what most resonated with you? 2. How have you given witness to vulnerability in your journey towards being an ally with Indigenous peoples? What moments have been most challenging for you? Why? What have you learned about yourself in these moments? 3. In your efforts towards allyship have you felt a connection with the Creator? Have you felt this journey of Allyship to be a spiritual, prayerful endeavour? How has the spirit animated your deepening relationships with Indigenous peoples? We hope you enjoy this conversation with Murray Pruden! * Note… our apologies for the quality of some of the audio. We are still in the process of learning in these early episodes :( Jesuit Forum for Social Faith and Justice 70 St. Mary Street Toronto, ON. Canada  M5S 1J3 (416) 927-7787 Website: https://jesuitforum.ca E-mail: info@jesuitforum.ca

Open Conversations #1 (With Dafer Kassis) January 25, 2026

For this first episode of ‘Open Conversations’ we will explore a richly provocative book by the Palestinian human rights lawyer and author, Raja Shehadeh, entitled ‘Palestinian Walks: Forays Into a Vanishing Landscape.’  Through his recounting of his intermittent walks over four decades Raja Shehadeh vividly and evocatively details the rich landscapes and geographic features of the central plateau of the West Bank around Ramallah, as well as how they have been tragically altered through rampant Israeli settlement construction, revealing the human and ecological consequences upon the fruitfulness, beauty, and sacredness of the land that generations have called home and who’s very identity have been shaped by it. Though published in 2008 this is a timeless story of a gradually vanishing landscape and its effects upon those who have called it home. This is a story of the material, psychological, spiritual, and ecological effects of the Israeli settlements upon the land of Palestine and its inhabitants. To help us better appreciate this social and ecological impact I have invited Dafer Kassis to join me in conversation. Dafer is a recent newcomer to Canada from Palestine who I met earlier this year at a Conference at St. Paul’s University in Ottawa focusing upon the silence of faith communities on the actions of the Israeli military in Gaza. Dafer is very much engaged with and articulate upon the many tragic realities Palestinian peoples face, particularly both in the West Bank and Gaza… just the person to help us engage more deeply with Raja Shehadeh’s own stories and experience growing up upon the land that is gradually being surrounded by gradual settlement constructions… one that Dafer himself knows fully well.    As we began our conversation Dafer reminded me… this conversation is going to get political. It’s not just a conversation on ecological effects. Our topic of conversation is truly one of integral ecology… how the political and ecological are intertwined.  If I may say a few words in anticipation of my conversation with Dafer, given its political nature in these politically and morally charged times … Though this coming conversation focuses upon the plight of Palestinians, the Jesuit Forum deeply respects Jewish voices, perspectives, fears, and their own humanity and aspirations for peace. Linda Grant wrote in the Guardian on the late Israeli author, Amos Oz, for instance, that he sought to cultivate friendships and alliances with those from the “other side”… while maintaining his deep love for Israel. She noted that the immigrant parents to Israel of Amos Oz’s generation after WWII were so haunted by genocide in Europe that they paid no attention to the population already there in Palestine. It was their children, Amos Oz’s generation, who worked for peace and questioned more the Zionist assumptions. Many Israelis’, such as Amos Oz, were cleared eyed about Israel's growing aspirations upon the West Bank and Gaza through illegal occupation… ‘how it gradually blinded Israelis to the humanity of millions of Palestinians… how it has made the oppression and humiliation of another people somehow acceptable.’ Amos Oz said in a N.Y. Times interview in 2019 shortly before he passed away: “Building settlements in occupied territories was the single most grave error and sin in the history of modern Zionism, because it was based on a refusal to accept the simple fact that we are not alone in this country.” (Jan. 4, 2019, Roger Cohen). Palestinian translator of Amos Oz’s works said, “Isn’t this inability to imagine the lives of the ‘other’ at the heart of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict?” (N.Y. Times, Ethan Bronner, March 2010). After October 7th political and social analyst Ezra Klein, on his podcast series, interviewed Rabbi Sharon Brous about the enduring conflict between Israel and the Palestinian peoples… a conversation he entitled ‘The Sermons I Needed to Hear Right Now.’ In this interview with Rabbi Brous he played a clip from a sermon of her forcefully saying on the plight of the Palestinian peoples: “We must tell the truth about what is happening, where we are, and how we got here. We must take a serious effort to set aside our cognitive biases and see what is truly before us, rather than what our implicit bias orients us toward…. 56 years of too many people allowing our own trauma and fear to justify the denial of basic rights, dignities, and dreams for millions of Palestinian people living under Israeli rule.” In this interview with Ezra Klein she said that Jewish peoples “have to fight against Jewish ideological extremism with as much passion and fervour as our grandparents  fought for the establishment of the state. We have to fight for Palestinian rights with as much passion and fervour as we fight for our own rights… how can we, who desperately cry out for the world to take Jewish suffering seriously, not also have our own hearts break when Palestinians are suffering?”  Reflection Questions In the spirit of personal and communal discernment, as you listen to my conversation with Dafer Kassis upon Raja Shehadeh’s ‘Palestinian Walks: Forays Into a Vanishing Landscape’ we invite you to reflect upon these following questions:  1. What most resonated with you in this conversation with Dafer? 2. From this conversation, in the context of Pope Francis’ sense of Integral Ecology as articulated in his encyclical ‘Laudato Si’, do you have a better sense of the ecological destruction taking place through settlement construction of the West Bank and Gaza? Do you have a better sense in how this ecological destruction is inevitably related to the disappearance of the Palestinian people's culture, livelihoods, and dignity? 3. Reflect upon the ecological beauty of the land you have called home, either in the past or presently. What has been its essential role in your own formation as a human being? How has it contributed towards your own sense of identity and relationship with God our Creator? What would be missing within yourself if you were forced and separated from it? We hope you enjoy and find fruitful this inaugural episode of ‘Open Conversations’. * Note... Apologies for the some of the audio quality. We are learning as we go! Jesuit Forum for Social Faith and Justice 70 St. Mary Street Toronto, ON. Canada  M5S 1J3 (416) 927-7787 Website: https://jesuitforum.ca E-mail: info@jesuitforum.ca